Double Bass Wan/Bernadel basses

[EvanGregor]

Hi everyone-
I took a really great lesson with Steve LaSpina and he owns and uses one these basses as you will see on the 'testimonials' section of the website. He spoke very, very highly about it and said he is using it on many gigs where he would have the option of using his carved French bass (so it seems like it deserves consideration beyond a road/backup bass, student bass etc. which to me a price like that implies...) - i mention this first because a player who plays / works on that kind of level using this bass regularly carries more weight than me saying i really dug it.. which i really did.

I ordered one right away after playing Steve's.. after saving for a long time to finally get a happening carved bass, i'm thrilled to have paid close to half of what i was expecting. Steve K from the bass cafe who ships the basses is a great guy and very informative.. he said that these basses are hand made and Mr. Wan, who had been studying in Europe and exposure to the Bernadel basses inspired him as they seemed a great (and underused) model. I picked mine up today with no problems and am blown away-- they offer a trial period which is great but i sent the flight case right back (which commited me to buying it) after taking it out and checking it at the shipment arrival center. I really can't believe what i'm hearing and feeling.. i'm certainly no expert in high end basses but have played/heard a number of peers' /teachers' at berklee with expensive carveds and it certainly seems right up there to me.. not feeling a 'pretty close considering what i paid', just love the thing. It sounded like word is catching on and they are handmade so there aren't a lot to spare-
hope this info helps

 

[Adrian Cho]

I have only heard good things about these basses especially in terms of value for money.

 

[Mike Stearns]

I bought one of Steve's Wan Bernadel basses. Never been happier. As good a bass as my old Morelli which I sold for nearly 4 times what I paid for the Wan. Try one out, I'm sure you'll like it.

Mike

 

[bdengler]

I bought one of the Wan cellos for my daughter. The workmanship is beautiful. But it sounds like a new cello; sweet but thinner sound that higher end new cellos.

 

[cgratham]

I'm a newbie here at TBDB and have learned a lot while lurking over the past few months. I've just bought a new bass and though I would share my experience in the hope that it would be useful for some others.

I'm one of those lunatics that decided to take up DB in middle age (my MD says it will help prevent Alzheimers). I've only been playing the DB for a couple of months now (though I've played many gigs as a jazz guitarist) on a rented carved Hofner.

In looking to buy a bass I was guided by the following:

1) I would not buy a bass without playing it (not ebay or even remotely from a store no matter how good their reputation)
2) I needed to try a number of different basses to compare. I like the sound of the DB - in isolation almost any DB sounds good to me. But when I can play/hear a number of basses side I can more easily determine what qualities I like and don't like in their sound.

After finding nothing locally (Vancouver and Seattle) I decided to fly to Phoenix to visit Steve Koscica (Invalid Link Removed). I asked Steve to pull out everything he had that was less than $10K. I spent the first 3 1/2 hours playing all (14) of these basses myself (Steve was off at a concert) and managed to eliminate a few from consideration. After lunch Steve spent a lot of time playing the remaining basses while I listened. Together we managed to narrow the field down to 4 basses - the Wan Bernadel and 3 older European basses. Up to this point I hadn't known the price of any of the basses To bolster Ken Smith's assertion, the three basses I liked the best were the three most expensive ones. I decided that two of them (I think $8500 and $8700) weren't that much better than the Wan. My favourite one was an old unlabelled Tyrolean? bass. It was wonderful - dark, loud, and with a huge cushion of sound. Just for fun, Steve and I compared this with his very expensive Italian bass he uses in the Phoenix Symphony. I could hear a difference but they were in the same ballpark. This bass was definitely worth spending the extra money to get. Alas, it was more money ($9500) than I had to spend so someone else will get a great bass at a good price.

I returned home with the last of Steve's Standard Wan Bernadels. I am very happy with the bass - first rate materials and excellent craftsmanship. It sounds very good - it clearly doesn't know that it should sound so good at that price. I really did like it better than many of the older (and new) basses that cost twice as much. It's got a nice clarity and volume. The tone is not really complex but is nice and pleasing. It is a little brighter than I would like right now but I'm confident that that will start to change when the new strings settle in.

It seems that there is a clear break point with superior sound quality starting somewhere around the $10K range. I would recommend anyone with less than that amount to spend to consider a Wan.

Finally, I would highly recommend Steve Koscica. As a buyer I could not have asked for a better experience. Steve picked me up at the airport, put me up in a hotel, and even bought me a lunch. He is highly accommodating, is an excellent player, and has a great supply. I felt no pressure to buy a more expensive bass, or any bass at all for that matter. If I am in a position to buy a more expensive bass in a few years time, Steve will be the first person I call.

If anyone has questions or would like to try out the Wan around Vancouver please feel free to contact me.

Regards, Chris
Chris Gratham
North Vancouver

 

[bassphase]

I returned home with the last of Steve's Standard Wan Bernadels. I am very happy with the bass - first rate materials and excellent craftsmanship. It sounds very good - it clearly doesn't know that it should sound so good at that price. I really did like it better than many of the older (and new) basses that cost twice as much. It's got a nice clarity and volume. The tone is not really complex but is nice and pleasing. It is a little brighter than I would like right now but I'm confident that that will start to change when the new strings settle in.

What strings did you get?? My Wan Bernadel came with Spiros and as you know, they take awhile to mellow out. If you're playing constantly, they'll sound good in a couple months or so. Depending on the sound you're looking for, you may want to try some different strings. I tried out Dominants, Flexorcore, original Flexocore, Oliv, Eudoxa, Pirastro Pizzicato, and Obigato. I also tried some different gauge Spiros --a weich G and a stark E. All of this at no small expense.

This is what I ended up with---an Oliv G, a Eudoxa D, and Spiro E and A (both Orchestra gauge). This has given me the sweet upper register I was looking for but the low end is still defined and growly. The gut strings (Oliv and Eudoxa) have less tension than the Spiros yet they transition nicely to the E and A both in sound and flexibility. If you're not willing to pay the large expense of trying out gut strings, I'd suggest a G & D Pirastro Olibgato--these are inexpensive and sound fantastic. Very close in quality to the Oliv and Eudoxa (even though they are NOT gut) plus they have low tension which is nice for soloing and thumb position.

It seems that there is a clear break point with superior sound quality starting somewhere around the $10K range. I would recommend anyone with less than that amount to spend to consider a Wan.

That was exactly what I found. I tried out a couple dozen basses, many which were more expensive (a couple that were over $10K) but none I liked more or even as much. Any of the clearly superior instruments were well out of my financial means. Many members of this forum highly recommend the "Cleveland" or "LaScala" bass. I would have loved to play either of those but they seem to all be on the East Coast. I'm curious how they woulld have fared.

Finally, I would highly recommend Steve Koscica. As a buyer I could not have asked for a better experience. Steve picked me up at the airport, put me up in a hotel, and even bought me a lunch. He is highly accommodating, is an excellent player, and has a great supply. I felt no pressure to buy a more expensive bass, or any bass at all for that matter. If I am in a position to buy a more expensive bass in a few years time, Steve will be the first person I call.

Steve was VERY helpful. I had him air freight me the bass to try out. He let me keep it over a week, long enough for me to take it around and compare with all the other basses I was previously considering.

I've only had my Wan Bernadel a few months now and I love it even more. The Spiros have mellowed out and the gut strings have taken on a more complex and vocal like sound.




bob

 

[cgratham]

Hi Bob,
Thanks for the helpful string info - it must have cost a fortune to try them all out!

The bass came with Heliocore (hybrids?). When I listened from a distance they sounded fine, but I didn't like the sound from the playing position - too metallic sounding.

I've just had a set of Obligatos on for the past week. I like them but the D string is quite scratchy and hard to get a clean arco attack on. The E is also a little dead sounding. I'll probably wait a few weeks for everything to settle in before I make a final judgement on them though.

Next I was thinking of trying Jargar or original Flexocors but given your experience I might try an Oliv or Eudoxa. I'm doing 80 % arco/10% pizz/ 10% tuning right now.

How do the guts bow on your Wan?

Chris

 

[bassphase]

Hi Bob,
Thanks for the helpful string info - it must have cost a fortune to try them all out!

It wasn't cheap, but I didn't buy full sets for most of them as I knew I didn't want guts on the E and A. Plus, I have another bass to feed.

The bass came with Heliocore (hybrids?). When I listened from a distance they sounded fine, but I didn't like the sound from the playing position - too metallic sounding.

I haven't tried those so I can't comment

I've just had a set of Obligatos on for the past week. I like them but the D string is quite scratchy and hard to get a clean arco attack on. The E is also a little dead sounding. I'll probably wait a few weeks for everything to settle in before I make a final judgement on them though.

I only tried a D and G Olbigato and really loved them. I can't say I'd describe the D as scratchy. In my experience, Spiros are scratchy.

Next I was thinking of trying Jargar or original Flexocors but given your experience I might try an Oliv or Eudoxa. I'm doing 80 % arco/10% pizz/ 10% tuning right now.

How do the guts bow on your Wan?

Chris

I think you should try one of the Flexocore varieties next since they are kind of a standard orchestral string and because of your mostly arco playing. I liked both the original and the newer version. The only reason I went to the Eudoxa D was because both D Flexocores were noticeably lower in volume than my Oliv G.

My arco playing is pretty feeble so I don't feel comfortable evaluating my gut strings for arco purposes. The DO sound good bowed. Some people feel gut strings roll a bit under the bow which is why I'm recommending Flexocore for you.


Good luck



bob

 

[bassballbobby]

Next I was thinking of trying Jargar or original Flexocors but given your experience I might try an Oliv or Eudoxa. I'm doing 80 % arco/10% pizz/ 10% tuning right now.



My Wan had Helicores when I bought it as well and while I liked the sound, I wanted a little darker tone. I switched to Original Flexicores with a new Helicore E and the bass seemed to just open up. I really like the way they sound and play. The G was brighter then I would have liked at first, and when it comes time to change again I may try a New Flexicore G, Original D and A and Helicore E. I don't know if my first Helicore E was just a bad string or what but when I put the new one on with the Flexicores it just explodes now. We played Brandenburg 3 and I tuned down to D and the conductor just loved it and went on about how it cut through and made a huge difference.

Bobby

 

[Model Masters]

Has anyone heard of or tried one of these basses. How was it?

I read all the posts regarding the Wan Bernadel bass, imported by the String Emporium (Stephen Koscica.) Emailed Stephen first then went to Phoenix, Arizona. He brought out some basses and indicated that one of them was the best. It was a Wan Bernadel with a rich finish, a spruce top and Willow sides and back that were beautifully flamed. It sounded extremely good and rich in tone.

I paid $4900 for that bass, then also purchased a padded cover. Back in California I visited my old teacher I've known for 50 years would among other venues, recorded with Jaco Pastorius. Well, He (Lou Kabok) could not take his hands off the instrument. Great sustain, beautiful tone and extremely easy action. Lou commented that he would not mind owning it and would undoubtably practice more. At 75, he and his wife Laura (cello) play a lot of classical music at various orchestras in the area.

Stephen was gracious, straight forward and the epitom of a gentleman. He shipped my bass to California and also turned me on to a Luthier (Polish) who is honest, has great crafmanship and is now "upsnuffing" my Rouner I'd purchased from Abe Luboff in 1989. I can recommend Stephen and his Luthier (Andrzej (Andrew) Derkacz without reservation.

My old friend Lou said over time, that the Wan Bernadel will have an even more amazing tone . . .

 

[shwashwa]

I read all the posts regarding the Wan Bernadel bass, imported by the String Emporium (Stephen Koscica.) Emailed Stephen first then went to Phoenix, Arizona. He brought out some basses and indicated that one of them was the best. It was a Wan Bernadel with a rich finish, a spruce top and Willow sides and back that were beautifully flamed. It sounded extremely good and rich in tone.

I paid $4900 for that bass, then also purchased a padded cover. Back in California I visited my old teacher I've known for 50 years would among other venues, recorded with Jaco Pastorius. Well, He (Lou Kabok) could not take his hands off the instrument. Great sustain, beautiful tone and extremely easy action. Lou commented that he would not mind owning it and would undoubtably practice more. At 75, he and his wife Laura (cello) play a lot of classical music at various orchestras in the area.

Stephen was gracious, straight forward and the epitom of a gentleman. He shipped my bass to California and also turned me on to a Luthier (Polish) who is honest, has great crafmanship and is now "upsnuffing" my Rouner I'd purchased from Abe Luboff in 1989. I can recommend Stephen and his Luthier (Andrzej (Andrew) Derkacz without reservation.

My old friend Lou said over time, that the Wan Bernadel will have an even more amazing tone . . .

i didnt know that willow could be flamed....
as they say on the bass guitar side, if you don't have pics, we don't believe you own it. lets see that sucker!

 

[Adrian Cho]

I thought all the Wan Bernadels had Maple backs and ribs. Has something changed?

 

[kurtsnyder]

I have been in contact with Steve since late November last year about purchasing a Wan Bernadel. When I called he was all sold out, but told me that the next batch were in production and they would be in around the middle of Feb. Well, he called the other day to say that they have been shipped to PHX and that he will start the setup as soon as he gets them in. He said he went over to China to see them and said that they look better than ever. I can't wait to try one out!!

Steve is such a nice guy too! Our first phone conversation lasted about 45min and it was him telling the really great story of how he came to meet Wan and why he decided to import this guy's stuff. I literally can't wait to get my hands on it and try it out!!

 

[accutone]

I have had a Wan for about 6 months. I have had similar experience to all those mentioned here. Great service, great guy, great instrument. Completely happy with it.

 

[pdbass]

I owned a Wan-Bernadel for almost 2 years. I just sold it to a student of mine. Great instrument--sturdy, well-made, bowed extremely well, good sound. GOOD sound, but not great. I think that there is something to be said for playing an instrument before you buy it. I read enough to fill a book about Wan-Bernadels when I was thinking of buying one. There is so much on Steve's website, as well as this one, about how great these instruments are and the testimonials speak for themselves. It MUST be a great instrument if everyone says so, right? Well, I spent about 2 years and trying to get the 'right' sound out of this instrument to no avail. The funny thing is that I spent 2 years telling myself that this was a great instrument--and I visited websites with testimonials praising Wan-Bernadels--trying to convince myself.

Bottom line, good sound is what you HEAR. For me, buying a bass over the phone was a MISTAKE. The Wans are good instruments, but, IMHO, not great. Some of these testimonials really praise the instrument, but my guess is that Steve Kosica doesn't play one in the Phoenix Symphony and that Steve LaSpina doesn't bring his to recording sessions. I thought the Wan that I had would be a great instrument for a High School or College aged student, or maybe a decent travel instrument. I do regret buying one--never having played it in person. To me, it would seem a bit like the "mail-order" bride thing--quite literally a "mail-order" bass!

I would advise anyone looking for an instrument to PLAY IT first! Even if you have to drive 6 hours--or even FLY to another city--it's worth the effort if you find an instrument you LOVE. If you have the resources, go to Phoenix and try out a Wan-Bernadel if you're thinking of buying one. What's a couple hundred bucks on a $5K investment for an instrument? Ironically, the bass I play now was not even as expensive as a Wan. It's a German shop bass, fully carved, about 70 years old. There are no testimonials online for it, but it sounds GORGEOUS--and that's all that matters.

 

[slbass]

Paul

First off, my last CD called Playroom on the steeplechase label was done with my Wan, as well as five other Cd's I recorded since buying my Wan. In fact I bought a second Wan last year (June 2006) which I used on my lastest recording for Steeplechase. I have had no problem getting the sound I want out of my basses. Both are Wan Bernadel's one made in 2003 and the newest one made in 2005. If you go to my web site you can hear tracks recorded with the 2003 bass (the track you hear when viewing my home page was done with the Wan). I think people need to more careful when making certain statements. I am happy you lucked out and found a bass you like. To everyone else yes check out the bass and see if it works out for you. The Wan Bernadel works for me and is a great bass for those of us out there that don't get as luckly as Paul.Too bad you couldn't get a sound you liked from the bass, but then again what works for one person doesn't always work for others. For approx $5000.00 you have to look long and hard to fine a bass that compares. I want everyone to know the main bass I play is a Wan Beradel are there better basses out there I sure there are. Again try talk to Steve about a trial period most bass shops give you that option. My web site is stevelaspina.com.

 

[shwashwa]

just curious, who sets up your basses for you? i am in NJ too.

Paul

First off, my last CD called Playroom on the steeplechase label was done with my Wan, as well as five other Cd's I recorded since buying my Wan. In fact I bought a second Wan last year (June 2006) which I used on my lastest recording for Steeplechase. I have had no problem getting the sound I want out of my basses. Both are Wan Bernadel's one made in 2003 and the newest one made in 2005. If you go to my web site you can hear tracks recorded with the 2003 bass (the track you hear when viewing my home page was done with the Wan). I think people need to more careful when making certain statements. I am happy you lucked out and found a bass you like. To everyone else yes check out the bass and see if it works out for you. The Wan Bernadel works for me and is a great bass for those of us out there that don't get as luckly as Paul.Too bad you couldn't get a sound you liked from the bass, but then again what works for one person doesn't always work for others. For approx $5000.00 you have to look long and hard to fine a bass that compares. I want everyone to know the main bass I play is a Wan Beradel are there better basses out there I sure there are. Again try talk to Steve about a trial period most bass shops give you that option. My web site is stevelaspina.com.

 

[pdbass]

Paul

First off, my last CD called Playroom on the steeplechase label was done with my Wan, as well as five other Cd's I recorded since buying my Wan. In fact I bought a second Wan last year (June 2006) which I used on my lastest recording for Steeplechase. I have had no problem getting the sound I want out of my basses. Both are Wan Bernadel's one made in 2003 and the newest one made in 2005. If you go to my web site you can hear tracks recorded with the 2003 bass (the track you hear when viewing my home page was done with the Wan). I think people need to more careful when making certain statements. I am happy you lucked out and found a bass you like. To everyone else yes check out the bass and see if it works out for you. The Wan Bernadel works for me and is a great bass for those of us out there that don't get as luckly as Paul.Too bad you couldn't get a sound you liked from the bass, but then again what works for one person doesn't always work for others. For approx $5000.00 you have to look long and hard to fine a bass that compares. I want everyone to know the main bass I play is a Wan Beradel are there better basses out there I sure there are. Again try talk to Steve about a trial period most bass shops give you that option. My web site is stevelaspina.com.

I stand corrected. Sorry, Steve. My comments were not meant to be at all derogatory to you or to Steve K. He was really gracious to me and he's got a really great business set up with the Wan basses. My bass was shipped great and the whole deal was handled extremely well. My caveat is to anyone buying a bass SIGHT UNSEEN and UNPLAYED--regardless of any type of "trial" period. I think that it is in ANYONE'S best interest to play and hear something before any money is exchanged for any purchase involving THOUSANDS of dollars. We're not talking production-line instruments that all sound the same (are we?). At the same time, we're not talking custom-made instruments, designed to an individual's specs. What I was basically saying, to ANYONE thinking of buying a Wan, was this: play one first. If you can, make the trip to Phoenix, but play one. I bought one, based on the "hype" and the numerous testimonials available online. It was not my bass. I'm not sure that I would have bought one had I (1) not read anything about it and (2) had been able to play one previously. Don't get me wrong! The Wan was a nice bass. I recorded about 4 CDs on it. I flew around the country a few times with it. It traveled well and sounded really nice at times--but it was not for me. I honestly believe that there is a big difference in laying down $200 bucks to "try out" a pickup or even $1000 to "try out" an amp than laying out $5K to "try out" an instrument. . . .an instrument. Know what you're getting into. The Wans seem to have a great track record, but I think that everyone should know that there's another side to the story, too. I like to think that every instrument has some kind of unique, individual character. Go out and play as many basses as you can until find that one you're looking for--just go find it. IMHO, reading 100 testimonials is never going to make something sound good to you.

 

[kurtsnyder]

The nice thing with Steve at stringemporium.com is that he'll same day air ship a bass to you in one of those nice tuff-lite flight cases for about $80. You get to play it for a week and if you want to keep the bass, send the empty case back. I guess that's a little cheaper than flying out there.

I would NEVER drop 5g's on something without seeing adn playing it first. Well, I might it I was rich!

 

[Adrian Cho]

When you are spending $5K, you can only expect so much. I can believe Paul's statement that he found his Wan Berndadel "good but not great." I bought my current 7/8 Shen Willow was within that price range and it is a ridiculously great bass for the money but still, it was < $5K and it has its limitations. For what I do which is a lot of older style jazz and trying to play with as much acoustic volume as possible, it works great but it definitely doesn't have the resonance or tone of my previous bass which I sold for twice the price of what I got the Shen for.