Double Bass Unusual situation...Clarus/Wizzy success

[tornadobass]

Awhile back, I was asked to report back on gigs with the Clarus/Wizzy rig. Had an unusual situation at a gig last night and the rig worked great.

The setting: medium sized old church with two-story high ceilings, no furniture, all hard surfaces. This is the boomiest room in existence. Fairly full of people, all swing dancing.

The band: jump, swing, blues, r&b, with bass, guitar, drums and harmonica.

My gear: Clarus (series 3) with one Wizzy 12 cab, Azola Bugbass and G&L L-1000 doubling through a Boss A/B pedal.

Last gig there, I used a 410 cab with an SWR SM-400 amp...couldn't dial the boom out no matter what. This time, it was the Wizzy on a chair, with a line to the PA just in case (but not needed). EQ had mids and highs boosted somewhat, lows cut just a bit, high pass on, set at about 11 o'clock.

It was surprising that the little rig could carry the room. With the bottom thinned out, it was well defined and just loud enough. And the high pass filter kept the speaker from working too hard. Probably not what either AI or EA thought of for their gear, but it worked!

 

[seanm]

Nice! The wizzy is very loud for its size. I'm not surprised that the Clarus works well with the wizzy.

I wonder if putting the wizzy on a chair helped? Did you put the 410 on a chair?

The wizzy has a lot of *perceived* bass, but is actually a bit bass shy. Glad to hear it works well to tame such a boomy room.

 

[jimclark68]

Glad to hear the Wiz worked for you - I've had my standard Wizzy in some loud situations, and it never seems to come close to farting out.

 

[bolo]

I wonder if putting the wizzy on a chair helped? Did you put the 410 on a chair?

The wizzy has a lot of *perceived* bass, but is actually a bit bass shy. Glad to hear it works well to tame such a boomy room.

Hey tornader. I am also glad the Wizzy is working to your liking.

My experiences are similar to yours with the floor (de)coupling thing. IME, deciding whether or not to put the cab up on a chair, stool, or amp stand versus on the floor just depends on the room. In a setting like the one you described, yeah, definitely up off the floor.

I have also found that in many cases I like to position the cabinet right up against a back wall if possible, or even in a corner in certain settings. To me, this helps create more depth and fullness by reflecting off the walls behind it. Move the speaker out away from the wall, and things thin out.

Same goes for playing the bass unamped. A lot of sound comes out of the back of a DB, and you can use the wall(s) behind you to help reflect that back out into the room.

Nothing new here really. Just an affirmation.

P.S. I will be trying out a Wizzy + Wizzy M-line stack tonight (most likely with slab) at an outdoor gig in Durham, weather permitting. No walls or corners there. Now that will be new, for me at least.

 

[jimclark68]

Hey Steve, be sure to post a report from the gig, I'll be curious to hear about that combination. Where in Durham are you gigging?

 

[bolo]

Hey Jim. The gig is a (semi-?) private party at [Invalid or Expired Link Removed] in Durham.

The taproom looks nice. Too bad I don't drink ..... much ..... anymore, that is.

 

[seanm]

P.S. I will be trying out a Wizzy + Wizzy M-line stack tonight (most likely with slab) at an outdoor gig in Durham, weather permitting. No walls or corners there. Now that will be new, for me at least.

I would really like to hear how that works out. I gig with two wizzys, no m-line, at an outdoor gigs once a year. There is a clear tarp "wall" behind the amp.

These are low volume gigs. People in the audience can definitely hear the band, but they can still talk at a fairly normal volume. I have let other bass players use my rig and the bass came through fine over a surprisingly large area and with a wide dispersion.

 

[bolo]

The "classic" Wizzy + Wizzy M-line gig was rained out.

I will have another opportunity next Sat. night though. Indoor gig for the Triangle Swing Dance Society. It's in the Durham Armory building. Pretty big rectanglar shaped jobber, 'bout 2 1/2 stories tall, w/ a large raised wooden stage. We will have PA support, but I think I will try out the hybrid Wizzy stack just for grins. This gig will be on upright for sure.

 

[bribass]

The "classic" Wizzy + Wizzy M-line gig was rained out.

I will have another opportunity next Sat. night though. Indoor gig for the Triangle Swing Dance Society. It's in the Durham Armory building. Pretty big rectanglar shaped jobber, 'bout 2 1/2 stories tall, w/ a large raised wooden stage. We will have PA support, but I think I will try out the hybrid Wizzy stack just for grins. This gig will be on upright for sure.

Steve, How do you like your Wizzy M for DB and slab?

 

[drurb]

The wizzy has a lot of *perceived* bass, but is actually a bit bass shy.

Would you explain a bit more?

 

[seanm]

Would you explain a bit more?

I will try. I am not good at describing cabs so I will use a comparison.

I own a CXL-112 that I used to use for practices with a couple of different bands. So the bands where very used to how the CXL-112 sounded at practice.

I would consider the CXL-112 a fairly full range cab. If you play CDs through it they sound great. But I always found it a bit too modern sounding for me. Others might say too hi-fi. I was looking for a warmer, more vintage sound.

When I first brought the wizzy to practices, everybody commented on how much more bass it had in the sound. Even band members who *never* comment on the bass tone noticed. And if you had asked, I would have said it had more bass than the CXL-112. Nothing else changed, same amp (set flat), same basses, no effects.

But when I A/Bed the two at home, the CXL-112 definitely had a deeper bass sound. It wasn't a night and day difference, but noticable.

So after saying all that, I probably should have originally said that "the wizzy has a lot of perceived bass" and left it at that.

As an aside, I did "tame" the modern sound of the CXL-112 by pairing it with another, more vintage sounding cab. And the pairing of the wizzy and the CXL-112 works much better than you would expect.

 

[tornadobass]

Or in other words, the Wizzy has a low-mid hump while the M-line Wizzy or CXL-112 have a flatter response curve, yes?

 

[jgregpegleg]

Any A/B comparison between the m line and the standard wizzy? I may not have searched hard enough but I have not found a review of the mline.

I see a wizzy in my near future. I want a 1x12 for my Godin A4 fretless bass and my research on the DB and electric acoustic side has lead me to it.

Portability is tied for #1 with sound for me. I just wondered what the better stand alone cab may be.

I also am pointed towards an ai series 3 clarus 1 for the same reasons. From what I read, it should really work well with my bass BUT I am curious if anyone has used the ai/wizzy setup with a piezo pickup. I have read on here that there are some issues.

 

[seanm]

Or in other words, the Wizzy has a low-mid hump while the M-line Wizzy or CXL-112 have a flatter response curve, yes?

That sounds about right and is a lot more succinct. I warned that I was not good at describing cabs...

Hmmm, when I was using a Fishman Platinum Pro with a different cab, I used to give a small low-mid boost (200Hz). Maybe I was trying to mimic the wizzy?

And I mean a small boost; the low-mid can only boost by +6dB and I moved it up less than half a slider. Yet, to me, it made a noticeable difference in the sound.

 

[drurb]

That sounds about right and is a lot more succinct. I warned that I was not good at describing cabs...

Hmmm, when I was using a Fishman Platinum Pro with a different cab, I used to give a small low-mid boost (200Hz). Maybe I was trying to mimic the wizzy?

And I mean a small boost; the low-mid can only boost by +6dB and I moved it up less than half a slider. Yet, to me, it made a noticeable difference in the sound.

Actually, I suspected a number of possibilities for your description but thought it better to wait and hear your thoughts before suggesting some. From what you and others have posted, I suspect the following is true. The lack of a high-end response (which, personally, I don't need or want when I amplify DB) would lead to the perception of more "bass." Also, many listeners will associate the 60-120 Hz octave with "bass," which, indeed, it is. So a speaker cab can actually be lacking in the lowest octave and still be judged to have plenty of "bass." Often, when people hear a system that produces the lowest octave well, the reaction is, "Oh that's bass!"

FWIW, I use the Wizzy and am very happy with it. I think tornado is right in target with his description of the low-mid "hump." If you read EA's own description, they talk about it having a "warm" sound. That's the frequency region that would produce that.

 

[drurb]

...I am curious if anyone has used the ai/wizzy setup with a piezo pickup. I have read on here that there are some issues.

I use a Wizzy but not with the AI. One important issue with using a piezo pickup, especially with a ported design such as the Wizzy, is that the piezo can transduce infrasonics that will drive the cone crazy (not to mention stealing amplifier power). Infrasonics are no picnic for infinite baffle (no port) designs such as the AI cabs. The problem is effectively alleviated via the use of a high-pass filter (HPF), which the AI has.

I use the iamp200 with my Wizzy. It was modified slightly by EA to more effectively reject infrasonics and I use an outboard HPF on top of that.

 

[Michael Eisenman]

. . . I use the iamp200 with my Wizzy. It was modified slightly by AI . . .

Did you mean EA?

 

[jgregpegleg]

Thanks drurb.
I am in the process of selling gear to fund the ai/wizzy rig.
I read about the filter on the ai being adjusted to alleviate the piezo problem.
I have had no problems with ported cabs and the under bridge piezo pickup before. I am a mix of happy and paranoid to find information of a solution for a potential problem, if that makes sense.
Thank you all for this community and the endless threads on gear.

 

[drurb]

Did you mean EA?

Oops! Yeah, I'll edit it-- Thanks!

 

[bolo]

Steve, How do you like your Wizzy M for DB and slab?

bribass, thanks for asking. So far I like the M-line a whole lot. Of course I like my regular ol' Wizzy a whole lot too.

I have not tried the M-line w/ slab much except in my music room at home so far, but I have done a couple DB gigs with it.

To me, one of the first differences I noticed was the off-axis dispersion for the M-line. Smooth and full, maybe like in the low-mids especially. That said, I also still really like my original Wizzy in the form of the iAMP 200 C combo. There is something about the Euphonic Audio iAMP 200 head and the Wizzy cab paired together that I really like. Focused, but very warm. To me, the 200 watt Wizzy combo vs. the 800 watt Focus 2R + M-line are really quite close sonically, not miles apart like you might think just looking at the specs.

I am hesitant to launch into the usual spewing of descriptive adjectives and adverbs any more about my new gear at this point until I've spent more gig time with it. But at some point, I will attempt to compare and contrast the regular Wizzy and the M-line. They are both quite similar in many ways as you might imagine, and I really dig them both.