Stage plot w/IEM

[Panhandle Paul]

What's the best option here for me and FOH? My bass to wireless, to wireless receiver, to pre-amp, out of pre-amp to FOH, FOH sends FOH mix and my bass to my IEM transmitter, IEM transmitter to IEM receiver.
OR
Bass to wireless, to wireless receiver, to pre-amp, pre-amp out to FOH and into IEM transmitter, FOH sends back FOH mix to IEM trans mitter.
Thinking here two channel IEM system with blend control. Thanks in advance.

 

[RyanOh]

Get the bass input to the PA.

Get whatever mix you want in your ears. There's no need for a blend control, you tell them what you want in your mix.

 

[CWAnderson]

In my opinion, you are not wrong with either setup. It depends on FOH/IEM support. If you have good support, the first option works great. If support is lacking you will want some level of control, so option #2. Ideally you have your own IEM system for the band for full control and consistency. Ultimately, it take time, effort, and money.

 

[Wasnex]

If you have two channels, the approach will depend on your tone goals.

If you don't run effects or any sort of distortion, send the signal from the bass to FOH as early in the signal path as possible. Most likely: Bass -> Wireless -> FOH.

This gives FOH an unprocessed signal to work with, so the audio tech doesn't have to reverse engineer and undo what ever settings you use to get your mojo in your IEM mix. FYI, the optimum setting for mojo must be tailored to location and intended use. In other words, what works for you on stage may be very different than what is required for the house mix. Another advantage of taking the FOH signal off before your processing is it allows you to adjust your level and tone during the show without screwing up all of the other mixes.

The signal for the second channel will be reserved exclusively for your IEM mix. I.E This signal is not used for the house mix so you are free to do anything you want to it. The signal should be take off after your processing. The idea is you have controls at your finger tips that allows you to set your level and dial in your tone.

If you use an active bass, I suggest running the tone controls flat and dialing in your sound with your processing. During the show, if you want to tailor your sound to different songs, you can make minor tone changes using the bass's controls. However, don't get too heavy handed with these adjustments as they will not translate the same across all mixes. Also, if you apply too much boost you may wind up overloading the system and causing really nasty distortion or excessive compression. If aggressive adjustments are required, these should be tested and negotiated during sound check...starting with your line check. This should not be a surprise. Make sure the audio tech knows to expect this before gig day.

If you use effects, the optimum signal flow will be different and there are lots of options that will vary depending on the individual philosophies and goals of the player and audio tech. Optimum signal flow is also impacted by the capabilities and limitations of the gear. Since there is essentially an endless range of possibilities, your signal path should be discussed and worked out with the audio tech well in advance of gig day.

I highly discourage the idea of waiting till gig day to work things out. IMHO it's actually rude and unprofessional. On gig day, audio techs tend to have a wide variety of critical details to manage. Making sure the system works correctly is top priority, so there is a good chance the audio tech will not have the attention or patience to dedicate significant time to one person's artistic vision or how best to achieve it.

Essentially the audio tech's attitude towards you may reflect:

 

[Panhandle Paul]

If you have two channels, the approach will depend on your tone goals.

If you don't run effects or any sort of distortion, send the signal from the bass to FOH as early in the signal path as possible. Most likely: Bass -> Wireless -> FOH.

This gives FOH an unprocessed signal to work with, so the audio tech doesn't have to reverse engineer and undo what ever settings you use to get your mojo in your IEM mix. FYI, the optimum setting for mojo must be tailored to location and intended use. In other words, what works for you on stage may be very different than what is required for the house mix. Another advantage of taking the FOH signal off before your processing is it allows you to adjust your level and tone during the show without screwing up all of the other mixes.

The signal for the second channel will be reserved exclusively for your IEM mix. I.E This signal is not used for the house mix so you are free to do anything you want to it. The signal should be take off after your processing. The idea is you have controls at your finger tips that allows you to set your level and dial in your tone.

If you use an active bass, I suggest running the tone controls flat and dialing in your sound with your processing. During the show, if you want to tailor your sound to different songs, you can make minor tone changes using the bass's controls. However, don't get too heavy handed with these adjustments as they will not translate the same across all mixes. Also, if you apply too much boost you may wind up overloading the system and causing really nasty distortion or excessive compression. If aggressive adjustments are required, these should be tested and negotiated during sound check...starting with your line check. This should not be a surprise. Make sure the audio tech knows to expect this before gig day.

If you use effects, the optimum signal flow will be different and there are lots of options that will vary depending on the individual philosophies and goals of the player and audio tech. Optimum signal flow is also impacted by the capabilities and limitations of the gear. Since there is essentially an endless range of possibilities, your signal path should be discussed and worked out with the audio tech well in advance of gig day.

I highly discourage the idea of waiting till gig day to work things out. IMHO it's actually rude and unprofessional. On gig day, audio techs tend to have a wide variety of critical details to manage. Making sure the system works correctly is top priority, so there is a good chance the audio tech will not have the attention or patience to dedicate significant time to one person's artistic vision or how best to achieve it.

Essentially the audio tech's attitude towards you may reflect:
View attachment 5488521

Thank you! Lots of good information. My experience in getting in contact with the FOH engineer, before the gig, hasn't usually been fruitful. From Me, to Band Leader, Band Manager, Agent, Venue person, et al to FOH is like asking to speak to God.

 

[Mike Caldwell]

Thank you! Lots of good information. My experience in getting in contact with the FOH engineer, before the gig, hasn't usually been fruitful. From Me, to Band Leader, Band Manager, Agent, Venue person, et al to FOH is like asking to speak to God.

That unfortunate! I like as much info as possible ahead of time.
I just advanced three shows in the last two days talking to key members involved with each event.

If you do get in contact with a shows sound provider chances are there using a digital mixer, ask if there's a monitor mix APP available that would allow you to mix your IEM mix.

 

[s0c9]

That unfortunate! I like as much info as possible ahead of time.
I just advanced three shows in the last two days talking to key members involved with each event.

If you do get in contact with a shows sound provider chances are there using a digital mixer, ask if there's a monitor mix APP available that would allow you to mix your IEM mix.

I'm the same way - had a fly date w/ band from CA whom we had numerous calls with to determine their needs...

But - to the OP..
Be prepared...
Many bands (including the 4 I'm in) bring their own IEM mixers and either have splitters in the rack or externally, to be able to GET signal from House stage box, or to PUT signal into the House stage box.
It avoids the need for FOH mixing monitors as well as FOH. When I'm running FOH, it sure makes my life easier - vs trying to comprehend hand signals mid-song to being given directions over the PA!

When playing, I'm basically "bass to wireless, to wireless receiver, to pre-amp, out of pre-amp to FOH, FOH sends FOH mix and my bass to my IEM transmitter, IEM transmitter to IEM receiver."
You can replace FOH (in the above statement) with either a split TO or from the House - depending on venue. The simple but beautiful part is that IEM mix from gig to gig is almost identical and sound check takes < 5 mins.

My gigs this weekend will have X32 Rack - Bass (wireless -> pedalboard DI) and vocals go to splitter in the rack. One side of splitter goes to X32R with the other going to house box (Midas DL32). My IEM is mixed on X32R and output buss feeds my IEM transmitter. 3 cables.
FOH does FOH.

 

[Bufalo]

I carry an IEM rack for my band to our gigs. I have a DI box on my pedal board that I use just to send signal to our IEM rack, and I let the house sound take from their own DI or out the back of the stage amp, be it a house amp, or my own that I brought. It's an easy way to always ensure that I've got sound to my rack without having to ever interfere with what the house needs. The DI is last in the signal chain, so it's getting the same signal that is going to the stage amp and in-turn the house.