• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Staining Alder ???

ledyard

ledyard

Jan 31, 2010
1,655
46
Upstate NY
www.elephant-mountain.com
#1
If you have read my other threads you know I am going back and forth between staining and painting my P bass body.
I thought I was set on paint over stain until I found some pics here on TB of a beat up brown stain job that just looks awsome.

Heres my questions yet again...(last time guys I promise:hiding:)

1) stain the bare wood once its fine sanded or use oil based grain filler?

2) Want to nitro clear coat it. If I stain I will want to use reranch's clear satin wood nitro that gives a flat look and a satin natural feel. How do I know it will work with what stain?
Reranch says not all "hardware store stains" are compatible with their nitro???
I emailed bill at reranch and he said not to use an oil based stain with it but to use a water or solvent based dye. Are these available without ordering? suggestions on brands?

3) Any other steps in stain process other than this? Going for a finish that looks 30 yrs old so shiny and pristine isnt required.
 
#2
just curious ... have you ever stained Alder on a practice piece before? I did, and the results were blotchy and inconsistent at best. my Alder staing results were on par with experiments in staining American Cherry - icky

my recommendation: after you shoot a clear primer coat and level it, shoot tinted clear until you have the right depth of color, then shoot clear gloss over that to build depth. level the clear being careful not to sand into the color coats, and then buff to glossy bliss

all the best,

R
 
#3
^^^ What Rodent said, but with satin, and no buffing, rather wetsand to 1500, wax and call it old. ;) Everything else Rodent said is absolutely correct about. As for the dyes, you can buy analine dyes from any major hobby retailer(hobby lobby, Michaels, ben Franklin etc)
 
#4
Thanks guys.

I do however have one slight issue...:mad:....I was noticing the top was a bit lighter and less figured than the back side but i just shrugged it off and kept sanding away. once the sides, back and front were done all that was/is left are the rounded edges on the outside of the body. So as I sand the clear away and the laminant top remnants I notice a seam. So....the top was lighter because its freakin maple top. So even though the "foto flame" was a laminant, the top really is maple. I dont mind this for tone and any other reason.....but now this is going to present me with a new set of issues for finishing is it not? Whether I still wanted to stain or use tinted clear? Maple does not stain well at all IIRC in my reading.
So I'm thinking I might just need to suck it up and paint now?

Regardless of stain or paint I decided on Reranch's clear wood satin nitro clear coat to give the flat finish and satin feel.
 
#5
Musiclogic said:
^^^ What Rodent said, but with satin, and no buffing, rather wetsand to 1500, wax and call it old. ;) Everything else Rodent said is absolutely correct about. As for the dyes, you can buy analine dyes from any major hobby retailer(hobby lobby, Michaels, ben Franklin etc)
Click to expand...

Are you eluding that using a dye as you mentioned would work better than a stain? or just that I can buy them where you suggested if I want to use them?
 
#8
Down to the bare wood all around. The bottom horn was such a PAIN!!!! But its all off and all 100 grit sanded now.
Today and tomorrow I will be 130 and 220 sanding. I have a few deeper sanding marks where I got impatient and used power tools (nothing major...relax....no body deformaties). Then I will be 320 sanding pre dying. After that I am going to try the denatured alcohol and rough cloth thing I saw on youtube to get all the really fine soft fibers off.
By the time I am done with that tuesday or wednesday my reranch package will be in. Went with tobbacco brown alcohol based dye and clear wood satin nitro clear. The dye will be shot with a preval unit instead of wiping on. If I wipe it on i know I'll end up with streaks that i wont be able to blend so i'm spraying. I have taken a bunch of pics and will do a bunch more since its my first attempt at this.

The only thing that i hated the whole time was getting the clear coat off. While it wasnt as thick as I thought it was it was still an awful poly clear that was very difficult to get off the harder to reach spots. I can imagine how much nicer a nitro finish would be to strip/sand off.
 
#9
I had quite good luck staining alder -- this is a Warmoth J-bass stained with General Finishes orange water-base dye stain and Tru-oil on top.

[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

I got some advice on the Warmoth forum to lightly dampen the surface of the wood before staining it, then knock down the fuzzy bits that raised up with sandpaper, but that was applying a water-based product -- alcohol-based doesn't seem to raise the grain as much. My first coat was kind of uneven, so I sanded back not all the way to bare wood -- the second coat went on much better. A friend whose done a lot of guitar building suggested the first coat may have acted as something of a sealer. Anyway, I wiped this on with some cotton t-shirt material and tried always to maintain a wet edge. I used the same stain on an alder Jazzmaster later on that got a Target water-base lacquer top coat and looks great. Looking forward to seeing your results (and I hear you about sanding the insides of the horns -- a pain even when there is no finish to remove).
 
#10
silentk said:
I had quite good luck staining alder -- this is a Warmoth J-bass stained with General Finishes orange water-base dye stain and Tru-oil on top.

[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

I got some advice on the Warmoth forum to lightly dampen the surface of the wood before staining it, then knock down the fuzzy bits that raised up with sandpaper, but that was applying a water-based product -- alcohol-based doesn't seem to raise the grain as much. My first coat was kind of uneven, so I sanded back not all the way to bare wood -- the second coat went on much better. A friend whose done a lot of guitar building suggested the first coat may have acted as something of a sealer. Anyway, I wiped this on with some cotton t-shirt material and tried always to maintain a wet edge. I used the same stain on an alder Jazzmaster later on that got a Target water-base lacquer top coat and looks great. Looking forward to seeing your results (and I hear you about sanding the insides of the horns -- a pain even when there is no finish to remove).
Click to expand...

That looks awesome. I'm going for something a lot more whipped on looking. Not an intentional relic, but if it looks 30 years played then ill be ok with it.

There's a YouTube video I mentioned. Going to try it. After all sanding just prior to staining they took denatured alcohol and rubbed it on cross grain. It swelled and raised any remaining soft fibers. Then they went in the same direction with a coarse cloth and removed all the fibers.
I was going to go water based myself but there were no browns in water base.
 
#11
So.....my tobacco brown stain......turned black. It was mixed properly ect ect.....applied with a cotton cloth as suggested...ect ect....It went on a beautiful brown but soaks in and turns black. The layer dries I put on more, it does the same thing. Wet, it looks great but as soon as it dries for a few seconds it goes black. Super.....so now I have a matte black bass.
I'm just going to paint it either brown or black and be done with it.
 
#12
Did you use an oil stain? If so did you wipe it on and let it sit until dry? Using oil stain you should just wipe it on let it soak in for a few minuets and wipe it off.
 
#14
Minwax Pre-Stain Wood Conditioner first...then I hit this alder strat body with Ebony stain and immediately wiped it off...sanded, repeated that a few more times, so the grain would get saturated, but the surface sanded clear again. Then use whatever stain you want for the body (I used walnut). Check it...the grain popped so much it almost looks like ash.
398130731.gif
 
#15
Since it turned black i said screw it and went with paint in the antique leather brown color i wanted to begin with.
Shot a few coats, sanded, sand and sealer final coat was sprayed last night. Going to fine sand the sand and sealer today and start shooting color. Im very happy with the way the brown covered the black and how the sand and seal filled everything in.
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back