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What about Jam bands??

#201
On the down low said:
Just some know it all
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Sorry not to be short with you, but people dissect every word. It just become annoying. I used to belong to a fly fishing forum where everyone knew everything about a certain area. I guided out west for 10 years to pay for college, but they knew everything about it. No I don't know the bands you listed sorry. Just like you probably don't know to much about being a fly fishing guide out west.
 
#205
sevenyearsdown said:
Are we talking about dirty hippies twirling in a field to awful music?
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Max Blasto said:
^ This.

I love the concept of the jam band, but I'm not much of a fan of the direction the genre has taken.
In particular, many jam bands have taken to the "singing ability optional" blueprint popularized by the Dead. In fact, I think that is the modern definition of Jam Band now: extended instrumental improvs and poopiee for vocals. I'm looking at you, Phish. But there are many others.

In fact, there are a number of bands that I would consider "jam" bands who could play for 20 minutes no problem, but aren't considered Jam Bands because a) they had a good singer or two b) they wrote actual _songs_ that had appeal outside the genre and 3) their music transcended the social scene they were associated with. Jam Bands are almost exclusively a modern white hippie thing. While many rock and jazz artists and fans were hippies back in the 60s and 70s, that just can't be said now.

In rock, Cream and Led Zeppelin were most definitely jam bands. Maybe a little too rockin' for the hippies, tho.
In jazz, well, Miles has already been mentioned. I'd add Weather Report and the like.

My favorite Jam Bands are the ones most closely associated with the "San Francisco Sound" that they helped popularize. So, yeah, that's old school, but from where I'm sitting that's where and how the modern genre was born. Jefferson Airplane's instrumentalists were every bit as good or better than the Dead's and Marty Balin and Grace Slick were terrific as well, making the music far more approachable even on extendo jams. I wish there were more weight on that style in the modern genre.

Want love for a Jam Band bassist?: Ok, Jack Cassidy. Best of the genre I think.
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Max Blasto said:
Please point out the person on this thread that said the Grateful Dead couldn't write a great song.

I'm waiting....
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It was *you* accusing jam bands of writing songs without wide appeal! To me a great song does have wide appeal and a number of the Dead's tunes do, even with the mediocre singing.
 
#207
Max Blasto said:
Most, maybe, but not me. I'm well familiar with all Dead albums. And more bootlegs than I'd like to admit. And I stand by my point. I know that Dead fans are militantly supportive of the band, and sensitive to criticism in ways that few other fan bases are. That's awesome. I've had conversations with Dead fans who argue vehemently that the Dead's vocals are some of the most righteously soulful music you can happen to hear. Hey, man, we all gotta be fans of something, and ugly girls get married all the time.

But no. Their singing sucked. They sucked on American Beauty too. That recording made them sound ok, but anyone who thinks that vocals were a strong point in the band ever is being a little too subjective.

As for songwriting: Actually, I think the lack of broad appeal is one of the calling cards of Jam Bands because it gives some them counterculture street cred for their waspafarian fan base. I remember older Dead fans being derisive of people whose access to the band was Touch of Grey. But really, no one is in danger of hearing St. Stephen at the local pub this weekend. It's broad based appeal that I'm talking about.

You may like it. Great! But just because you like it doesn't mean it's actually good. Pink Floyd's the same. Awesome band with lotsa fans. But none of them could really sing. Still made great music tho. As did the Dead.
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This post is just full of win!

Waspafarian? Classic!
 
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#211
HolmeBass said:
It was *you* accusing jam bands of writing songs without wide appeal! To me a great song does have wide appeal and a number of the Dead's tunes do, even with the mediocre singing.
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Whoops. Sorry, you're flat out wrong. Show me the quote.

Ok, now reread my post, this time for comprehension please. Then yours. See if you can find the break in linear thought.

I didn't say that the Dead didn't write great songs, I said that bands that I considered jam bands but were not generally considered jam bands by the fandom had some key earmarks: good singers, songs that transcended the genre, and a "vibe" that transcended the social scene.

The Dead wrote great songs, in my opinion. But other than maybe "Truckin", none transcended the genre which for their day meant radio airplay. At the time, Zep heads listened to Tull, Aerosmith fans listened to Queen, etc etc. But your idea of "wide appeal" isn't wide at all. It's all Dead fans.

So welcome to the concept of the Cult Band. The Grateful Deal are a terrific example. There is nothing "wide" about that appeal, but it is indeed intense. So fans get defensive about perceived slights to the band. I'm not slighting (other than the singing) but let's not kid ourselves, Jam Bands, GD for sure, made their bread on _not_ being broadly popular, but deeply popular.
 
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#212
On the down low said:
You should know you knew my age the music I never heard of, and how I was under a rock because of some miss wording. You clairvoyant you.
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??? That post wasn't directed to you.
Are you new to internet forums? Nothing wrong with that, but when you reply to the wrong person things get more confusing than they already are.

As for clairvoyancy, I predict you're going to say something dumb soon.
 
#213
Max Blasto said:
Whoops. Sorry, you're flat out wrong. Show me the quote.

Ok, now reread my post, this time for comprehension please. Then yours. See if you can find the break in linear thought.

I didn't say that the Dead didn't write great songs, I said that bands that I considered jam bands but were not generally considered jam bands by the fandom had some key earmarks: good singers, songs that transcended the genre, and a "vibe" that transcended the social scene.

The Dead wrote great songs, in my opinion. But other than maybe "Truckin", none transcended the genre which for their day meant radio airplay. At the time, Zep heads listened to Tull, Aerosmith fans listened to Queen, etc etc. But your idea of "wide appeal" isn't wide at all. It's all Dead fans.

So welcome to the concept of the Cult Band. The Grateful Deal are a terrific example. There is nothing "wide" about that appeal, but it is indeed intense. So fans get defensive about perceived slights to the band. I'm not slighting (other than the singing) but let's not kid ourselves, Jam Bands, GD for sure, made their bread on _not_ being broadly popular, but deeply popular.
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Right- Casey Jones, Alabama Get Away, and Touch of Gray didn't garner much airplay. What bridge did you crawl out from underneath of? Must not have had great radio reception under there. You do realize you're condescension is positively offensive, right?

Furthermore, now I hear Uncle John's Band, Eyes of the World, Friend of the Devil, and even Ripple getting played on modern format FM radio, on stations that never, for example, play String Cheese Incident. (They do play the new Widespread Panic single, and it's a very good song too, maybe even great).

I forgot Sugar Magnolia, another Dead song that garnered air play on release and continues to do so until today, and Scarlet Begonias is something you hear a lot of nowadays, including a number of excellent covers of it.
 
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#215
I'm a big fan of the music, lots of talented players. However, I absolutely can't stand the "scene". I've been numerous jam shows. Pretty much each one was ruined by someone who felt the need to smoke a year's worth of weed, drink a case of micro brew, or dose themselves into an oblivion. To each their own as long, as it doesn't infringe upon my enjoyment of the music.

I'll say it: spinning hippies are much more obnoxious than headbangers.
 
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#217
0902-theyre-hippies.jpg
 
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#219
I was a dead head in high school and college. Used to go to the Wetlands in the late 80s and early 90s. Saw the first Horde Tour with Col Bruce and my first Phish show was downstairs at a college bar. Back then it seemed like something vital and exciting was building. It was like lightning in a bottle. Something that was unpolluted by the mainstream. I just don't feel that with the jambands coming up today. I can't really put my finger on it. I'm not sure if the genre exhausted itself or if my taste changed. Probably a bit of both. But I did see Kung Fu a few months back and they blew me away. And JRAD with Phil last year was the best post-Jerry thing I've heard.
 

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