Tension and gauge

[Dirk Rockbottom]

I want to use roundwounds on my Fender Jazz, but herein lies the problem. When I use medium light gauge strings (40-100), the tension is lower, making fret buzz more likely. If I use higher tension medium gauge rounds (45-105), I have to adjust the height of the E and A higher than I would prefer due to the thicker strings in order to avoid fret buzz.
My question: Does there exist a set of medium light gauge roundwounds that have higher tension? I never had this problem when I used flat wounds on this particular base, but I prefer the sound of roundwounds on a Jazz bass when performing with a band. Thanks.

 

[michael_t]

My question: Does there exist a set of medium light gauge roundwounds that have higher tension?

What you really mean is "stiffness/flexibility". Stiffer strings in general allow a lower action without buzzing compared to more flexible ones.

What brand and type of strings are you using?

 

[Gorn]

Improving your technique will do more to eliminate fret buzz than any combination of gauges.

 

[micguy]

My question: Does there exist a set of medium light gauge roundwounds that have higher tension?

If you nail down a gauge and that they're rounds, you're going to have most sets come very close to each other in the tension department - the Physics basically dictates that. About the only thing you can do that would raise the tension is use much more dense metals, and....those metals are not magnetic, so.... practically speaking, tension and gauge are very intertwined.

 

[michael_t]

About the only thing you can do that would raise the tension is use much more dense metals, and....those metals are not magnetic, so.... practically speaking, tension and gauge are very intertwined.

Again, if the OP is concerned more about the stiffness/flexibility, which is related to buzzing issues, rather than the actual "tension" as in pulling weight, there is more than just the gauge to take into consideration.

For example, GHS Boomers 45-105 don't feel anything like DR Sunbeams 45-105 due to the difference in the TYPE (hex vs. round) and SIZE (thickness) of the core wire. Gauges alone don't tell the whole story.

 

[micguy]

Again, if the OP is more concerned more about the stiffness/flexibility, which is related to buzzing issues, rather than the actual "tension" as in pulling weight, there is more than just the gauge to take into consideration.

Yes, stiffness is different than tension.

 

[Dirk Rockbottom]

What you really mean is "stiffness/flexibility". Stiffer strings in general allow a lower action without buzzing compared to more flexible ones.

What brand and type of strings are you using?

I currently have GHS Boomers hex core medium gauge strings installed.

 

[Dirk Rockbottom]

Again, if the OP is concerned more about the stiffness/flexibility, which is related to buzzing issues, rather than the actual "tension" as in pulling weight, there is more than just the gauge to take into consideration.

For example, GHS Boomers 45-105 don't feel anything like DR Sunbeams 45-105 due to the difference in the TYPE (hex vs. round) and SIZE (thickness) of the core wire. Gauges alone don't tell the whole story.

I have found the hex core strings work better in my case. Have used DR Low Riders in the past, but wanted to give the boomers a try just to experiment. The boomers seem louder and more gnarly and gritty in general. But I've got the E and A set at 7/64". It's not my technique. All I do during my setup to test for buzz is simply fret the strings all the way up neck while gently plucking with my index finger.

 

[Dirk Rockbottom]

I have found the hex core strings work better in my case. Have used DR Low Riders in the past, but wanted to give the boomers a try just to experiment. The boomers seem louder and more gnarly and gritty in general. But I've got the E and A set at 7/64". It's not my technique. All I do during my setup to test for buzz is simply fret the strings all the way up neck while gently plucking with my index finger.

Just to clarify - by "work better" I mean that I like the higher tension of the hex cores. Hmmm... maybe I just answered my question. A set of medium light boomers might be just what the doctor ordered.

 

[JTE]

Are you adjusting the relief when you change strings? Without that, you will have different levels of fret rattle.

 

[Dirk Rockbottom]

Are you adjusting the relief when you change strings? Without that, you will have different levels of fret rattle.

Yes. I do a complete setup each time I change strings. Truss rod, string height, intonation.

 

[singlemalt]

The DR Pure Blues VW set is .040 and felt similar to TI jazz flats for tension...maybe just a tad stiffer. I really liked them. They are nickel not stainless.

 

[Dirk Rockbottom]

The DR Pure Blues VW set is .040 and felt similar to TI jazz flats for tension...maybe just a tad stiffer. I really liked them. They are nickel not stainless.

I tried them. A little too light for me. I still have them along with a set of mediums and medium lights. Been spending a lot on strings lately. I may give the medium lights another spin around the block. Thanks.

 

[Killing Floor]

There are some good charts showing string tensions and gauges but some brands don't report it.
Don't hesitate to try 3-4 different brands.

 

[Dirk Rockbottom]

There are some good charts showing string tensions and gauges but some brands don't report it.
Don't hesitate to try 3-4 different brands.

Good idea. I was actually wondering where I could find some charts like that. Disappointing not to see it listed on the back of the string packages. Thanks.

 

[michael_t]

Good idea. I was actually wondering where I could find some charts like that. Disappointing not to see it listed on the back of the string packages. Thanks.

GHS Tension Guide

 

[Dirk Rockbottom]

GHS Tension Guide

 

[BassFalcon]

Yes. I do a complete setup each time I change strings. Truss rod, string height, intonation.

It's my opinion, and it is just an opinion, that, barring technique deficiencies, your issue lies more in your setup. Choose whatever strings you prefer, whichever combo of flexibility, tone, tension, metallurgy, etc. you prefer and setup your bass to make them work at that height you prefer. There is much more to a setup than just truss rod, saddle height, and intonation, there is also neck angle and nut height and your frets if any are high or low, or if they don't have any fall off. The real magic in a setup is balancing all of those factors and optimizing them for the way YOU want to play your bass, not to standard factory specs. Those are a good place to start, they do the most good for the most people, but perhaps you are a bit more demanding in your needs. Maybe playing with more relief and neck angle will get you the string clearance you need to play they way you want with the strings you want. Maybe your E and A are cut too low in the nut, depending on the truss Rod that may or may not cause issues, it's a balancing act. It could also be that you have a fret or frets that need hammered or filed or maybe a full level, crown, and polish. I don't know, it's the internet, I don't know how you play or how your bass is currently setup, but I thought it may be helpful to offer a different perspective and opinion on your situation. Again, barring technique deficiencies (which are overcome by proper practice) I believe that your bass can be made to play the way you want with the strings you want. Maybe that's something you can do, maybe you need to find a bass specific luthier to help you get there, but it almost always can be done. However you choose to attack the problem, Best of luck! Hope it works out for you!

 

[Dirk Rockbottom]

It's my opinion, and it is just an opinion, that, barring technique deficiencies, your issue lies more in your setup. Choose whatever strings you prefer, whichever combo of flexibility, tone, tension, metallurgy, etc. you prefer and setup your bass to make them work at that height you prefer. There is much more to a setup than just truss rod, saddle height, and intonation, there is also neck angle and nut height and your frets if any are high or low, or if they don't have any fall off. The real magic in a setup is balancing all of those factors and optimizing them for the way YOU want to play your bass, not to standard factory specs. Those are a good place to start, they do the most good for the most people, but perhaps you are a bit more demanding in your needs. Maybe playing with more relief and neck angle will get you the string clearance you need to play they way you want with the strings you want. Maybe your E and A are cut too low in the nut, depending on the truss Rod that may or may not cause issues, it's a balancing act. It could also be that you have a fret or frets that need hammered or filed or maybe a full level, crown, and polish. I don't know, it's the internet, I don't know how you play or how your bass is currently setup, but I thought it may be helpful to offer a different perspective and opinion on your situation. Again, barring technique deficiencies (which are overcome by proper practice) I believe that your bass can be made to play the way you want with the strings you want. Maybe that's something you can do, maybe you need to find a bass specific luthier to help you get there, but it almost always can be done. However you choose to attack the problem, Best of luck! Hope it works out for you!

Well, the fret buzz is not technique related. (You're the second person to suggest that). I have played bass for ten years. I always check for buzzing after a setup by simply pressing on the frets all the way up on each string while plucking. I just got my bass back from a luthier who did some fret work and a setup but one of the strings still buzzed so I decided to change them. I guess I need to find a new luthier instead of trying to do everything myself. Thanks for your perspective.

 

[BassFalcon]

Well, the fret buzz is not technique related. (You're the second person to suggest that). I have played bass for ten years. I always check for buzzing after a setup by simply pressing on the frets all the way up on each string while plucking. I just got my bass back from a luthier who did some fret work and a setup but one of the strings still buzzed so I decided to change them. I guess I need to find a new luthier instead of trying to do everything myself. Thanks for your perspective.

No problem, glad I could help to at least get you thinking in more directions about it. Also, I meant no offense with the technique comments, just the downfall of Internet forums and the trouble with attempting long distance diagnosing, we don't know much about each other and the others experience, etc. I spent a while teaching electric and double bass and worked in and managed a repair shop during those same years, and in my experience with those two things technique is a common problem when discussing fret buzz and also the cheapest to solve, so it's always worth mentioning first and getting out of the way. There's a lot of bad info about setups out there but also a ton of good. Roger Sadowsky has excellent videos, you can learn tons from Dan Erlewine at Stew Mac. I prefer books and Jerzy Drozd, a polish luthier who lives in Spain has what I feel is the best bass setup book, and it's available as a pdf on his website for free and in English too. It goes very very in depth on the how and the why. Even has a section on dual truss rods. Besides all that, the best way to find out what works for you setup wise, if you have the time, is trial and error. Take very good measurements and write them down so you can always get it back to square 1, and just try stuff, keep measuring and writing down until you have it perfect. Keep in mind though that the full effect of a truss Rod adjustment may take a day or two.