Double Bass "Thomann" basses (Hora and Strunal) for a beginner?

[Nohrellas]

After some practice on an electric upright and finally finding a good teacher I'm now in the position where I should get my first proper upright bass. I am browsing my local classifieds for a good deal on a used instrument but no luck so far, so I'm looking into buying new. My teacher also told me that it's always fairly risky to buy used since hidden or hard to spot cracks can end up costing a lot to repair, so a new instrument seems like a good idea.

I've pretty much settled on a hybrid bass (except someone wants to convince me otherwise), so a fully carved top to get a better sound and a laminated, swelled back for stability. Ideally also laminated sides but I'll get to that.

The Thomann 22 series are made by Hora in Romania, The 2 series are made by Strunal in the Czech Republic. The differences boil down to:

Hora: + ebony fingerboard, + fully curved fingerboard, + quite a bit cheaper at 1000€ to 1100€, - solid sides
Strunal: + "prettier" (curly maple or fancy wood laminate for the back and sides), + laminated sides, - E string bevel on the fingerboard, - fingerboard is made from "blackwood" which is as far as I know pinewood that is engineered to be more dense and coloured black (I would assume it is compressed, filled with resin, etc. to achieve those goals), - more expensive at 1500€-1600€
I also heard that Strunal supposedly has better quality control/better quality in general but I don't know that for sure.

Now with that said I'm at a loss, neither of the 2 basses really does everything I want it to. As for buying a new bass locally, it seems like a ripoff. A local shop here in vienna is selling Strunal basses (which they don't mention but I asked and they confirmed it), the same model that Thomann sells for 1600€, at almost twice the price. I could at least test them out there and then order from Thomann, but it's obviously no guarantee that the instrument I'll get will be the same.

Also, what can I expect from the setup that Thomann does? I read that if you give them clear instructions like 8mm - 11mm from G to E at the end of the fingerboard then they'll do that properly, but if they mess up the nut height I'll still need to go to a luthier to get that fixed anyway. I'm not sure if the soundpost actually survives the shipping standing up (it is shipped without tension on the strings) and whether I can/should stand up the bridge and string it up myself.

Lastly, how much should be swapped out on those basses from the get-go? I read that the endpin "needs" to be replaced (how much of a need is that really?) on those cheaper basses and maybe the bridge and tailgut, tuning machines seem to be fine on them.

That post didn't come out as coherent as I hoped it would, but I'm happy for any kind of feedback and/or ideas. Thanks in advance.

 

[KUNGfuSHERIFF]

Strunal endpins are awful. I had one fail in the middle of a rehearsal. That made an awful noise.

If none of the options available to you are satisfactory, keep your money in your pocket.

 

[wathaet]

The difference between the price in vienna and Thomann may very well be due to a better setup from the viennese shop. I would always prefer buying a bass that you get to try first.

 

[Nohrellas]

Strunal endpins are awful. I had one fail in the middle of a rehearsal. That made an awful noise.

If none of the options available to you are satisfactory, keep your money in your pocket.

Thanks for the heads up, Thomann offers to change them out for a better endpin for free if you buy it in the same purchase, so that's an option. I suppose it is correct not to buy either one if they're not the right UB for me but I kinda need a bass to practice on.

The difference between the price in vienna and Thomann may very well be due to a better setup from the viennese shop. I would always prefer buying a bass that you get to try first.

Obviously yes, but paying 1600€ for a setup is ridiculous. I'd also like to buy the exact bass I can test but not at that price.

 

[Reiska]

Hi, either option is propably perfectly safe, but I would avoid beveled and " hardwood " fingerboards, and add a setup to the Thomann offerings ( That`s how Thomann basses were at least couple of years ago ). That`s propably at least +250€ to the original price. Nothing would suck more than starting the real thing with hard-to-play, poor setup. A couple of hundreds will take you a lot further if your bass has ebony fittings and is set up to your needs and liking, despite the looks of the laminate etc. All of us need a bass that fits, is capable of sounding like we wan`t it to, can be trustfully maintained and worked and then passed on to the next player if we ever wan`t to upgrade.

 

[Nohrellas]

Hi, either option is propably perfectly safe, but I would avoid beveled and " hardwood " fingerboards, and add a setup to the Thomann offerings ( That`s how Thomann basses were at least couple of years ago ). That`s propably at least +250€ to the original price. Nothing would suck more than starting the real thing with hard-to-play, poor setup. A couple of hundreds will take you a lot further if your bass has ebony fittings and is set up to your needs and liking, despite the looks of the laminate etc. All of us need a bass that fits, is capable of sounding like we wan`t it to, can be trustfully maintained and worked and then passed on to the next player if we ever wan`t to upgrade.

They claim that a setup is included in the purchase, I already sent them an email about a few things including that.
It's just weird to me that the Strunal, which is 500€ more, doesn't include a proper ebony fingerboard. They claim it's for environmental reasons but it does seem like a cost cutting method. The thing that scares me about the strunal are the solid sides, they do that because they're easier to bend than laminate sides but judging by a video from Upton bass I saw solid sides are really quite fragile, they even use laminate sides on their higher priced models.

 

[Fretless55]

I’ve had a Strunal 5/35 hybrid for the last five years and have been very happy with it after auditioning a few string choices before finding my preferred set.

Certainly the endpin is a weak link but can be easily upgraded.

In my experience Strunal is a good “value for money” option in its price range.
It may not be magic but mine at least has been a sturdy workhorse.

Good luck with your search.

 

[Martin Beer]

If they mean African Blackwood on the Strunal, that's a dense, fine grained hardwood that's typically used for woodwinds, in which case it may be a viable choice for a fingerboard.

 

[Reiska]

I`m interested in the Thomann setup policy too, as I`m looking for a backup ply bass and have read that Hora`s are at least reliable instruments. @HateyMcAmp ordered one a couple of years ago, if he has the time to chime in. I`m not an expert, but what you write about material of sides sounds very valid to me.

 

[Nohrellas]

If they mean African Blackwood on the Strunal, that's a dense, fine grained hardwood that's typically used for woodwinds, in which case it may be a viable choice for a fingerboard.

No, they mean an engineered wood material made from pine. They specify that on the basses where it's used .

 

[Nohrellas]

I’ve had a Strunal 5/35 hybrid for the last five years and have been very happy with it after auditioning a few string choices before finding my preferred set.

Certainly the endpin is a weak link but can be easily upgraded.

In my experience Strunal is a good “value for money” option in its price range.
It may not be magic but mine at least has been a sturdy workhorse.

Good luck with your search.

Thanks, the endpin isn't a huge deal to replace, I'm aware of that. Since your bass is 5+ years old I assume it was still made with an ebony fingerboard? A sturdy workhorse is more than enough for me, but the question is how much I'd still need to invest in it after already spending 1600€.
Strings will be an entirely different topic, I plan on sticking with the artino strings it comes with (budget spirocore-like strings from what I heard) and upgrade them to a proper set of spirocore weich if I like the sound with the stock strings.

I`m interested in the Thomann setup policy too, as I`m looking for a backup ply bass and have read that Hora`s are at least reliable instruments. @HateyMcAmp ordered one a couple of years ago, if he has the time to chime in. I`m not an expert, but what you write about material of sides sounds very valid to me.

I'll let you know when I get a reply from Thomann. Maybe I'm overthinking the whole solid vs laminated sides thing, but getting a hybrid bass for stability and low maintenance which then has pretty fragile solid sides as a weak link kinda bothers me.

 

[wathaet]

Obviously yes, but paying 1600€ for a setup is ridiculous. I'd also like to buy the exact bass I can test but not at that price.

Is it? I spent about that much on my backup bass for a bridge and good fingerboard. More than you want to spend clearly, but it is not ridiculous.

 

[Nohrellas]

Is it? I spent about that much on my backup bass for a bridge and good fingerboard. More than you want to spend clearly, but it is not ridiculous.

None of the information I have from the shop in Vienna points to the fact that they do any kind of major work on the bass, it still comes with the cheap placeholder strings from Strunal even. Fitting a bridge blank and a new fingerboard are pretty major jobs compared to adjusting an already fitted bridge and nut and maybe level the fingerboard, which is all they do as far as I can tell and definitely not worth 1600€. Let's take 100€ for an hour of work, that's 16 hours spent on a setup.

 

[wathaet]

If they have identical setups then ask if they will pricematch or meet halfway.

 

[Martin Beer]

No, they mean an engineered wood material made from pine. They specify that on the basses where it's used .

Hmm, I'd perhaps lean towards the Hora with the ebony board then. A good setup does a lot for any bass, and some luthiers may be reluctant to work on composite materials.

 

[HateyMcAmp]

I had a really low end 111E, and while I’m sure the 22 won’t need you to change the endpin or tailpiece or anything like that I would expect you’d want to make a trip to the luither for a setup which includes fingerboard planing and bridge shaping. The setup is really very basic, and not geared towards low string height or pizz playing. With the cost of setup / repair work in Europe I think these basses can be a bit of false economy. Getting that bass dialed in was a huge pain even if I saved some cash.

 

[Fretless55]

I do have to say (counterintuitively) l was lucky to be able to buy my 5/35 used. I got it from a guy who played it through his student years at the University of Oregon music program, so it was set up and maintained by the university. I can understand how there can be a leap of faith in buying a brand new in regard to initial set up.

It does have an enbony fingerboard, with a Romberg bevel, which some seem to have issue with but honestly doesn’t bother me either way. My other Kay necked bass has rosewood fingerboard with no bevel, and I have no problem switching between the two, but do prefer the ebony as a material.

As to strings I have Spirocore Weich EA over Innovation RAB DG, but a full set of Spiros is certainly a well respected choice.

 

[Harry Monkley]

Do some research on local luthiers - you will need to find someone you trust and can build an ongoing relationship with for maintenance in the long term. Often luthiers will have instruments for sale (sometimes on comission for local musicians, sometimes instruments that they have restored/repaired.

It also pays to ask around at local orchestras because there is always a chance that they will know of someone who has retired/died/upgraded/is about to downsize their home and has a surplus instrument for sale.

You are only 4 hours drive from Munich, so I would recommend that it might be worth a trip to try basses. Bassico stock a wide range including Duke ply basses (which are a truly professional quality instrument) if any of the music you are going to be playing requires amplification they are very easy to work with and most definately not limited to the rockabilly genre.

 

[Nohrellas]

I had a really low end 111E, and while I’m sure the 22 won’t need you to change the endpin or tailpiece or anything like that I would expect you’d want to make a trip to the luither for a setup which includes fingerboard planing and bridge shaping. The setup is really very basic, and not geared towards low string height or pizz playing. With the cost of setup / repair work in Europe I think these basses can be a bit of false economy. Getting that bass dialed in was a huge pain even if I saved some cash.

Thanks for the heads up on that, I'll still wait for the reply from thomann but if it really is just a very rudimentary setup I probably need to take it to a luthier anyway.

Do some research on local luthiers - you will need to find someone you trust and can build an ongoing relationship with for maintenance in the long term. Often luthiers will have instruments for sale (sometimes on comission for local musicians, sometimes instruments that they have restored/repaired.

It also pays to ask around at local orchestras because there is always a chance that they will know of someone who has retired/died/upgraded/is about to downsize their home and has a surplus instrument for sale.

You are only 4 hours drive from Munich, so I would recommend that it might be worth a trip to try basses. Bassico stock a wide range including Duke ply basses (which are a truly professional quality instrument) if any of the music you are going to be playing requires amplification they are very easy to work with and most definately not limited to the rockabilly genre.

My teacher recommended me a luthier here in Vienna, I can apparently rent an instrument from him for 50€ a month and if I want to buy it the accumulated rental fee is already counted towards the price of the instrument.
I just need to find out how much his basses are, if they're 2000+ for a hybrid it's outside of my pricerange. He's probably also the guy I'd go to with a Thomann bass for the proper setup and maybe swapping the endpin.

Thanks for all the replies so far, I had some fairly unpleasant experiences today testing out 3 used basses from local classifieds so I'll probably stick with buying new from thomann or used from local shops here.
Now the question remains whether I'm over thinking the whole solid sides vs laminated sides, because if that doesn't matter as much as I think I can probably safely buy the Hora hybrid bass.

 

[Ludwig]

The main difference in the bass price is the cost of workers in the different countries. Both Hora and Strunal build solid basses that will be good enough for several years playing. The hardwood fingerboard will be good for at least five years of playing with the bow or pizzicato, not sure about slapping. There is no special setup done by Thomann, just a basic setup (I am not sure, if they even do anything at all). You should replace the endpin, the strings and have a setup done for the kind of strings and playing you are planning to do.
I would go with the cheaper Hora bass and plan an upgrade to a really good bass five years in the future. Then keep the first bass as backup, for special kind of strings or outdoor...