The Four Most Influential Bassists?

[Dr. Cheese]

Jamerson / Dunn
Entwistle / Bruce
Graham / Clark
Pastorius / ?

Personally, I would match Clark with Jaco since both had a huge impact on the level of chops that one expected a top level bassist to have. Maybe I would put someone like Rocco Prestia or Bernard Edwards opposite of Larry Graham since they both showed how one could funk with the fingers, however, using that logic, maybe Jerry Jemmott, Tommy Cogbill, or Chuck Rainey, would be better examples of finger funk pioneers. That said, maybe Bootsy would be a better direct parallel to Graham as a funk pioneer.

 

[henry2513]

Jaco - redefined what was possible on Electric bass
Gary Willis - took what Jaco built to another level, invented the Ramp, which many bassist use, including people like Hadrien Feraud, Matt Garrison etc etc. Is a great teacher and composer
Larry Graham - Invented slap - enough said
James Jamerson

 

[tangentmusic]

Mine would be:

Squire
Geezer
Macca
Geddy

 

[etoncrow]

Personally, I would match Clark with Jaco since both had a huge impact on the level of chops that one expected a top level bassist to have. Maybe I would put someone like Rocco Prestia or Bernard Edwards opposite of Larry Graham since they both showed how one could funk with the fingers, however, using that logic, maybe Jerry Jemmott, Tommy Cogbill, or Chuck Rainey, would be better examples of finger funk pioneers. That said, maybe Bootsy would be a better direct parallel to Graham as a funk pioneer.

Doc, I was thinking along the same lines and did not know how to do it...there is definite overlap

 

[Jhengsman]

If he had done what Graham did before Graham he would've made my list. Again, this a list of four most influential bassists. Most Clarke fans had probably already been influenced by Graham plus a ton of others who didn't get into Graham. His early jaw dropping work was a direct subset of Graham IMO.

The way I see it Stanley Clarke greatness came because he doubled on electric and upright basses. He could swing with any one or hit the one and funk with anyone. And if he wanted to he probably could have toured with The Wailers.

In Stings 9/11 DVD Christian McBride explains how Sting influenced him because he played upright on a video. Stanley Clarke had no such moment with. His relatively limted pop sucess means he did not have as much influence for doubling, but he was one of those who brought funk techniques to jazz

 

[Lee Moses]

That is exactly how I feel. Personally, Stanley Clarke was a huge influence on me, but what he did was take a rich formal music education and Jazz gigging background and apply it to slapping the bass. He would have had monster chops regardless, but he would not have had his sound without Larry Graham.

Perhaps. But I think Stanley Clarke should unquestionably make any list of the ten most influential bassists. Because regardless of where he got it from (and everybody got most of what they got from somewhere), you can't find more than 6 or 7 electric bassists who have influenced more players and to a deeper level than Stanley has.

 

[SneakyT]

No offense... look at the title. While they may be 50% of your list...

Was this aimed at me? I mean really? I listed two of the most used session players ever and I get this? Wow homey.

 

[Brad Johnson]

The way I see it Stanley Clarke greatness came because he doubled on electric and upright basses. He could swing with any one or hit the one and funk with anyone. And if he wanted to he probably could have toured with The Wailers.

In Stings 9/11 DVD Christian McBride explains how Sting influenced him because he played upright on a video. Stanley Clarke had no such moment with. His relatively limted pop sucess means he did not have as much influence for doubling, but he was one of those who brought funk techniques to jazz

Speaking as a contemporary, Clarke's big impact came when he took Graham's technique to the next level. That's what put him on the map, not doubling IMO IME. And his hard plucking which mimiced thumping's percussive vibe added to that.

For those that remember, Stan Clarke was on an Aretha Franklin hit album back in the day. He did nice work on it but the standout was Chuck Rainey, especially on the Stevie Wonder track "'Til You Come Back To Me". Classic Rainey and his influence (Jamerson) is pretty obvious.

As great as Clarke is and as big of a fan of his that I was back in the day, I never felt like he could swing with anyone or funk with anyone. I don't know of anyone who could do both. Most fall short one way or the other IMO.

 

[Brad Johnson]

Was this aimed at me? I mean really? I listed two of the most used session players ever and I get this? Wow homey.

Yes it was. There's nothing absurd about no one not listing them on a short general list. Or a personal one for that matter yet. Besides, while one was heavily influenced by Jamerson, the other actually was Jamerson.


JUST KIDDING.


Why would anyone care who our biggest personal influences are? I expanded on this earlier.

"Homey"? You didn't get anything but a differing opinion.

 

[Brad Johnson]

Personally, I would match Clark with Jaco since both had a huge impact on the level of chops that one expected a top level bassist to have. Maybe I would put someone like Rocco Prestia or Bernard Edwards opposite of Larry Graham since they both showed how one could funk with the fingers, however, using that logic, maybe Jerry Jemmott, Tommy Cogbill, or Chuck Rainey, would be better examples of finger funk pioneers. That said, maybe Bootsy would be a better direct parallel to Graham as a funk pioneer.

Here's my take on this: the influence people gave up trying to emulate probably aren't as influential overall as others.

Take Rocco... IMO he's in a class by himself. Few if any have studied and been able to break down what he does. He was unconventional when he started and still. He probably influenced a few to quit playing.


Graham was not a finger funk guy. Bootsy was... and like Rocco, a lot of folks tried to cop his stuttering finger style feel and failed. Seems simple until you try to do it. If I weren't limited to four both of these would be on my personal list. Bootsy later incorporated Graham's technique and Hendrix's effects flair to become the Star.


Other than technical ability I never saw a correlation between Jaco and Clarke. He took a more melodic old school jazz approach to his soloing than Clarke. And his Chitlin' circuit side leaned heavily on guys like Jerry Jermott, Rocco and other R&B pioneers.

 

[Brad Johnson]

Sir Paul McCartney

-and-

Christopher Russell Edward Squire

If my list were longer Squire would definitely be on it. His early work was easily as jawdropping and groundbreaking as anything I've heard.

And anyone who remembers music before the Beatles knows how influential McCartney was... he made the instrument cool. Who did that before him? That's why he's on my list.

 

[Kmonk]

I mostly listen to rock so I won't comment on bassist from other genres but in my opinion:

Paul McCartney due to becoming such an integral part of the melody.

James Jamerson due to the impact Motown had and continues to have.

John Paul Jones due to Led Zeppelin's influence

Flea even though I am not a fan of slapping, there is no arguing that he is the reason that so many younger players are using that style.

 

[Dr. Cheese]

Here's my take on this: the influence people gave up trying to emulate probably aren't as influential overall as others.

Take Rocco... IMO he's in a class by himself. Few if any have studied and been able to break down what he does. He was unconventional when he started and still. He probably influenced a few to quit playing.


Graham was not a finger funk guy. Bootsy was... and like Rocco, a lot of folks tried to cop his stuttering finger style feel and failed. Seems simple until you try to do it. If I weren't limited to four both of these would be on my personal list. Bootsy later incorporated Graham's technique and Hendrix's effects flair to become the Star.


Other than technical ability I never saw a correlation between Jaco and Clarke. He took a more melodic old school jazz approach to his soloing than Clarke. And his Chitlin' circuit side leaned heavily on guys like Jerry Jermott, Rocco and other R&B pioneers.

I did not say that Graham played finger funk. I mentioned finger funk players alongside Graham to emphasize the fact that funk feels can be achieved with the thumb and fingers. Paul Jackson and Leon Sylvers III could have been mentioned also.

I thought I said the only correlation between Pastorius and Clarke was technical ability.

 

[Jhengsman]

Other than technical ability I never saw a correlation between Jaco and Clarke. He took a more melodic old school jazz approach to his soloing than Clarke. And his Chitlin' circuit side leaned heavily on guys like Jerry Jermott, Rocco and other R&B pioneers.

I thought I said the only correlation between Pastorius and Clarke was technical ability.

The correlation I made was that Jaco was Weather Report and Stanley was Return To Forever and if my record collection is the same as others those bands were the Beatles and Rolling Stones of their genre with the Grover Washington's and Ronnie Law's being on a more R&B side of the fusion universe.

It was because of their bands they remained linked today

 

[Milk]

while i wouldn't debate most of the people mentioned in here, I dont know if i should feel like an idiot or an iconoclast that no bassists mentioned in this thread so far has been an influence on me (well...to be fair, indirectly, some must have been..meaning, since they influenced bass playing in general)

 

[Dr. Cheese]

The correlation I made was that Jaco was Weather Report and Stanley was Return To Forever and if my record collection is the same as others those bands were the Beatles and Rolling Stones of their genre with the Grover Washington's and Ronnie Law's being on a more R&B side of the fusion universe.

It was because of their bands they remained linked today

Great point!

 

[sowilson]

And in the beginning there was Monk Montgomery who brought the electric bass to Jazz in 1951 with Lionel Hampton's orchestra and who later brought to us youngsters the Monk Montgomery Electric Bass Method.

 

[SoCal1]

And in the beginning there was Monk Montgomery who brought the electric bass to Jazz in 1951 with Lionel Hampton's orchestra and who later brought to us youngsters the Monk Montgomery Electric Bass Method.

And Bill Black was one of the very first bassists to use a fender bass on a significant R&R hit...Elvis' Jailhouse Rock...

 

[Brad Johnson]

I did not say that Graham played finger funk. I mentioned finger funk players alongside Graham to emphasize the fact that funk feels can be achieved with the thumb and fingers. Paul Jackson and Leon Sylvers III could have been mentioned also.

Everyone you just mentioned here had feels that bore no resemblence to Graham's. I didn't say you said Graham played finger funk... "I" said he wasn't one in response to your saying you'd put people opposite Graham.

I thought I said the only correlation between Pastorius and Clarke was technical ability.

So did I. I said other than that they had practically nothing in common stylistically. If ability trumps actual content...


Hey, we just disagree. That should be okay. Anyone is free to disagree with my choices too.

 

[Brad Johnson]

The correlation I made was that Jaco was Weather Report and Stanley was Return To Forever and if my record collection is the same as others those bands were the Beatles and Rolling Stones of their genre with the Grover Washington's and Ronnie Law's being on a more R&B side of the fusion universe.

It was because of their bands they remained linked today

Return to Forever predated Weather Report, particularly the Jaco period, by several years. And stylistically the two bassists had very little in common (if anything... I never found anything in common between the two, technical ability notwithstanding). Stylistically the two bands had next to nothing in common too. Two very different approaches. Early WR with Alphonso Johnson or Miroslav Vitous in the bass chair was far looser than the structured RTF lineups.

The Stones and Beatles co-existed.There was barely any overlap with RTF and Jaco-era WR. Again, I'm looking as someone who saw things going forward vs. looking back. I think that might make for a difference in perspective.

Neither Grover nor Ronnie Laws were fusion. They were pioneers of what became progressive and then smooth jazz... basically jazzy R&B. Fusion was about blending the energy of rock with jazz IMO IME. Enter the backbeat. Miles did fusion. So did Herbie, RTF, WR, etc.