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Tone from cabs with 8" drivers only?

iualum

iualum

Apr 9, 2004
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#1
Don't know why, but I'm drawn like a moth to a light by cabs outfitted w/8" speakers only, a mystique I guess. Have never heard one. And I'm not sure how to do a search for the topic here @TalkBass.

My primary interest is a 4x8 cabinet (maybe 2x8). Not interested in an 8x8.

Is it correct that a 115 has about the same surface area as a 4x8 (& a 110, maybe 112, about the same as a 2x8)? If so, loudness would be about the same? Generally, are 8" loaded boxes just higher-voiced, mid-range to upper mid-range rich cabs? Is it the voicing that's the main difference?
 
#3
The only difference attributed to driver size alone is the angle of dispersion. As you go higher in frequency smaller drivers are capable of a wider dispersion angle than larger drivers. All other differences in driver response are determined by factors other than size. That's why you can find some eights that go just as low as most eighteens, and some eighteens that go just as high as most eights.
BTW, while eights have a wider dispersion than larger drivers, when you put two eights side by side you squander that capability, getting no better dispersion from them than you do from a fifteen.
 
#4
billfitzmaurice said:
The only difference attributed to driver size alone is the angle of dispersion. As you go higher in frequency smaller drivers are capable of a wider dispersion angle than larger drivers. All other differences in driver response are determined by factors other than size. That's why you can find some eights that go just as low as most eighteens, and some eighteens that go just as high as most eights.
BTW, while eights have a wider dispersion than larger drivers, when you put two eights side by side you squander that capability, getting no better dispersion from them than you do from a fifteen.
Click to expand...

But Bill a vertically aligned 4x8 cab would look funny... =D
 
#7
There's also the weight issue. An 8 driver has a lower ratio of cone area to total weight than a larger driver built from the same materials. That's one reason why PJB cabs are heavy in relation to their volume.
 
#9
billfitzmaurice said:
The only difference attributed to driver size alone is the angle of dispersion. As you go higher in frequency smaller drivers are capable of a wider dispersion angle than larger drivers. All other differences in driver response are determined by factors other than size. That's why you can find some eights that go just as low as most eighteens, and some eighteens that go just as high as most eights.
BTW, while eights have a wider dispersion than larger drivers, when you put two eights side by side you squander that capability, getting no better dispersion from them than you do from a fifteen.
Click to expand...
So a 4x8 in a basically square box doesn't really make too terribly much sense on any front (tone, loudness, dispersion, weight, price). A vertical 4x8 would get added dispersion, but all the other non-advantages over other size speakers would remain. And it would only make sense to use with a small footprint amp.

Guessing that an alignment like 412s isn't much better? If not much better, then the 412 alignment is lacking also, right?

Will look into the 88 builds mentioned. Maybe makes more sense for smaller gig requirements.
 
#12
iualum said:
So a 4x8 in a basically square box doesn't really make too terribly much sense on any front (tone, loudness, dispersion, weight, price). A vertical 4x8 would get added dispersion, but all the other non-advantages over other size speakers would remain. And it would only make sense to use with a small footprint amp.

Guessing that an alignment like 412s isn't much better? If not much better, then the 412 alignment is lacking also, right?
.
Click to expand...
Right. There's no advantage to using a lot of small drivers unless it's in a line array configuration, and then the advantages gained are primarily of benefit for a PA cab, not electric bass. In the low end using a lot of smaller drivers doesn't work any better than a lesser number of larger drivers, and larger drivers are far more cost effective. In the high end smaller drivers give better dispersion, so that's where you use them, and you use a crossover so that the larger drivers work only in the low end, the smaller drivers only in the high end. This is not a new concept, it's how the best speaker systems have been done since circa 1927.
 
#13
One of the bands that plays a lot in Flagstaff has a bass cab with 8 x 8" config. It really sounds OK if you don't move. But if you get up and walk around the club, the sound level moves fluctuates quite a bit. It can be a little too loud in one spot, but you can step over about 10 feet and you can't even hear it. This is in clubs where a PA is only used for the vocals. If the bass were in the PA that would probably solve the issue.
 
#14
Blankandson said:
One of the bands that plays a lot in Flagstaff has a bass cab with 8 x 8" config. It really sounds OK if you don't move. But if you get up and walk around the club, the sound level moves fluctuates quite a bit. It can be a little too loud in one spot, but you can step over about 10 feet and you can't even hear it. This is in clubs where a PA is only used for the vocals. If the bass were in the PA that would probably solve the issue.
Click to expand...

That probably happens with most any bass cab in a typical club.
 
#15
iualum said:
Is it correct that a 115 has about the same surface area as a 4x8 (& a 110, maybe 112, about the same as a 2x8)?
Click to expand...
ConeArea.jpg
 
#19
Is not sound pressure a function of all three of excursion distance, surface area, and frequency?
I'm not a physicist but those smell like the relevant factors to me.

Most folks (including myself) believe that all else being equal, a 15" is louder than a 12" because there's "more paper". Is this wrong?
 
#20
Rockin Mike said:
Is not sound pressure a function of all three of excursion distance, surface area, and frequency?
I'm not a physicist but those smell like the relevant factors to me.

Most folks (including myself) believe that all else being equal, a 15" is louder than a 12" because there's "more paper". Is this wrong?
Click to expand...

If every other physical spec was with in tolerance, then that would be true. Not every physical spec can be exactly the same between any two drivers of different sizes. Thats not to say they cant be close, but bigger cone is more mass, which effects the other spec's impact. Drivers of different sizes can be designed to be very similar though.
 

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