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Sunn Tube Amp. Which one.
- Thread starter altamont
- Start date
How much is he asking for it, and what kind of condition is it in? The OP (or other TB'ers) might be interested.
EDIT: Oops. DMN beat me to it!
Here is a consideration no one here has touched on so I will. All Sunn amps are old. You should expect some maintenance. Capacitors dry out regardless of use and may need replacing. Resistors drift. Potentiometers get scratchy. And tubes are really fragile. Some folks will argue "mine has lasted years" but all you gotta do is break a tube and inspect the elements and you'd have to say "yep, fragile".
With that said you should have a good tech cuz you'll eventually need one.
Me??? I grew up on Sunn. Yes right here in my back yard (Tualitan Or.). I love em and own several. Gigging I prefer 1000watts or more SS power. Tone is over rated. I've been accused of great tone with a washtub, stick and string (by musicians). I love the tone of an Ampeg flip top but that measley 50w just won't keep up (just my experience). I recommend at least 100 watt tube power. If your in doubt just look in the back and count power tubes (there will be at least four of them). Power tubes will be the biggest bottles back there.
Make your choice wisely but budget in the maintenance so your experience is positive.
YMMV
With that said you should have a good tech cuz you'll eventually need one.
Me??? I grew up on Sunn. Yes right here in my back yard (Tualitan Or.). I love em and own several. Gigging I prefer 1000watts or more SS power. Tone is over rated. I've been accused of great tone with a washtub, stick and string (by musicians). I love the tone of an Ampeg flip top but that measley 50w just won't keep up (just my experience). I recommend at least 100 watt tube power. If your in doubt just look in the back and count power tubes (there will be at least four of them). Power tubes will be the biggest bottles back there.
Make your choice wisely but budget in the maintenance so your experience is positive.
YMMV
Not sure about price, but I will find out. Honesty it's been a couple months since I've been by, but it's been there over two years. There cool people that run it (father and son), I bought my Skunkworks SVT from them. If it's still there I'll ask if they would considering shipping.
Actually I think this website has substantially more Sunn info;
Link Removed
I have both 2000S's and 200S's with the SDS board (which is sold by Triode) and without; stock OEM value filters. The SDS boards take the voltage to a safer 630V per section, but alter from the OEM filter spec of 30/20/20/20 to 60/60/60/60 uF and definitely changes the tonal characteristic of the old Sunns.
I like my gigging Sunns with SS rectifiers and stiffer filters but I think they sit better in a recording mix with tube rectifiers and stock values.
It's a personal preference; I'm pretty sure that JohnK has no use at all for a "fortified" vintage Sunn...
There is a happy medium though; there are can caps available that are rated 30/20/20/20 AND for 550+VDC.
It's a straight drop in for the OEM Mallory can, gets your voltage up to a safe levels and won't alter the tone of the amp.
Here's another interesting Sunn tidbit...
People who have experience with vintage Sunns often make reference to how loud/powerful they are for their rated output.
This is 100% true.
Now; before the watt is a watt is a watt "internet experts" get their neophyte panties all wadded up, I'll tell you why they are so loud.
It's not the "numbers" it's the method they used to rate them; stricter audiophile hi-fi amp standards rather than the more common liberal (or more correctly "non-existent") "bass amp" rating standards.
When someone who actually knows tube amps looks at a naked, unlabelled Sunn chassis, sees the tube configuration and the grapefruit-cantaloupe sized iron, and then is asked to guess how powerful the amp is, they will usually guess almost twice what the amp's factory rating is.
The "120 watt" 2000S was 120 watts minimum continuous between 20hz and 20,000hz, +/- 1 dB, at <.5% THD.
Not 5% or 10% THD @ 1K hz, not +/- 10, 6 or even 3 dB, not between 1K -2K; and not the most common practice of just claiming watts without any discussion at all about the testing parameters.
.5%/1dB/20-20K
Just for reference, that's about "3" on a 200S/2000S volume knob...
Mr. Foxen
Commercial User
No I am not the seller, I don't think I will ever sell my 2000s, or any of my other Sunns. I'm just on a constant search for good deals on other tube Sunns so I'm always watching ebay and craigslist for them.
This could equally apply to Pete Traynor's original tube offerings. The Hammond iron he specified were about twice the size of other folks products.
They had a Skunkworks SVT and now have a Sunn 2000S?? Sheesh!! Who ARE these people and where do they get their stuff???
Actually I think this website has substantially more Sunn info;
Link Removed
I have both 2000S's and 200S's with the SDS board (which is sold by Triode) and without; stock OEM value filters. The SDS boards take the voltage to a safer 630V per section, but alter from the OEM filter spec of 30/20/20/20 to 60/60/60/60 uF and definitely changes the tonal characteristic of the old Sunns.
I like my gigging Sunns with SS rectifiers and stiffer filters but I think they sit better in a recording mix with tube rectifiers and stock values.
It's a personal preference; I'm pretty sure that JohnK has no use at all for a "fortified" vintage Sunn...
There is a happy medium though; there are can caps available that are rated 30/20/20/20 AND for 550+VDC.
It's a straight drop in for the OEM Mallory can, gets your voltage up to a safe levels and won't alter the tone of the amp.
Here's another interesting Sunn tidbit...
People who have experience with vintage Sunns often make reference to how loud/powerful they are for their rated output.
This is 100% true.
Now; before the watt is a watt is a watt "internet experts" get their neophyte panties all wadded up, I'll tell you why they are so loud.
It's not the "numbers" it's the method they used to rate them; stricter audiophile hi-fi amp standards rather than the more common liberal (or more correctly "non-existent") "bass amp" rating standards.
When someone who actually knows tube amps looks at a naked, unlabelled Sunn chassis, sees the tube configuration and the grapefruit-cantaloupe sized iron, and then is asked to guess how powerful the amp is, they will usually guess almost twice what the amp's factory rating is.
The "120 watt" 2000S was 120 watts minimum continuous between 20hz and 20,000hz, +/- 1 dB, at <.5% THD.
Not 5% or 10% THD @ 1K hz, not +/- 10, 6 or even 3 dB, not between 1K -2K; and not the most common practice of just claiming watts without any discussion at all about the testing parameters.
.5%/1dB/20-20K
Just for reference, that's about "3" on a 200S/2000S volume knob...
The information contained in Ed's post is so good that I just felt the need to bump it for a repeat. Especially the last part where he talks about power ratings. IMO, this is the type of information that gives Talkbass such high value.
if you have an efficient 215 and a hi output bass the sunn 2000s is loud, if i remember the transformer is the size of a kid's lunchbox ,which i believe translates into major volume and heavy weight, i never had anybody tell me my head was quiet
Yeah, I think the 2000S is around 30 inches wide. I always wondered why Sunn made that amp head so dang wide. For what reason? Just to match the width of the cab it came with??
Just wondering. That's all.
Well he traded the 2000s a couple months ago to some dude up in KC for a Less Paul bass. Sorry if I got anyone's hopes up, but it's been there so long I stopped looking for it. I called him up to make sure he didn't have it at his house and he told me the story. Apparently it was a '68 with no master volume, which he said made it more rare? (don't know enough about these amps)
They used to have a shop out in L.A. years ago and moved to this area to work the Branson shows I guess. He told me Nikki Sixx used to own the Skunkworks amp I got off them (not why I bought it). But if I ever happen to meet him I'm going to ask if he ever owned it!
They used to have a shop out in L.A. years ago and moved to this area to work the Branson shows I guess. He told me Nikki Sixx used to own the Skunkworks amp I got off them (not why I bought it). But if I ever happen to meet him I'm going to ask if he ever owned it!
None of the 2000S models had a master volume, not from the factory anyway.
The early '68s didn't have a bass boost switch, that was added late '68 and stayed until they stopped building them.
The ones without the boost switch are indeed rare, I think some if not most of them actually had '67 build dates and were mostly built for "name" endorsers but I'm not 100% sure about that.
The early '68s didn't have a bass boost switch, that was added late '68 and stayed until they stopped building them.
The ones without the boost switch are indeed rare, I think some if not most of them actually had '67 build dates and were mostly built for "name" endorsers but I'm not 100% sure about that.
Mr. Foxen
Commercial User
Is it more eq, or more EQ knobs? Two EQ styles on those, one was Fender/Marshall style, not sure what the 2000s had but would suspect may well have more sweep than the Fender style.
Thanks Ed, I was hoping you'd post the rating information. It's always good to have the technical aspects clearly laid out.
Still, keeping on topic to the OP's statement, when playing with a loud drummer and a loud guitar player, I don't think the lower watt Sunns are going to be what you want. If you WANT raunchy overdriven bass, then they'll probably work out alright. I think the 2000s is a much safer bet if you can get your hands on one, as it will DEFINITELY be able to keep up, no worries there.
Yeah, they are 30" wide, which, while it might seem odd to bassists NOW, was really just standard then. 30" is sort of the standard width for guitar stack-style amps (Marshalls, Hiwatts, etc.), so at that point, the larger Sunn heads weren't really out of place. They just seem odd after SVT/8x10 25"ish form became so ubiquitous. Personally, I really like the look of the wider heads, at least when paired with the proper cabinet.
Still, keeping on topic to the OP's statement, when playing with a loud drummer and a loud guitar player, I don't think the lower watt Sunns are going to be what you want. If you WANT raunchy overdriven bass, then they'll probably work out alright. I think the 2000s is a much safer bet if you can get your hands on one, as it will DEFINITELY be able to keep up, no worries there.
Yeah, they are 30" wide, which, while it might seem odd to bassists NOW, was really just standard then. 30" is sort of the standard width for guitar stack-style amps (Marshalls, Hiwatts, etc.), so at that point, the larger Sunn heads weren't really out of place. They just seem odd after SVT/8x10 25"ish form became so ubiquitous. Personally, I really like the look of the wider heads, at least when paired with the proper cabinet.
The 200S works for me, but you'll probably want to go for the 2000S if you can find it.
I find that the 200S will keep up with the Sunn Beta Lead up to around the Lead's 4-5 volume (and at 1.5 the volume on that thing is worthy of earplugs), under somewhat similar circumstances to yours (although I do roll off the tone all the way, where yours sounds like full tone.)
I find that the 200S will keep up with the Sunn Beta Lead up to around the Lead's 4-5 volume (and at 1.5 the volume on that thing is worthy of earplugs), under somewhat similar circumstances to yours (although I do roll off the tone all the way, where yours sounds like full tone.)
