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Double Bass What is the "correct" thing to do

Andy Mopley

Andy Mopley

Sep 24, 2011
1,335
318
#1
Hi all

notwithstanding the amateur level of the orchestra I play with, there are some things that really get under my skin, and thought I'd ask for your thoughts on this.
Firstly, when should all orchestra members take to the stage, I believe only a few minutes before, and as a group, not like monks returning to a monastery...
Second, should the audience be subject to multiple tuning, eg first the brass, then lower strings etc. at the start of each performance and or after the break? Or should there just be the general A, played for a few seconds, for everyone to check tuning against?

Regards to all
 
#2
Several professional orchestras tune in sections (wind, brass, strings). We do it in both community orchestras I'm in. Nothing unusual there.
Generally the orchestras I'm in come on as a group, although bass players are notorious for getting on stage early to tune and warmup.
Louis
 
#3
Go on stage whenever. I don't think the audience cares. Some like to watch the musicians go through their warm up.
Typically tune winds and brass then strings. Everyone should already be in tune when they get on stage but things happen. If there is an instrumentation change between pieces then usually one A is given for those who didn't play the previous piece.
 
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#5
I don't think there's anything wrong with being on stage preparing for your performance prior to the downbeat. With every orchestra I've ever played in, players are allowed on stage to warmup as they see fit.

As far as tuning, the number of tuning notes given varies from group to group but there is neither a problem with multiple tuning notes nor a stigma against taking this time multiple times during a concert. Often, wind and brass players play and sit out different pieces on the program, and they need to tune when they come on stage too.

When your ears become sensitized to fine gradations of tuning, and when you play in a group where instruments go out of tune in different directions and to varying degrees, it is important to reinforce the orchestra's pitch as needed. I've even played concerts where tuning has taken place between movements when extreme interventions were called for.
 
#7
In my Orchestra, the basses are out on the stage, so if we tune or warmup, we do it out there. I'm usually out warming up, looking through the part and tuning from 10 or 15 mins. before till we start the concert.

Yes, we tune before tuning, but the group A is your last chance to fix any problems. My orchestra does 2 A's, one for strings, and one for winds and brass. You should definitely be checking your strings, and turning pegs if necessary, when the A is given.
 
#8
Andy Mopley said:
Firstly, when should all orchestra members take to the stage, I believe only a few minutes before, and as a group, not like monks returning to a monastery..
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This is an interesting difference I've noticed between American and German orchestras. Germans enter on stage as an organized group at the beginning of the concert. Americans slowly filter on five or ten minutes before downbeat.

As a player, especially as a bassist, I prefer the more comfortable American style. But as far as a performance goes, the Germans make a better impression with the grand entrance.
 
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#9
I am also with the Germans, here, Paul. Does the public need to sit there for 10-15 minutes listening to a whole bunch of players warming up? To NeiG's point "I've yet to hear an audience member complain about onstage tuning. I have heard complaints about loud playing before the concert" - which I also agree with. You don't see opera singers warming up on stage before they go on - or do you?
 
#11
Andy Mopley said:
I am also with the Germans, here, Paul. Does the public need to sit there for 10-15 minutes listening to a whole bunch of players warming up? To NeiG's point "I've yet to hear an audience member complain about onstage tuning. I have heard complaints about loud playing before the concert" - which I also agree with. You don't see opera singers warming up on stage before they go on - or do you?
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The public doesn't need to sit there, no. If people are warming up it's not like they need to be glued to their seats in rapt attention--usually plenty of people are talking or milling about during that time anyways, although certainly if the entire orchestra was practicing their parts individually at fortissimo, that's obnoxious. I think being judicious in what you actually play in that time is important, but I have nothing against the practice, even though it certainly is nice looking to see a group enter en masse.


SAlcott said:
Do whatever everyone else does and don't worry about it. Be ready to play at the downbeat.
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This. Ultimately (and sometimes unfortunately), it's up to the conductor which way to do this stuff, and we're all probably happiest about it if we can just forget that we have a preference when the time comes.
 
#12
I think the timing of when the orchestra goes on stage is a non-issue as long as the show starts exactly on time. As an audience member the only time I get irritated by players warming up when the show is supposed to start at 8 and it's 8:05.
 
#13
martinez said:
I think the timing of when the orchestra goes on stage is a non-issue as long as the show starts exactly on time. As an audience member the only time I get irritated by players warming up when the show is supposed to start at 8 and it's 8:05.
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A five minute delay is pretty standard. It's to give latecomers a chance to take their seats. In fact, I can't recall ever starting a concert precisely at the scheduled time.
 
#14
In my orchestra, percussion is on stage at least an hour before every concert because the principal player expects it from his section. Wind soloists are usually on stage 45min out, practicing solos, checking reeds, etc. From there people filter in as they deem necessary; I'm non-principal bass section and I'm usually on stage 20-30min out running the difficult spots in the rep. What you don't want to do is go on stage and play anything off-concert...as in don't go practice your excerpts at FF before a concert. It's very bad form and your fellow musicians WILL notice.

For tuning we do an A for winds/brass and strings, which is pretty standard for American orchestras. I tune beforehand then micro-adjust to be consistent with the oboe.
 
#16
This is all very personal, different conductors and leaders have different views. If your Principle is onstage early and warms up as the audience is taking their seats, fine, you can too. Personally I think warming up should be over and done 20 mins before start. I much prefer the whole orchestra to come on together, and I'd shoot any member of my section who was onstage practicing when there's audience in the room. Totally unacceptable in my view.

All that said, it's a personal thing. There is no right thing
 
#17
I think it also depends on the backstage situation. There are some concert halls where it's incredibly crammed and uncomfortable to cue up at the stage doors. There are also stage settings where it's just uncomfortable or inelegant to climb over chairs, and you end up with an awkward traffic jam at the beginning of the show.

This might be a situation I deal with more than most people. My ensemble is about 20 people, so we play in a lot of small "chamber" halls, which are usually meant for things like string quartets or solo recitals. The backstage area is usually too small for that many people. We tend to pack an enormous amount of percussion, electronics, and microphones on stage, and often each piece will have a different set-up or seating arrangement. Since I'm usually in the front row, I often have to get myself and my bass past of lot of chairs and equipment to take my seat. When there isn't a clear path, things can get messy. It's at those moments that I really miss the American way of hanging around on stage and starting up whenever.
 
#18
Bobby Scharmann said:
What you don't want to do is go on stage and play anything off-concert...as in don't go practice your excerpts at FF before a concert. It's very bad form and your fellow musicians WILL notice.
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Don't warm up with any concerti you are working on either. It is disrespectful.

In ONNY, when we tune, we get an A for winds/brass,high strings and low strings right off the bat. After intermission we are given only 2 A's, winds/brass, all strings. The second A is a shorter A as we tune off stage. Most people are out pretty early, 10-15 mins usually. One thing that does get under my skin about tuning, is when people space-out during the tuning note and then complain about their stand partners intonation compared to theirs(good thing that was only a sub...)

American orchestra players often do this, as the "grand entrance" goes to the conductor who walks out to a seated and silent ensemble, which I personally find looks darn good! For intermission what I will often do is put my bass down, use the restroom, and then go back out and get ready for the second half. It may be really early but I would rather be out there ready than even risk being late. Lateness gives me a lot of anxiety for some reason, and I am usually pretty early for things (for gigs I'll usually make it there about an hour or a little more before I'm even supposed to roll in).
 

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