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What makes a good musician?

#21
It has been said over and over - the only people that don't value an education are the ones that don't have it. The arts are one of the few fields where some people argue that ignorance is acceptable, some that it is an advantage.

Nobody is saying that you have to go to Berkley, but if you want to be a pro today, you greatly enhance your opportunities by being able to read fluently and have a thorough knowledge of theory.
 
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#22
learn how to learn ... learn all you can ... always learn how to listen ... !!!!!!!!!

practice effectively ...

play with players that are much better ... !! always help those who kinda suck ...

what makes a good musician ... hmmm .. share you talent without being a dick

old guy here ... 50+ yrs of piano , 40+ yrs of bass/gtr ... and Yes , I still practice daily and learn .. !
 
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#23
Muddslide said:
Yes, absolutely. I have a story and I hope it's not too (tl/dr) long and boring, but back in 2003, my family and I went on an extended trip through Central Europe, staying mostly in Romania and the Czech Republic, with some time in Hungary.

In case I sound like a rich person, we sold everything of value we owned to do this, including computers, vehicles, etc. We thought it might be our only shot at a trip like this.

Anyway, we were traveling (rented a car) between the towns of Brasov and Sibiu in the upper part of beautiful Romania and it was getting to be evening, we needed a leg-stretch...so we came upon this inn/gas station/little store that was literally in the middle of nowhere in these beautiful big hills.

The only instrument I had with me on this trip was a steel-bodied resonator ukulele.

Well, as we pulled up to the place, there were three older gypsy guys sitting at a table out front having a little jam session. One guy was playing concertina, one was playing something like an oud, and one was playing a Django-style nylon string guitar.

While my wife and kids were inside, I broke out the uke and raised my eyebrows as if to ask "Can I join in?" Their eyes lit up, they offered me a seat and some beer and they proceeded to start playing. Unusual scales, unfamiliar melodies, but I was able to join in on some chording and even a bit of soloing. We were all laughing and cheering each other on.

After several minutes of this, they looked at me and one of them sort of pointed at me with an open hand and I started in on some old country blues number. They fell right in! We ended up playing quite a while, different things from old American folk tunes to some real gypsy jazz sort of stuff. By this time my wife, kids and other people from inside the place were outside at tables watching and listening.

I've played hundreds of gigs, but this may have been my favorite "live" music making experience ever. It was (not to get overly cheesy) magic.

I knew about a dozen words in Romanian and I think these cats knew even less English, but yes--we communicated for sure.
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Music is THE universal language.
 
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#24
What is your definition of a good musician? (Hopefully not "someone who doesn't answer a question with a question".) It depends on what your goal is. If you want to the most technically proficient and knowledgeable bassist ever, you may spend so much time studying that you never get to play with other musicians. If that is what you consider a worthy goal, attain it. On the other hand, if your only aim is to get people dancing to covers played at a moment's notice without ever having playing the song before, conservatory training won't help. Reading is important, if only to understand lessons and to learn tunes from sheet music. Theory is important because it is the nuts and bolts of music and without that knowledge, you're playing blind. What seems to work for most players is a happy medium of tight theory, some sight reading, and the ability to play their instrument in time and on key. Avoid the far ends of the scale: 1.) Forgot more theory than the rest of us combined will ever know, but unable to improvise because it doesn't make mathematical sense to play a minor triad in the fourth measure over a D7... or 2.) Whatever, Dude, I just crank it up and play, it's all about looks and tone. The only reason you're a musician is to make the best music you possibly can. Whatever tools and approach you need to best achieve that is your answer. It may not be the same answer for everyone else, though, just for you. In my opinion.
 
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#25
Shimmi said:
Lately I've realized I have a long way to go, I started playing just 5-6 years ago and only REALLY been playing for 3 years(practice almost every other day, with a band 2-3 times a week for past year and a year before that played just a tad under. I feel I have a better grasp on harmonica even though I play it waaay less... I guess it comes more natural...good wit dem lips... ha

I've heard a lot of people tell me I need to learn to read music if I ever wanna be good enough to be a pro. This is mainly the opinion from older people that don't know music... and well some that do. Like friends of parents or step brothers pretty much whoever over 40.

BUT I also know they told me the same thing when I started painting(only they said I needed art school) and when it comes to art I am professional and get paying commissions fairly regular. I feel people these days...or those days just feel "education" is always the answer.

I read tabs for covers but everything else I play by ear. A guy I jammed with the other day told me he really loved my style and could tell I was a geeky jazz band player in school... I never took any music classes in any school...

Another random "reviewer" also mentioned I have a jazzy style, I like it a lot it makes me feel cool.

But in your opinion should all musicians learn to read music and all the proper know how or can one wing it and still make it to pro?

Just curious I know there is no real right answer and sorry if this has been asked before.
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If you want to play music for fun and recreation, then do whatever you feel like. If you want music to pay some or all of your bills, you'll need gigs. If you can't read, you can't do reading gigs.

Just learn to read.
 
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#26
When you get old and need a kidney transplant will you go to a surgeon or a butcher? Both are equally adept at cutting flesh and have handled plenty of kidneys in their days.

Also there's plenty of folks over 40 who DO know a lot about music that will tell you knowing reading and theory are a damn good idea for a musician. Many of the responders here fit into that category.

But there's nothing wrong with being a butcher. It's an honorable profession.

But you know what I think makes a good musician more than anything? Attitude. I refuse to play with anyone with a bad one, no matter what.
 
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#27
A fact, known by some and unknown to many, is that Paul McCartney never learned to read music. However, if you don't happen to find yourself in the most popular band of all time, reading sheet music can only benefit a musician. I, personally, would recommend at least learning to read tabs (which doesn't take being a genius). Unless you plan on becoming a studio musician, reading sheet music is a bit overrated. BTW, I'm one of the older dudes you were referring to. Music theory has helped me more than anything, as far as musical knowledge. Musical ability is different. I would just say keeping playing often, listen to many styles and try to learn as many songs as you can.
 
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#28
Reverend T said:
If you wanna make original music all you need is intent, a banged up instrument and a lump in the throat that you need to express.

If you wanna play classical or jazz then sight reading may be a tool of the trade, making it a necessary skill.
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I'm not entirely sure where you live, but I know you aren't currently in my living room (otherwise I'd make you breakfast too!).

Tell me about that lump in your throat that you want to express.

What's are the tempo, melody and chord changes? What key is it in? Meter? What feel does it have?

I can quickly write all this out to a person whom I'm hoping to collaborate with, and they can be anywhere on the globe with internet access. Somebody without any knowledge, will be forced to have the musicians sitting with him as he plays or sings his idea.

If your hopes for your music go no further than yourself, it's fine. As soon as collaboration is desired, language is needed.
 
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#29
flyswatter said:
I think it's important to know theory -- i.e. know your scales, keys, fretboard, chord sequences, time signatures, etc, like the back of your hand. These are the basic tools of communication between musicians, and the key to learning songs quickly, picking up things on the fly, covering yourself when you make a mistake, and improvising when it is called for.

As to whether you can actually read these things from a musical score, it is neither here nor there -- unless you are heavily into classical or jazz. I've been gigging blues, rock, soul, country for 30 years, and never once has a bandleader or studio producer handed me a sheet of music and said "play this." Usually they give you a key, a chord sequence, and tell you what sort of groove/ feel is wanted and off you go.
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Do you know how to read? If not, that's likely that the reason you've never been handed a piece of music to read. Plenty of reading gigs exist (and they're not limited to classical or jazz gigs), but if you're not a reader, then you're not going to be the one getting the calls for them.
 
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#30
tfer said:
I'm not entirely sure where you live, but I know you aren't currently in my living room (otherwise I'd make you breakfast too!).

Good for you. I currently live in a country where folk musicians play a one stringed instrument. Can't even speak anything but their regional language (which is nearly extinct) and busk on the street and anyone human who listens to them is assured of goosebumps.

I didn't say it is easy. I said it is all you need to start. Anything else and everything else is excuses and procrastination. And read the above post about the guy who jammed with gypsies in Romania. Language is not 'needed'. Language makes it easier.
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#35
Shimmi said:
should all musicians learn to read music and all the proper know how or can one wing it and still make it to pro?.
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Anthony wellington was already linked but here he is speaking directly about what it takes to be a pro:


Essentially it's about being prepared for whatever might be thrown at you
Weather it's reading, faking to a chart, pure improvising to a well defined genre, or modifying in response to vague instructions etc.
he also says "never have attitude at a recording session, you are too easy to replace"

I'll agree with him because he certainly knows more than I
 
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#36
BassFishingInAmerica said:
A fact, known by some and unknown to many, is that Paul McCartney never learned to read music. However, if you don't happen to find yourself in the most popular band of all time, reading sheet music can only benefit a musician. I, personally, would recommend at least learning to read tabs (which doesn't take being a genius). Unless you plan on becoming a studio musician, reading sheet music is a bit overrated. BTW, I'm one of the older dudes you were referring to. Music theory has helped me more than anything, as far as musical knowledge. Musical ability is different. I would just say keeping playing often, listen to many styles and try to learn as many songs as you can.
Click to expand...

I know he says that, but I don't believe it for a minute.
 
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#37
Learning to read music is relatively easy, and there are tons of teachers that can help you. Learning to have a great musical imagination (inner ear) takes a lot longer, but is also something you can learn over time. Why limit your possibilities by not learning something? Knowledge is power.
 
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#39
Space Pickle said:
I know he says that, but I don't believe it for a minute.
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I don't think Paul McCartney would have any reason to intentionally deceive anyone. One reason I can believe he doesn't read music is that I knew a piano player who could play anything. A way better pianist than Paul McCartney, and he couldn't read a lick of music. Being a great songwriter doesn't require being able to read it.
 
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#40
In my experience a lot of rock guys like to pretend that they don't actually know anything about music. I guess it adds to the mystique or whatever. It's hard to imagine someone having a career in music that almost spans a lifetime and not picking up a fact or two about reading, even by accident.
 
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