FYI: Presonus just launched a small interface (PreSonus AudioBox Go 2x2 USB-C Audio Interface) that, if you don't need MIDI inputs, it's a reasonable price and comes with Studio One Artist included.
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Thinking about getting a DAW. Recommendations for a beginner?
- Thread starter mjcarp79
- Start date
FYI: Presonus just launched a small interface (PreSonus AudioBox Go 2x2 USB-C Audio Interface) that, if you don't need MIDI inputs, it's a reasonable price and comes with Studio One Artist included.
OK, that helps @mjcarp79 . There are a couple of ways to go.
1) You could get a simple recorder like a Zoom and just record yourself('ves) playing in the room. Pretty simple. You get the ideas down and itis pre-digitized for downloading and sharing.
Pros:
Pros:
1) You could get a simple recorder like a Zoom and just record yourself('ves) playing in the room. Pretty simple. You get the ideas down and itis pre-digitized for downloading and sharing.
Pros:
- Simple - no need for interface or a DAW really
- Very portable
- Cheap
- No need for mics
- No need for acoustic treatments (not really, though I suppose you could)
- You get what you get.
- No editing possible, really. Maybe you could import into a DAW a stereo recording and add reverb or delay or compress
- Cannot add to or subtract from later. These are pretty much single takes.
Pros:
- Fairly portable. You can set up and break it all down in minutes.
- You can multitrack to you heart's content.
- You can edit, punch in/out, fix things
- Plenty of tools to allow for a lot of creativity
- A two-track interface only means you can only input two analogue tracks simultaneously - which in your situation sounds fine
- You can add midi devices and controllers
- You can add virtual drummers, and other instruments (see EZDrummer for one)
- I don't know if you can really make a "radio-ready" recording, but you can really dazzle your friends and colleagues. You can really get excellent sounding material on a shoe-string budget.
- Loads and loads of free youtube video advice and lesson - you will need it
- The learning curve is STEEP and can be very frustrating - extremely frustrating and at times infuriating
- Too many toys and plug-ins. Sounds like a bonus, but they quickly get in the way and complicate things
- Beware the rabbit-hole syndrome (it is like GAS)
- Did I mention it can be pretty complex to operate? It may look simple, but really???
- Cost scales with capability. Your computer system and DAW (depending on version) may run out of gas if you start adding lots of tracks and plug-ins
- Quality improves as your space improves (this is a future problem not worth worrying about now)
- Bottom line - You will need to invest a lot of time if you want to get any good results
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I caution against using too much of the bundled "free" software included with most interfaces. These "lite" versions are usually hobbled in interesting ways and only after several weeks or months of learning do you realize you need the "full' package. Time is better spent learning a single DAW with full functionality IMO. I spent weeks with Ableton and my review is that it is much more for DJ'ing, EMU, looping, backing stuff for rap, or live stuff. Yes, it can record like a DAW, but at least for me, it was not intuitive and simple to record and edit tracks. Just me. Others have, of course, embraced it.
I chose to dig in and learn PTs and am happy I did (I am also happy I dug in during Covid and had lots of time). If you put a gun to my head and I had to switch I would also consider Reaper. Cakewalk is also something I'd look at.
***EDIT*** I am a Windows user. Apple people have other options that I did not ever consider.
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You are getting a lot of recommendations for Reaper and to watch some various tutorials. One thing I would note about Reaper compared to other DAWs you might inspect is that it doesn't come with much in the way of sound sources. i.e. synths and samplers. You may be using outboard stuff anyway so that is not a factor, but there are tons of free and some super amazing plugins. Especially on windows.
So if you go that route, or even another DAW other than Protools*, some places to look are
Bedroom Producer's Blog Home - though it is a bit oriented to electronic music, so many of the tools are the same. This is a good starting site for a shorter curated list of some of the best free stuff.
KVRAudio Invalid Link Removed This is more the list of all the plugins. You can though conveniently filter by type and price. There are over 1500 free synths or samplers there for Windows.
The third source, that is almost free, is to but an issue of Computer Music magazine and get the downloads.
*that still doesn't afaik support the most common Windows plugin format - though there may be work-a-rounds at this point..
Reaper has a good suite of effects, just not in the box sounds. But those sites also have effects if you need. With plugins, I would really start with free ones because there is such awesome quality. Many of these give you a taste for free and want you to upgrade to the the full version. However, many of the free versions are very usable. For example, many of the Computer Music synths will be a one oscillator synth, the paid version will have several and effects. eh.. I used many one oscillator synths in hardware form and didn't feel too limited.
Point is, lots of options to try before you buy, figure out your needs. I had an electronic duo for a while that used Ableton and 100% otherwise free and Comp. Music plugins. I didn't feel we were wanting for anything in quality.
So if you go that route, or even another DAW other than Protools*, some places to look are
Bedroom Producer's Blog Home - though it is a bit oriented to electronic music, so many of the tools are the same. This is a good starting site for a shorter curated list of some of the best free stuff.
KVRAudio Invalid Link Removed This is more the list of all the plugins. You can though conveniently filter by type and price. There are over 1500 free synths or samplers there for Windows.
The third source, that is almost free, is to but an issue of Computer Music magazine and get the downloads.
*that still doesn't afaik support the most common Windows plugin format - though there may be work-a-rounds at this point..
Reaper has a good suite of effects, just not in the box sounds. But those sites also have effects if you need. With plugins, I would really start with free ones because there is such awesome quality. Many of these give you a taste for free and want you to upgrade to the the full version. However, many of the free versions are very usable. For example, many of the Computer Music synths will be a one oscillator synth, the paid version will have several and effects. eh.. I used many one oscillator synths in hardware form and didn't feel too limited.
Point is, lots of options to try before you buy, figure out your needs. I had an electronic duo for a while that used Ableton and 100% otherwise free and Comp. Music plugins. I didn't feel we were wanting for anything in quality.
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I found this book really helpful... Goes over all the basic principles with explanations in layman's terms. You can find used versions priced pretty reasonabley- the price has gone up quite a bit since I purchased my copy.
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I just saw your $200 budget. In that case I'd very much recommend a Presonus interface with bundled StudioOne artist, or a steinberg with bundled CubaseLe (though, *for me*, I think I found CubaseLe too limited - only 2 fx buses? I liked it a lot though, and thought of getting the full version, then saw the $400 price tag, and went back to reaper 
).
If you decide to go behringer (I don't recommend it, but I'm no stranger to budget considerations) don't get the UM2. Unusably noisy preamps. UMC22 was much nicer. ASIO4ALL drivers are annoying.
).If you decide to go behringer (I don't recommend it, but I'm no stranger to budget considerations) don't get the UM2. Unusably noisy preamps. UMC22 was much nicer. ASIO4ALL drivers are annoying.
D
I would definitely not get a Behringer interface. They are cheap and may seem like excellent value but they're not. Practically anything else would be better. Rubbish products from a rubbish company IMO. Their latest classic ribbon-lookalike mics with a cheap condenser mic inside is a new low even from them, and that's saying something considering their track record!
I've given up on micing a cab for bass. I've always ended up going with a direct track. In saying that, I don't have high-end pre-amps and mics.... but neither will the OP.
8gig of ram should get you started but once you start adding extra tracks and then track EQ, reverb, tremolo etc, etc it might start to stutter. You only need to really worry about that when (if) it happens and then decide if you are doing enough recording to need to upgrade.
Yep... if you want to add vocals, acoustic guitar or other instruments you'll need something. Any vocal mic you may already have will suffice to start. If you want a condensor that is great bang for the buck the AT2020 will do what you need for quite some time and only $99 at Sweetwater.
Another beginner question/consideration:
A singer/songwriter/stringed instrument player I know is wanting me to add bass to some tracks soon. He records his material at home. The current idea if for me to go over to his house whenever there is a track ready for bass. Would it be possible, if I were to get a recording setup, for me to be able to record my part on my own setup? The idea of being able to record the bass at my own place, on my own time/schedule sounds really appealing.
I am probably not wording this well, but if that makes sense, is this possible, and if so, would that change my requirements for a DAW and interface?
A singer/songwriter/stringed instrument player I know is wanting me to add bass to some tracks soon. He records his material at home. The current idea if for me to go over to his house whenever there is a track ready for bass. Would it be possible, if I were to get a recording setup, for me to be able to record my part on my own setup? The idea of being able to record the bass at my own place, on my own time/schedule sounds really appealing.
I am probably not wording this well, but if that makes sense, is this possible, and if so, would that change my requirements for a DAW and interface?
yes, this was the main reason I got an interface and DAW. Band leader sends me songs he records and I can make a bass track to send back to him.
Someone else will need to list the needed requirements for sending tracks back and forth because I didn’t get there yet. Wav file with same bit rate and 1:1 start, I think.
Great book/ Unfortunately it needs a lot of updating. My copy has a copyright date of 2011, meaning it was actually written years prior. Almost everything in music has changed in the last 10 years.
Yes. I am trying to set this up with one of my guitarist collaborators. We both use PT, so in theory it will be quite functional. Sharing across different DAWs presents unique challenges, but can be done.
I think getting over the initial learning curve will help. You may want to consider getting on the same platform.
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It's pretty simple to do, actually. I've done it myself a few times. Just have the other person provide a WAV copy (hosting it on a repository such as Soundcloud is the best option) of the mixdown of their song. Import that into your DAW on one track, then create a new track for your bass part. After recording, mute the songwriter's mixdown, export your bass recording as a WAV and provide it to them. They can then line it up in their DAW. Voila!
Its called flying tracks or similar , there are certain things you must always have
1. Make sure you use the same sample rate
2. ALWAYS render ( consolidate ) to 0 / ZERO time
3. make sure the track you get starts at 0 / Zero time ( the type of track depends on both systems Mac uses AIF , PC uses WAV ) .
4. Most guys want a dry track ( no FX )
5. Use Google drive or ?? to upload the tracks to ( most wavs/aifs are 30 mb or so per track)
6. have FUN !!
I am sure I missed something
1. Make sure you use the same sample rate
2. ALWAYS render ( consolidate ) to 0 / ZERO time
3. make sure the track you get starts at 0 / Zero time ( the type of track depends on both systems Mac uses AIF , PC uses WAV ) .
4. Most guys want a dry track ( no FX )
5. Use Google drive or ?? to upload the tracks to ( most wavs/aifs are 30 mb or so per track)
6. have FUN !!
I am sure I missed something
Great book/ Unfortunately it needs a lot of updating. My copy has a copyright date of 2011, meaning it was actually written years prior. Almost everything in music has changed in the last 10 years.
I recently picked up the Dummies book. Not horrible. Let's face it, there is no Bible of modern DAW recording yet.
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Very true, nothing comprehensive at this time.
As far as individual DAW use goes, most have their own forums and a search of topics will usually quickly find an answer to the common questions. If using Reaper there is a VERY good complete user manual available as a free download in PDF form. The manual is throughly indexed and is easy to find answers to user questions.
Probably one of the best ways to learn the basics is simply doing a bunch of experimentation on your own. There is so much hardware (and DAW plug-ins...) out there that it would be extremely hard to write a book to cover all the bases for all users.
All of this varies by individual preferences for workflow, too. I prefer to do all basic recording on a stand alone recorder and later do the editing in front of a DAW. In my case nothing kills creativity faster than needing to be in front of my computer for the initial tracking process.
Going all the way back to the original post, I'd recommend a simple stand alone recorder to anyone wanting to experiment with "multi-tracking" so they can record easily and successfully. All you really need in addition to the recorder is a good set of headphones, and possibly a mic if there's acoustic instruments and/or vocals. Beyerdynamic DT 770 phones are my pick, but there are many choices. The DT 770s are a step up from what a lot of first time users purchase, but they are a great example of the "Buy right, buy once" philosophy.
The DAW is the next step in the process, and I consider audio capture and editing as two separate steps in the process.
Luckily, the first step is relatively easy, painless, and fairly low cost. This permits a new recordist to experiment and figure out how much they enjoy the process before diving into the much more perplexing "which computer, which DAW, which interface, and which powered monitors?" questions that follow.
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Okay, I downloaded Cakewalk today. (Looking to get an inexpensive interface ordered soon.) I am quite overwhelmed thus far. Like a farm kid from the pre-electricity days who has been plopped down in front of the control panel of a spaceship.
I have a few tracks (as audio files on my computer) that I will be adding bass parts to, and while I don't have an interface yet, I thought I would try try to load them into Cakewalk as a start. I can't even figure out how to do that.
Any recommendations on resources (YouTube tutorials, etc.) that can help a total beginner get started? Thanks!
I have a few tracks (as audio files on my computer) that I will be adding bass parts to, and while I don't have an interface yet, I thought I would try try to load them into Cakewalk as a start. I can't even figure out how to do that.
Any recommendations on resources (YouTube tutorials, etc.) that can help a total beginner get started? Thanks!
You've made the big step. I use Band Lab Cakewalk as my main DAW. But as you are seeing the interface is overwhelming (at first), and most of the full DAW apps are very similar. But... the concepts are the pretty similar across the spectrum of products. Part of the reason I suggested Audacity, I would compare the interface like a riding lawn mower control set in comparison to an airplane console. Audacity is limited but it will help you on the basic concepts to create a track, recording levels, and the basic setup with your audio driver. If your laptop has a built in mic and speakers (or earbuds / headphone) you can make your first tracks without an interface. It will be limited to the quality of the built in systems - but understanding the basics is the goal.
Cheers, it'll get better...
For Cakewalk, this guy's tutorials are great... Mike @ Creative Sauce
Cheers, it'll get better...
For Cakewalk, this guy's tutorials are great... Mike @ Creative Sauce
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As an FYI:
Some Behringer stuff is pretty poor, but some of their gear is quite good and the price can't be beat for building a home system (plus it has a warranty). I have a Behringer mixer that I've been using for about 7 years now, works great (studio and live). If you are on a budget and a beginner, higher end gear is not going to make a lot of difference until you get the basics down. My suggestion is to keep an open mind an do your homework before purchasing. You can get some great deals used, Reverb, Sweetwater Used Gear, etc... those sources are reputable and a lower risk than eBay. Purchasing gear from a vendor like Sweetwater will sometimes allow you upgrade within a reasonable window (so keep your boxes and packaging, I've traded gear in at about 30 days and received full credit).
Good luck...
I would definitely not get a Behringer interface. They are cheap and may seem like excellent value but they're not. Practically anything else would be better. Rubbish products from a rubbish company IMO. Their latest classic ribbon-lookalike mics with a cheap condenser mic inside is a new low even from them, and that's saying something considering their track record!
Some Behringer stuff is pretty poor, but some of their gear is quite good and the price can't be beat for building a home system (plus it has a warranty). I have a Behringer mixer that I've been using for about 7 years now, works great (studio and live). If you are on a budget and a beginner, higher end gear is not going to make a lot of difference until you get the basics down. My suggestion is to keep an open mind an do your homework before purchasing. You can get some great deals used, Reverb, Sweetwater Used Gear, etc... those sources are reputable and a lower risk than eBay. Purchasing gear from a vendor like Sweetwater will sometimes allow you upgrade within a reasonable window (so keep your boxes and packaging, I've traded gear in at about 30 days and received full credit).
Good luck...
Session tempos should match on both the host DAW, and the remote DAW. Depending on how the DAWs handle tempo at import can result in some weirdness, or be zero issue at all. Setting them up to match before importing files guarantees the best result.
Otherwise, you got everything I’d look for!
