(not trying to cause controversy but...)
To me Fender is:
The vanilla ice cream of the bass world
To me Fender is:
The vanilla ice cream of the bass world
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To Me, Fender Is.......
- Thread starter faulknersj
- Start date
That's cold (pun intended)
According to The Food Channel, vanilla is the most popular ice cream flavor by far.
Yes, it is Vanilla ice cream, and Apple pie, and Chevrolet, and Harley, and Jack Daniels
Everything basic, pure, and simple
It is the Mother of all basses - born from immaculate conception
The Bass to which all others owe their existence
The Bass to which all others owe homage
Bow Down Rocky Road, Mint Chocolate Chip, and Cherries Garcia!
Everything basic, pure, and simple
It is the Mother of all basses - born from immaculate conception
The Bass to which all others owe their existence
The Bass to which all others owe homage
Bow Down Rocky Road, Mint Chocolate Chip, and Cherries Garcia!
My Fender to me is just another bass. They are not special and I am not really motivated enough to get rid of them. I have 3 and over the years, 2 have been my main basses, but I just don't really care for them
Ya know, maybe it's just me, but I usually expect an instrument that costs "2-3x" as much as another instrument to be superior in quality. I expect my Sadowsky Metro to be superior to my MIA Fender because it cost over $1000 more. Isn't it funny how that works......
I think the point is that Fender has in large measure rested on their laurels and its main marketing theme is the brand's heritage which it beats to death. Others, like Lakland USA have taken Leo's orginal genius and moved the ball forward with better craftsmanship, more comfortable necks, better fretwork, and overall attention to detail to a level that I'm willing to lay down more money to get a "Fender copy" even though I own recent MIA Fender P & J basses. (Plus, I do like supporting smaller, independent companies who will pick up the phone when you call and who don't mind if you stop by the factory to get a set-up -- unlike Fender.)
Overall, I have a love-hate relationship with Fender. I do love its heritage and tradition, the fact that influences like John Paul Jones and Noel Redding used them on classic recordings (and just looked cool playing them on stage), and the fact that they are simply classic looking and fitting for almost any scenario...
BUT, I hate their spotty quality control, the heavy gloss they use on the back of their necks, and the way my hands always feel like their fighting with both the P & J's neck thickness and radius (nut width isn't everything!).
On the other hand, when I pick-up a Lakland USA Joe Osborn J Bass, or a Bob Glaub P Bass (with the Osborn 1.5 neck), all of these issues fall by the wayside. The necks are tapered and super-comfortable in depth and radius, there is no heavy gloss to slow me down, the fretboard woods are luxurious, and the fretwork is perfect. There is a reason that a number of "classic" Fender players including Duck Dunn, George Porter, Geezer Butler, Bob Glaub, Joe Osborn, Adam Clayton, and Bob Babitt either switched completely to Lakland or at least became heavy Lakland users.
So, while Fenders always have a classic coolness factor, and I grew up playing American Standard J Basses, to me they are now just second-rate due to playability issues and occassional lax quality control. There is no denying the heritage, but that's irrelevant to how my hands feel halfway through the second set.
Ya know, maybe it's just me, but I usually expect an instrument that costs "2-3x" as much as another instrument to be superior in quality. I expect my Sadowsky Metro to be superior to my MIA Fender because it cost over $1000 more. Isn't it funny how that works......
^ awesome Guy! Fender does have a Custom Shop that produces incredible Fenders comparable (or maybe better than) USA Laklands FYI.
Yea... that's just about right. You can do anything with vanilla. For specific needs, may really need to look elsewhere (perhaps). For for a Get-the-job-done 90% of the time a Fender will do it.
No, I don't think that's the point. I think many people try to compare instruments costing thousands of dollars difference and then say "look, A is better than B" like they are comparing two equally priced instruments. Look at your post. That's exactly what you are doing.
I also don't think Fender is "resting on their laurels." Rather, they are trying to hit a certain price point and are NOT trying to compete with instruments at twice the price. They have a custom shop for that, and those instruments compare quite nicely with those you listed above.
It has likely been a while since you checked out the New MIA Fenders because they have had thinner neck profiles with Satin (no more gloss) finishes on the back of the neck since 08". There have been vast improvements in Quality Control since 2008 and you can find a multitude of thread posts to back this up. I am lucky enough to have a shop nearby with tons of new Fenders and the QC is really on top of there game now imo.
Regarding Lakland converts, (I should disclose here that I had a Fender endorsement and appeared in some of thier annual catalogs) it is so hard to know if it is because they loved Laklands, or because Lakland enticed them with an offer to design and produce a 'signature model' in which the artist is paid a royalty on each bass sold. The endorsement game is not always as altruistic as one might think.
Regarding Adam Clayton...his latest signature bass is a Fender Custom Shop Offering...and is breath taking imo...see for yourself in this video demo:
Attachments
The Lakland /Clayton country jazz is sexier.
And it isn't a P, [ick]
-2 points for the oval bridge.
score: Lakland 8
Fender 2
And it isn't a P, [ick]
-2 points for the oval bridge.
score: Lakland 8
Fender 2
Clayton has at least three different signature basses going right now: Fender, Lakland and Warwick. Anyone buying a bass simply because of Clayton had better be rich.
Thanks for your comments. Despite my love for Lakland USA (and Music Man), I do own the new Am. Std. J and P 2010 and 2011 respectively. I do appreciate the improvements in QC and components (HMV bridge, lighter tuners, better fretwork, lighter body, nice case, etc.). I still find random QC issues. On the J, my control plate (metal plate by the knobs) did not sit flush with the pickguard. There was a gap. I ordered a new genuine Fender PG and that fixed the gap, but note how a lot of the control plates on the Am. Std. J extend width-wise beyond the PG. That's just poor fit and finish and I've seen it on a lot of the post 08 J basses. In addition, the back of my neck is definitely not "satin" although they call it that. It's a pretty heavy gloss and I've noticed that especially on the Sunburst versions for some reason. The necks on the USA Laklands just feel incredible compared to my (post-08) Am Std. J and P (even the Custom Shop Fenders seem to have a heavy gloss on the necks). Finally, despite the 1.5 nut width, the J bass really doesn't feel like a thin neck. The neck depth at the 1st and 12th frets is still pretty chunky in my opinion and compared to my Lakland USA Joe Osborn, it feels uncomfortable (I also prefer the thin vintage style frets on the JO).
My Fender P is a solid instrument with all the post-08 improvements. The QC issues were a loose volume knob on arrival and the occassional loosening of the input jack. In any event, the 1.625' width is too wide for me. A Lakland USA Glaub with the JO neck is the ideal P for me.
Look, a lot of this is a matter of preference of course. There would be no Lakland USA Osborns or Glaubs (or Duck Dunns) without the original Fenders. But, the question was, "To Me, Fender is..." and the answer for me is that they are the iconic original that have subsequently been made much more playable and to higher QC standards in every regard by Lakland USA. It's not everyone's gospel, but it's mine (and the aforementioned Fender bass legends who became Lakland players).
Isn't that the whole point? If they put your name on a product, you should get paid for it. I'm sure fender does the same thing.
^ THIS
Always thought of the Precision bass being a lot like a Ford Mustang;
You see them everywhere
They are kinda cool, but kinda tired out design
Come in all kinds of bold colors
They appeal to just about any crowd
Good products, but not the greatest
You can find parts for them everywhere
They are a whole lot of fun modify
You bought your first one secondhand...
And didn't care what happened to it because you were having too much fun
A tool that has made many alot of moolah!!! Including me
FunkRenegade...my point is that artists don't always endorse an instrument simply because it is their favorite. Often an endorsement is based on 'what is in it for them'. I don't blame them at all...my post was in response to another post.
First, there are no George Porter, Adam Clayton, Geezer Butler (though I've heard rumors), or Bob Babbit Lakland signature models.
Second, do you really think Lakland has enough money to entice any of these guys away from Fender to play something they didn't truly believe in? They actually play (or played, RIP) Laklands live -- they didn't just pose with them in ads. You're talking about many of the key faces of the Fender bass. Duck Dunn needed the few bucks he would make on the Skyline version of his bass? I think all of these guys have much more integrity than that and that Lakland couldn't afford to pay these guys much at all other than free basses whenever they need them. I've been to the Lakland factory in Chicago a number of times. Adam Clayton (or Darryl Jones for that matter) could probably buy Lakland (the whole company) 50x over with the money he makes from two tour dates.
I think they were just receiving superior instruments (and service) from Lakland.
Slight digression...
the foundation. All other electronic basses regardless were born out of the foundation of the P-bass.
I have had the same p-bass for 30 years, and the same j-bass for 10, and only infrequently GAS for other basses, until I go back home and see the two. Then I think, "Nah, I have all I need"
I have had the same p-bass for 30 years, and the same j-bass for 10, and only infrequently GAS for other basses, until I go back home and see the two. Then I think, "Nah, I have all I need"
Can you be more specific, I'm trying to understand what people mean when they say this. Tone comes from a variety of places, pickups, wood, etc. Do you find that the pickups vary from bass to bass or the wood or what? Like I said I have never noticed this in identical basses of the same model, finish and year.
You're going all over the place, and i don't know how that's relevant to my comment. I was strictly talking about artists with signature models. It's standard practice to get paid for lending out your name, and there's nothing wrong with that.
Regardless, I don't think the industry is as altruistic as you believe. I'm sure most of the artists can use an extra buck.
Regardless, I don't think the industry is as altruistic as you believe. I'm sure most of the artists can use an extra buck.
