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The Acoustic Club

#6,721
Anyone know exactly what speaker came stock in the 117 guitar combo? I just picked one up for a contemptuous-of-gear guitarist I’m playing with to use and also thinking it may be cool to pair with my 118 bass combo for going Rick-O-Sound with my old 4001. Being the OCD freak that I am, I’d love to pick up a stock spare speaker if I happen to come across one somewhere along the way.

The speaker code is 13 0077 137 7918, so I take it it’s not an Eminence even though it has the white dust cap? The basket and round magnet are both a bronze or gold color. @JacklegBass, as the resident ACC expert, do you know?
 
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#6,722
jj4001 said:
Anyone know exactly what speaker came stock in the 117 guitar combo? I just picked one up for a contemptuous-of-gear guitarist I’m playing with to use and also thinking it may be cool to pair with my 118 bass combo for going Rick-O-Sound with my old 4001. Being the OCD freak that I am, I’d love to pick up a stock spare speaker if I happen to come across one somewhere along the way.

The speaker code is 13 0077 137 7918, so I take it it’s not an Eminence even though it has the white dust cap? The basket and round magnet are both a bronze or gold color. @JacklegBass, as the resident ACC expert, do you know?
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That's certainly the original speaker, I've seen other 117s with the same numbers. The 137 indicates it was manufactured by CTS. Although Acoustic did primarily use Eminence, they often did use CTS as an alternate supplier.

For example, in the widely popular 130040 single 15" driver it was Eminence who made the 130040-A, 130040-B, and 130040-D versions while CTS made the 130040-C version. If I'm not mistaken this -C version was the first with a ceramic magnet, so whatever disruption and cost issues going on at the time with the alnico supply chain may have had something to do with changing suppliers. They reverted back to Eminence to supply the ceramic -D version.
 
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#6,723
JacklegBass said:
That's certainly the original speaker, I've seen other 117s with the same numbers. The 137 indicates it was manufactured by CTS. Although Acoustic did primarily use Eminence, they often did use CTS as an alternate supplier.

For example, in the widely popular 130040 single 15" driver it was Eminence who made the 130040-A, 130040-B, and 130040-D versions while CTS made the 130040-C version. If I'm not mistaken this -C version was the first with a ceramic magnet, so whatever disruption and cost issues going on at the time with the alnico supply chain may have had something to do with changing suppliers. They reverted back to Eminence to supply the ceramic -D version.
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Beautiful. Thanks, @JacklegBass. Now I know better what to keep an eye out for beyond just the white dust cap.

On an unrelated note, I’d love to find a 1x15” 404 cabinet at some point if anyone has a lead on one in the Southern New England area. Can’t swing it right now, but sometime soon. Unloaded would be even better if that saved me some money because I’ve got a 4ohm ACC driver, an E-140 and an Altec 421-8H I could throw in there. Now that I think of it, I’d trade the Altec for an unloaded 404 if anyone’s interested in that.
 
#6,724
Okay, so finally got the 117 home and had a chance to try it out a little bit. The thing is, I don’t own an electric guitar so unfortunately I’m kinda limited on putting it through its paces to see how healthy it is. I picked it up for a guitar player friend to use (and maybe also for my 4001 treble pickup if I ever do the Rick-O-Sound thing again). I’d like to have this thing working 100% to spec before having my friend try it out.

There’s a couple things that I’m not quite sure are in spec with this amp so I’m wondering if anyone here has any experience with the third gen late 70s/early 80s 100 series solid state guitar combo amps. More specifically, I’m interested in learning about the smaller models that don’t have the graphic EQ section, which I believe would be the 114, 115 and 117.

So anyway, first of all, this 117 gets pretty noisy with the “master volume” turned up, with the white noise increasing proportionally with the pot. Is this to be expected? My Acoustic bass amps are not noisy like this at all.

Second, the amp *seems* fairly quiet, but I can’t tell for sure yet. Is this because I’m trying to test an open back guitar combo with a bass? Does the physics of an open back cab significantly reduce the perceived loudness on tap with a bass guitar? I’m assuming so, but I’ve never really tried it before so I don’t have a reference point to compare it to. Another thing complicating this is that my next door neighbors are relentless about complaining to the condo association if they hear so much as the slightest peep of sound coming from any unit around them, so I’m quite limited in what I can get away with. My other Acoustic amps, including my 118 bass combo that shares an identical power amp to the 117 rattle the walls and can keep up with a drummer with the volume set between 9 and 11 o’clock. This 117 *seems* like it needs both the “volume” and “master volume” cranked well past noon to be able to do anything like that. But again, I’m pretty ill equipped to test this out at home. The good news is that the stock CTS speaker is very healthy. It stays clean and seems to easily handle bass guitar despite being a guitar speaker.

Which, by the way, brings me to a third issue. Isn’t the “volume”/“master volume” thing supposed to give distortion? Both knobs control volume, so in that sense they are working, but the amp stays crystal clean even with either of the two knobs dimed. I expected it to work like the 230 I used to use, where one of the knobs (I can’t remember which) dialed in distortion and volume while the other controlled output volume. Does the 117 just not work like the 230 in this regard? *Or* is it that I have the wrong footswitch? The 230 has a two button footswitch that engages both reverb and the master volume distortion. This 117 however, came to me with a generic-looking one button footswitch with 1/4” tip/sleeve jack that turns the reverb on and off. Is it supposed to instead have a two button footswitch with a tip/ring/sleeve jack to control both features? The thing making me unsure of all this is that if I remember correctly, when the 230’s master volume knob was disengaged by the footswitch it did nothing, leaving the volume knob simply controlling the amp’s loudness like on a 220. This 117 isn’t working that way. Another detail complicating things is that the 230 has indicator lights for each effect while the 117 does not. Indicator lights would be a clue of which type of footswitch is correct, but unfortunately the relatively budget 117 model doesn’t have them. It’s too bad my 230 footswitch has a different type of connector, otherwise I could test it out on this amp. C’est la vie…

Sorry for the super long and oddly specific post about an obscure ACC (guitar!) amp that no one here likely has ever used, but I had to try because Google hasn’t been much help in looking for answers. Hate to be high maintenance and summon our resident ACC expert once again, but perhaps @JacklegBass may know what I should be expecting from this amp? Anyway, cheers to everyone out there keeping these amps alive.
 
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#6,725
jj4001 said:
So anyway, first of all, this 117 gets pretty noisy with the “master volume” turned up, with the white noise increasing proportionally with the pot. Is this to be expected? My Acoustic bass amps are not noisy like this at all.....

....My other Acoustic amps, including my 118 bass combo that shares an identical power amp to the 117 rattle the walls and can keep up with a drummer with the volume set between 9 and 11 o’clock. This 117 *seems* like it needs both the “volume” and “master volume” cranked well past noon to be able to do anything like that.....

....Which, by the way, brings me to a third issue. Isn’t the “volume”/“master volume” thing supposed to give distortion? Both knobs control volume, so in that sense they are working, but the amp stays crystal clean even with either of the two knobs dimed. I expected it to work like the 230 I used to use, where one of the knobs (I can’t remember which) dialed in distortion and volume while the other controlled output volume. Does the 117 just not work like the 230 in this regard? *Or* is it that I have the wrong footswitch?
Click to expand...

The 117's preamp is identical to the 118's except for the added reverb and master volume tacked on at the end where the preamp output of the 118 stops. And as you've already said, they share the same power amp board. So in theory, with the master volume pot turned all the way up the 117 head should be putting out just as much signal with a similar noise floor as the 118 with matched volume pot levels. But with a different speaker & cabinet you can't make a direct volume level comparison. I don't recall if the physical dimensions are the same, but you could always swap 117 & 118 heads to compare using the same cabinet.

RE: distortion, the circuit layout of the 117 preamp is a little different than the 230, but I don't see anything of consequence that would explain not getting any distortion. The 117 has the same master volume diodes as the 230, so if you have the master volume turned way down and the regular volume turned way up you should be getting the same distortion as you would on the 230.

The 117 master volume is not switchable, so don't worry about the footswitch, sounds like what you have is fine. Only the reverb is switchable.
 
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#6,726
JacklegBass said:
The 117's preamp is identical to the 118's except for the added reverb and master volume tacked on at the end where the preamp output of the 118 stops. And as you've already said, they share the same power amp board. So in theory, with the master volume pot turned all the way up the 117 head should be putting out just as much signal with a similar noise floor as the 118 with matched volume pot levels. But with a different speaker & cabinet you can't make a direct volume level comparison. I don't recall if the physical dimensions are the same, but you could always swap 117 & 118 heads to compare using the same cabinet.

RE: distortion, the circuit layout of the 117 preamp is a little different than the 230, but I don't see anything of consequence that would explain not getting any distortion. The 117 has the same master volume diodes as the 230, so if you have the master volume turned way down and the regular volume turned way up you should be getting the same distortion as you would on the 230.

The 117 master volume is not switchable, so don't worry about the footswitch, sounds like what you have is fine. Only the reverb is switchable.
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Excellent. Super valuable information here which is much appreciated. Thanks again, @JacklegBass for helping me with this stuff over the years. Fortunately, the tech I take my amps to is a whiz with Acoustics and also really appreciates them as a longtime 370 user himself back in his playing days. Overall the amp does sound really good as is, but I’m gonna have him go through it to get all the little details back up to spec before really putting it to work.

I’m envisioning an all-Acoustic backline for a band I’ve been playing with; the 117 combo on guitar and the 118 combo on bass for small rooms, the 117 and 118 on guitar with a 320/402 on bass in medium rooms, and in the unlikely event we’d play large venues, a 230/402 on guitar with a 320/408 on bass. The guitar player in this group pretty much just has disdain for gear and is perfectly happy for me to set him up with amps so it could be a fun opportunity to put more of my Acoustic collection to work.

Speaking of… one more question for you, @JacklegBass: is it possible to chain, say, the 117 into the 118 by running a cable from either input 2 on the front or the “line out” jack on the back of the 117 and into the input of the 118? Would that damage either amp, or would it just be better to use an active ABY box to go into the front of each amp? Both the 117 and 118 have a line out but they don’t have a power amp in or effects return, which is the only way I’ve had experience chaining amps together in the past.
 
#6,727
jj4001 said:
Speaking of… one more question for you, @JacklegBass: is it possible to chain, say, the 117 into the 118 by running a cable from either input 2 on the front or the “line out” jack on the back of the 117 and into the input of the 118? Would that damage either amp, or would it just be better to use an active ABY box to go into the front of each amp? Both the 117 and 118 have a line out but they don’t have a power amp in or effects return, which is the only way I’ve had experience chaining amps together in the past.
Click to expand...

Sure, you could jumper from the second input jack of the 117 to the first jack of the 118 and it would work. Back in the day before ABY boxes were a thing that's how I ran dual 370/301 stacks. Of course you'd need to adjust the front panel controls of each amp independently, including adjusting the volume since the second amp would be receiving a slightly attenuated signal after running through the first amp's 18K & 47K input resistors. Nowadays a active ABY or some other device that wouldn't load down a passive instrument would be more elegant, but there's nothing to stop you from trying the patch cord just to see what you get.

I don't think I'd bother with the Line Out.... You might be able to get away driving the second amp's high level Input #2 from the first amp's Line Out, but it still might be too much. Besides, there appears to be a small difference between what you would get coming out of the Line Out jack between the 117 and 118 -- slightly different filtering which I suspect is a low end roll-off tweak.
 
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#6,728
JacklegBass said:
Sure, you could jumper from the second input jack of the 117 to the first jack of the 118 and it would work. Back in the day before ABY boxes were a thing that's how I ran dual 370/301 stacks. Of course you'd need to adjust the front panel controls of each amp independently, including adjusting the volume since the second amp would be receiving a slightly attenuated signal after running through the first amp's 18K & 47K input resistors. Nowadays a active ABY or some other device that wouldn't load down a passive instrument would be more elegant, but there's nothing to stop you from trying the patch cord just to see what you get.

I don't think I'd bother with the Line Out.... You might be able to get away driving the second amp's high level Input #2 from the first amp's Line Out, but it still might be too much. Besides, there appears to be a small difference between what you would get coming out of the Line Out jack between the 117 and 118 -- slightly different filtering which I suspect is a low end roll-off tweak.
Click to expand...
Ah, great. Used to bridge channels on Fender Bassmans back in the day and I’ve heard about doing the same with Acoustic 150s, but I just wanted to make sure it won’t damage anything before diving in with two separate amps. Kinda regret trading in a Radial Twin City ABY last Spring for a new bass. Probably shoulda held onto that thing.
 
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#6,729
Been awhile since I’ve posted, almost time to graduate College and I won’t be able to take my Acoustic Rigs with me. Prefer to sell to one of my fellow ACC lovers.
Won’t separate matching components but will separate rigs.
IMG_0435.jpeg

Email Me for any info [email protected]
Located in Southeast Alabama
 
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#6,733
I'm sure this is hiding somewhere, but can someone share the differences in the Variamp section of the 360?
Also, should the 361 always be on when it's plugged in? I'm trying to remember if there's an on/off switch inside the cab. It's been a long time since I've had one to play with.

Thanks!
 
#6,734
Been wanting to put together one of these mini Acoustic Rigs and finally today I have:

Mini Bass Rig.jpg


Now, I have to work on finding what I like soundwise. I know its loud enough for me. And I'm super stoked to be moving away from my 100lb cabinet. But of course now the fun part... dialing in the tone. :)
 
#6,735
Gabu said:
Been wanting to put together one of these mini Acoustic Rigs and finally today I have:

View attachment 7280512

Now, I have to work on finding what I like soundwise. I know its loud enough for me. And I'm super stoked to be moving away from my 100lb cabinet. But of course now the fun part... dialing in the tone. :)
Click to expand...
Hot take: Very happy.

It sounds great with both my P Bass and with my Ibanez ABG. Found a sound that I really liked and I suspect my Ampeg stuff is probably going to end up cooling its heels in my garage. Though I know this new Acoustic rig isn't related to and doesn't have the cool factor of the classic American made ones, I'm very happy with it.
 

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