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The hidden gem among 12AX7/ECC83 NOS tubes, the RFT ECC83

#63
beans-on-toast said:
JJ is pretty good these days. They had QC issues several years ago where the mica was not in contact with the bottle, also noise issues. EHX reached out to me about it to check my shipment, which was nice. Maybe they weren't supposed to go out the door.

Prices have gone up a lot. Just under $50 for a small signal tube. Granted that's list price.

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I get my JJs from eurotubes.com, I just checked their website, their preamp tubes are roughly half that price.
 
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#64
blr2 said:
Don't know what the prices are in the US, but here in the EU, you can get gold pins preamp JJs for 28-34 Euro a piece (33-40 USD). These are the most expensive small tubes they offer. Non gold-plated pins versions are cheaper.
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This is s more realistic current street price, around $20-25USD. I hope that the EXH prices are not what's to come.

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The gold pin 12AX7 that you referenced is $39USD.

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Purchase JJ ECC803-S / 12AX7 Gold preamp vacuum tubes in stock and ready to ship! Find reviews, data sheets and specs to upgrade your tube amplifier.
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#66
agedhorse said:
From a different perspective, I've seen nothing but good results with JJ preamp tubes, but we go through hundreds of thousands of tubes and we demand the best quality so maybe you are getting something different.
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My impression is you prefer JJ ECC83S because they have higher consistency and reliability. This does not necessarily mean the tube does not frequently manifest a personality in some circuits that some of us don't like . I assume the personality traits would not be a problem for you, as you would simply design around them or tune the circuit so the personality does not manifest.

I have pulled probably 5 or so ECC83S out of bass amps during tube rolling. I have also tried new ECC83S in a few additional bass amps with similar results. My perception is this tube tends to be mid rangy and create the perception of not playing very low or very high (limited band width). It also seems lower gain than other 12AX7s and often seems to manifest sort of a gritty texture. It's not necessarily bad, but it's sort of the opposite of what I usually want.

Some of my ECC83S pulls have found there way into a couple of my guitar amps, specifically an early 60s Vox AC30 with Top Boost and a mid 80s Marshall JCM 800 1959 Super Lead. The JJs were used to tame these amps a bit and reduce their tendency to produce ice-pick-in-the-ear at the volume I play at. If I were to use these amps as they were intended, I would probably pull the JJs out and install a Tung Sol 12AX7 or possibly something like a Shuguang 12AX7B.

I am sure I have a bunch of JJ ECC83S lurking in other bass amps that I am perfectly happy with. If I like the way an amp sounds, I leave it alone. My guess is my Genz Benz GBE1200 and ShuttleMax 12.2 have JJ ECC83S. Whatever they are running they sound very good to my ears, so I may never know.
 
#67
The Streamliners used JJ ECC83 stock in the V1 position because we liked the tone and it was also the lowest noise, lowest microphonics tune we found. We used a lot of Ruby Chinese tubes as well, screened for low noise and microphonics too.
 
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#68
Some people have compared the JJ ECC83S to the RFT ECC83 in terms of sound. I haven't done it myself, but several people stated that, although both tubes were warm sounding (in certain circuits) the RFT was superior. I have a brand new JJ ECC83S sitting here, so I may try it.
 
#69
blr2 said:
Some people have compared the JJ ECC83S to the RFT ECC83 in terms of sound. I haven't done it myself, but several people stated that, although both tubes were warm sounding (in certain circuits) the RFT was superior. I have a brand new JJ ECC83S sitting here, so I may try it.
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The sound of a tube can be heavy influenced by the circuit it's being used in too.
 
#70
I compared the RFT ECC83 against JJ ECC83S in V1 position of my Ampeg PF-20T. Not a big difference in sound, except the RFT produces noticeably better low end extension. I could probably match the sound just bumping the bass tone control a bit, but all else being equal, the NOS RFT sounds deeper. Didn't notice any gain change between the tubes, could have been some, but given the 5 or so minutes it takes to cool the tubes, roll, and restart made it difficult to notice small changes in gain. I'd say, probably (again in certain circuits) the JJ could be a good, cheap alternative to the RFT. For bass amps, the RFT is indeed superior, due to its better low end extension. Not a huge difference, but audible nevertheless.

Note: This is at home practice levels, which for me on the 20T, is master and gain at around 10 o'clock. My gut feeling is that if the amp is opened more, the differences may become more apparent.
 
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