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Weird "woofiness" on B string

I ended up contacting Sweetwater about the issue, because I also experienced something strange at a gig on Saturday with the bass: in the middle of a song, I suddenly went out of tune. Just on the E string. :(

I later retuned the bass, but the action was very low on it. So, I took it home and raised the E string saddle, but within 30 minutes of playing it, the E string had gone about a 1/4 tone flat and the saddle appeared to have dropped again.

I thought I was going crazy, as I have never seen a bridge saddle slowly drop on a bass, much less a Fodera. But, I ended up raising it again, but this time I measured the height of it. Sure enough, after playing it for about 15 minutes, the saddle had dropped almost a full millimeter.

It's going back to Sweetwater for them to evaluate it, and we'll see what they say. Fingers crossed!
 
Did you set witness points at the bridge and nut on the B string (well, on all the strings)?

Great advice on the witness point.

My first bass was a 5 string and I've played them almost exclusively for years. I went through several different types of strings and several basses before I finally figured out what was causing that "woofiness" of the B string.

It's not the bass. It's not the scale length. In most cases it's not the string (but some B strings sound better than others). It was my installation technique.

When you put on a string and you seat the ball end in the bridge and start cranking the tuner to get the two to three wraps around the post like we've all been taught...you end up twisting the string. Think about it like wringing out a wash cloth. If you hold that cloth by the corners and pull it tight, it still flops around a good bit....just like you want your string to do. But twist it up and it becomes rock hard...almost feels solid. Doesn't move very well. Same applies for your strings.

The smaller strings aren't effected as much (although they are effected), but take a big .130 or .135 guage string and twist it, and that sucker will vibrate in some funny ways. That is what is producing the "woof" tone. That muffled, dark, dim sound.

So how do you fix it? EASY!

After you seat the ball end in the bridge, measure, and cut your string....Put the cut end of the string into the tuner and give it one wrap around by hand. Then pull the ball end back out as far as you can. Start winding your string. You will see the ball end turning as the string wraps around the tuning post. This force would be twisting your string if the ball end wasn't free to move. Once you get close to the end, you can seat the ball end and tune the string to pitch.

Next...the witness point. You need to rough in the intonation before you set your witness point as you don't want multiple witness points. Get the intonation spot on, then press the string down at the bridge to set the witness point. Don't get goofy with it. Just make sure there is a nice break over and the string isn't "humped up" going over the bridge.

Bridge Pamorama-Text_zpsuouoojy2.jpg


Check your intonation...guess what...it's way out now huh? Intonate again.

Lastly, check your pickup height. Due to the way our ears work with our brain, we perceive louder sounds to be "better". This leads people to raise their pickups higher than optimal and the magnets can effect the vibration of the string. The larger the string, the more metal for the magnet to pull on. Larger strings also vibrate in a bigger arc than smaller ones making them pass closer to the magnet. So lowering your pickup under the B string will give me better tone and you can adjust for the volume change with EQ. Keep in mind that really low notes (under 40hz or so) are difficult for speaker cabinets and rooms to reproduce. So you may be producing the note, but the speaker and room can't...which means you think the note is weaker. You can find out if this is the case by simply watching your speaker or laying your hand on it. If you can see the cone moving when you play that open B string and you feel the cabinet vibrate...but you don't hear it as loud as other notes...then it's a matter of acoustics...not your bass.

Hope this helps someone.
 
Great advice on the witness point.

My first bass was a 5 string and I've played them almost exclusively for years. I went through several different types of strings and several basses before I finally figured out what was causing that "woofiness" of the B string.

It's not the bass. It's not the scale length. In most cases it's not the string (but some B strings sound better than others). It was my installation technique.

When you put on a string and you seat the ball end in the bridge and start cranking the tuner to get the two to three wraps around the post like we've all been taught...you end up twisting the string. Think about it like wringing out a wash cloth. If you hold that cloth by the corners and pull it tight, it still flops around a good bit....just like you want your string to do. But twist it up and it becomes rock hard...almost feels solid. Doesn't move very well. Same applies for your strings.

The smaller strings aren't effected as much (although they are effected), but take a big .130 or .135 guage string and twist it, and that sucker will vibrate in some funny ways. That is what is producing the "woof" tone. That muffled, dark, dim sound.

So how do you fix it? EASY!

After you seat the ball end in the bridge, measure, and cut your string....Put the cut end of the string into the tuner and give it one wrap around by hand. Then pull the ball end back out as far as you can. Start winding your string. You will see the ball end turning as the string wraps around the tuning post. This force would be twisting your string if the ball end wasn't free to move. Once you get close to the end, you can seat the ball end and tune the string to pitch.

Next...the witness point. You need to rough in the intonation before you set your witness point as you don't want multiple witness points. Get the intonation spot on, then press the string down at the bridge to set the witness point. Don't get goofy with it. Just make sure there is a nice break over and the string isn't "humped up" going over the bridge.

View attachment 4847910

Check your intonation...guess what...it's way out now huh? Intonate again.

Lastly, check your pickup height. Due to the way our ears work with our brain, we perceive louder sounds to be "better". This leads people to raise their pickups higher than optimal and the magnets can effect the vibration of the string. The larger the string, the more metal for the magnet to pull on. Larger strings also vibrate in a bigger arc than smaller ones making them pass closer to the magnet. So lowering your pickup under the B string will give me better tone and you can adjust for the volume change with EQ. Keep in mind that really low notes (under 40hz or so) are difficult for speaker cabinets and rooms to reproduce. So you may be producing the note, but the speaker and room can't...which means you think the note is weaker. You can find out if this is the case by simply watching your speaker or laying your hand on it. If you can see the cone moving when you play that open B string and you feel the cabinet vibrate...but you don't hear it as loud as other notes...then it's a matter of acoustics...not your bass.

Hope this helps someone.

Wow, this is an eye-opener. I know someone earlier in the thread had mentioned the string being twisted, but this approach to winding the B string (or any string for that matter) makes so much sense. Thank you! I will try this after the bass gets back from Sweetwater. :)
 
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Wow, this is an eye-opener. I know someone earlier in the thread had mentioned the string being twisted, but this approach to winding the B string (or any string for that matter) makes so much sense. Thank you! I will try this after the bass gets back from Sweetwater. :)

I hope you have the same "Ah Ha!" moment I did. I no longer have any basses longer than a 34" scale and recently bought a 30" scale. I have great low end on all my basses.
 
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Reactions: Steve Slate
I'm not sure if this should go in the basses section, or the setup/hardware, etc, so I'll leave that up to the mods. :)

Anyone experience a weird "woofiness" while playing on the B string? My Fodera Emperor 6 Standard I've noticed lately has a weird sound when I play from the fourth fret and higher on the B string. It's almost as if the string is not being allowed to completely vibrate or something--like the first fundamental is not coming through, in a weird way.

I've done the usual troubleshooting: fresh strings? Check. New setup with intonation and truss rod adjustment? Check. Lowered the pick up height? Check.

Anyone else experience this?

is the B string too close to the pickup to that it is producing a false harmonic?
 
No, I went through Sweetwater first, as they are going to evaluate it and then see if it's something that needs to be addressed with Fodera.

Yes there is. Someone on this planet is not entirely happy with his bass, and said bass has a butterfly on the headstock. I'm quite sure the good people of Fodera will want to know that. They produce instruments that set, along with a few select other brands, the bar for the highest quality standard possible.
You paid good money for that, and given your text, you're no stranger to boutique basses. No matter what is wrong, it needs to be addressed.
 
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Reactions: Ethereal Thorn
I ended up contacting Sweetwater about the issue, because I also experienced something strange at a gig on Saturday with the bass: in the middle of a song, I suddenly went out of tune. Just on the E string. :(

I later retuned the bass, but the action was very low on it. So, I took it home and raised the E string saddle, but within 30 minutes of playing it, the E string had gone about a 1/4 tone flat and the saddle appeared to have dropped again.

I thought I was going crazy, as I have never seen a bridge saddle slowly drop on a bass, much less a Fodera. But, I ended up raising it again, but this time I measured the height of it. Sure enough, after playing it for about 15 minutes, the saddle had dropped almost a full millimeter.

It's going back to Sweetwater for them to evaluate it, and we'll see what they say. Fingers crossed!
I had the same thing happen many years ago on a U.S. made Precision Bass, the G string saddle would lower itself after a few songs, ended up wrapping dental floss around the set screws which solved the problem but I sold the bass shortly after, in over 50 years of playing that was the only bridge I had problems with, good luck.