Check out Invalid Link Removed. He will lightly anchor his thumb on the edge of the neck or the pickup but most of the time he floats. He moves his hand so much even when he's anchoring he's mostly floating.
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Where to anchor your thumb?
- Thread starter Myrriad
- Start date
Check out Invalid Link Removed. He will lightly anchor his thumb on the edge of the neck or the pickup but most of the time he floats. He moves his hand so much even when he's anchoring he's mostly floating.
If I'm playing near the bridge, my thumb rests over the E string (a bit like Steve Harris, unless I'm playing the E). If I'm up near the neck, I place my thumb under the strings. It feels natural.
Maybe in the initial, awkward phase, but now I feel faster (and more consistent on muting) with floating thumb. I'll never go back to anchoring.
I dont move my thumb AT ALL. I can show you the gouge my Thumbnail has worn in my Bass. Right through the Varathane, 1/4 inch into the body...lol
It switches a lot, sometimes I use the pickup as an anchor sometimes I use the E, sometimes I float. It's like my right hand has a mind of its own.
As usual this subject always has, anecdotal evidence, personal preference and observation, focused citation of other players, and of course justification of use.
What this means of course is, info not grounded in fact, that applies to the given situation of the player using it.
Floating thumb or fixed anchor share the same criteria, but they will present symtoms of there use in different areas of the body if there any any to show.
First off the common problem they share is pressure.
Pressure cannot be seen, we cannot be aware of it all the time, so we can never be sure how we use it.
With a fixed anchor, just how much pressure do you actually need to "fix" the the anchor?
The thumb is a very flexable part of the hand, as such it can get over use from many other sources during the course of a day, so that means ober the course of a week, a month.etc...so a life time.
So usually it is thumb joint pain in the CMC joint, at the base of the thumb, that presents the sympoms.
This joint is prone to injury as you automatically put you hands up to defend your self, or put out your hands to break a fall.
So it is at the forefront of all hand use, and in todays world of gadgets, games remote controls, push buttons etc...the thumb is available for mis-use and over use.
With floating thumb there is no contact, as such, so what holds the hand in place to make it "float?"
Again it is a pressure issue, as it is the shoulder that controls the "float" the shoulder will present symptoms if any.
It will be in the "Rotor-cuff" area we expect to find pain or stiffness.
Similar to the action of the Thumb, the shoulder can rotate the arm in a circle, though it is a flatter plane due to the fact have different types of joint, but that circular motion is similar (the thumb can do it on an up-right plane) because it need lubrication to do so.
This classifies them as "synovial" joints as the use fluid, not only to lubricate the joint, but it has shock absorbing features as well.
Even though this is a simple over view, you can start to see that the joints have common features and can share common injuries (such as dislocation) and symptoms. Some times an injury may present itself days if not week after it happened, so the task you are doing when it does may not be the cause.
This cannot discount any genetic weakness, injury or illness, just because you do not have Arthritis now, does not discount the fact you may.
So when you play bass and your thumb begings to hurt, bass playing may not be the cause, it just shows the symptoms of a weakness, an old injury, fatigue etc.
There are many reasons why you have a problem, but do not associate it with the task you are doing, or the last few tasks you done that day.
If it is a cumlative effect then it can be everything you do, not any one thing.
If you fit the profile of a general amatuer or home player, you work all day then practice in the evening, even if you are tired. So you have a day of hand use, then come home and then put it through even more extremes of stamina and dexterity.....so it is no surprise that you will feel discomfort or pain occasionally.
This is not all down to playing bass, your choosen time of practice is a contributing factor as well...your are still using you hands when you should be resting them.
For me and other pros it is different, we can practice (as i do) first thing after breakfast, so i am fresh, relaxed, rested and whats more i have taken on calories and fluids to fuel any practice.
Our other factor is our use is not a constant use, we play in small time frames, so we have have many short rests in-between our use...we do not play for hours on end as a rule.
If you gig, then your gigs will be in the evening, so again after a day of use, you then put your hands through even more at the very time they should be resting.
So diet, fluids, warm ups, stretches etc, all need to be part of your playing and practice, to give you body the energy it needs to support and fuel the need.
For example, your arm is heavy, if you are tired you cannot support it well, so if you use a fixed anchor you will lean on your thumb...to much pressure, if you use a floating technique you will not support the shoulder properly, but rather than pressure, you apply more tension to support the use. This may present itself as a stiff/sore neck or shoulder or both.
Like pressure, tension is an un-seen force that we cannot see or feel at the time, but we will feel there effects as we warm and cool down after the task (anyone that has not played a racket sport, or played one in a while, does not suffer the effects of it as the do it, it is usually the next day they suffer with sore/stiff legs), so again any over-use of tension may not be noticable at the time of use.
So in finishing, learn to be aware of pressure and tension in your playing and posture, good posture matters...trust me, If ou do not already use warm ups/downs, then add them, and like wise to some basic stretches.
If you address your use you can help you body to maximise what you want to do. Both technoques are not really responsible for any problems, that is why a high number of players use them, but what you do not know and cannot see is how long they use it for, and the presence of presure or tension.....and if there was, how they relieved.
if this post has raised any questions, post them here or PM me, if i can answer them i will.
What this means of course is, info not grounded in fact, that applies to the given situation of the player using it.
Floating thumb or fixed anchor share the same criteria, but they will present symtoms of there use in different areas of the body if there any any to show.
First off the common problem they share is pressure.
Pressure cannot be seen, we cannot be aware of it all the time, so we can never be sure how we use it.
With a fixed anchor, just how much pressure do you actually need to "fix" the the anchor?
The thumb is a very flexable part of the hand, as such it can get over use from many other sources during the course of a day, so that means ober the course of a week, a month.etc...so a life time.
So usually it is thumb joint pain in the CMC joint, at the base of the thumb, that presents the sympoms.
This joint is prone to injury as you automatically put you hands up to defend your self, or put out your hands to break a fall.
So it is at the forefront of all hand use, and in todays world of gadgets, games remote controls, push buttons etc...the thumb is available for mis-use and over use.
With floating thumb there is no contact, as such, so what holds the hand in place to make it "float?"
Again it is a pressure issue, as it is the shoulder that controls the "float" the shoulder will present symptoms if any.
It will be in the "Rotor-cuff" area we expect to find pain or stiffness.
Similar to the action of the Thumb, the shoulder can rotate the arm in a circle, though it is a flatter plane due to the fact have different types of joint, but that circular motion is similar (the thumb can do it on an up-right plane) because it need lubrication to do so.
This classifies them as "synovial" joints as the use fluid, not only to lubricate the joint, but it has shock absorbing features as well.
Even though this is a simple over view, you can start to see that the joints have common features and can share common injuries (such as dislocation) and symptoms. Some times an injury may present itself days if not week after it happened, so the task you are doing when it does may not be the cause.
This cannot discount any genetic weakness, injury or illness, just because you do not have Arthritis now, does not discount the fact you may.
So when you play bass and your thumb begings to hurt, bass playing may not be the cause, it just shows the symptoms of a weakness, an old injury, fatigue etc.
There are many reasons why you have a problem, but do not associate it with the task you are doing, or the last few tasks you done that day.
If it is a cumlative effect then it can be everything you do, not any one thing.
If you fit the profile of a general amatuer or home player, you work all day then practice in the evening, even if you are tired. So you have a day of hand use, then come home and then put it through even more extremes of stamina and dexterity.....so it is no surprise that you will feel discomfort or pain occasionally.
This is not all down to playing bass, your choosen time of practice is a contributing factor as well...your are still using you hands when you should be resting them.
For me and other pros it is different, we can practice (as i do) first thing after breakfast, so i am fresh, relaxed, rested and whats more i have taken on calories and fluids to fuel any practice.
Our other factor is our use is not a constant use, we play in small time frames, so we have have many short rests in-between our use...we do not play for hours on end as a rule.
If you gig, then your gigs will be in the evening, so again after a day of use, you then put your hands through even more at the very time they should be resting.
So diet, fluids, warm ups, stretches etc, all need to be part of your playing and practice, to give you body the energy it needs to support and fuel the need.
For example, your arm is heavy, if you are tired you cannot support it well, so if you use a fixed anchor you will lean on your thumb...to much pressure, if you use a floating technique you will not support the shoulder properly, but rather than pressure, you apply more tension to support the use. This may present itself as a stiff/sore neck or shoulder or both.
Like pressure, tension is an un-seen force that we cannot see or feel at the time, but we will feel there effects as we warm and cool down after the task (anyone that has not played a racket sport, or played one in a while, does not suffer the effects of it as the do it, it is usually the next day they suffer with sore/stiff legs), so again any over-use of tension may not be noticable at the time of use.
So in finishing, learn to be aware of pressure and tension in your playing and posture, good posture matters...trust me, If ou do not already use warm ups/downs, then add them, and like wise to some basic stretches.
If you address your use you can help you body to maximise what you want to do. Both technoques are not really responsible for any problems, that is why a high number of players use them, but what you do not know and cannot see is how long they use it for, and the presence of presure or tension.....and if there was, how they relieved.
if this post has raised any questions, post them here or PM me, if i can answer them i will.
As a lifelong student of the mechanics of playing the bass I often read your posts with no small interest. But the dismissive arrogance of statements like the above severely lessens my interest to continue reading. No one likes to be consistently talked down to the way you do.
And not everyone who can't clearly articulate what they're doing and why they're doing it is wrong. Something I learned studying Alexander Technique is that many physical things I was doing naturally and without thought were mechanically completely sound.
No, in fact I feel faster and more consistent. But I do remember there being about a week learning curve.
Thanks for the comments on how i present the info in the way i do.
So here is the reason why anyone may see it as condecending or read in to what i say as arrogance.
We are on an internet form that deals with all ages, all nationalities, all standards of learning and maybe those with learning difficulties.
So if you are twelve year old European student reading what i write then you need to be able to relate to it because English will not be your first language.
If you are an English speaking adult you may see the presentation as talking down to you, but the info is relevent, so it is presentation is not the point, it is the content.
So yes it is presented in a child like manner, because it has to cover a wide target of appeal.
As i do not have the time to present it to any one group of players, it aims to hit the lowest mark, because if they cannot come to my level of understanding, then it is my responsibility to come down to theirs.....if that is what you perceive as talking down, rather than trying to relate i can only apologise for the misunderstanding.
As for arrogance, again i will assume you mean the opening statement of the post.
What this tells anyone reading it is that the subject is not new, it has been discussed on TB before, that is why it use the word "usual and lists the "usual" reasons players give for what they do.
I do not make these reasons up, these have been genuine questions, reasons and obsevations of TB users through the years. so they are the ones usually appearing again and again each time this subject come up.
No matter how often a topic is covered, it will always be new or the first time for someone to think about, so it will always re-appear...that is the nature of teaching, that is the reach of the Internet.
The final part you quoted from me, tells anyone that read all the post that there is room for individuality, thats why i say,
"it applies to the given situation the player finds themselves in"...
so if it work for you then fine.
But at least try and understand and know why it works for you,... or may not.
In the years to come if you have problems the chance to put it right may not be an option.
If you base your techniques on that of another player, and they develop problems, then you may develop the same ones if the technique is the cause.
The very last part of my post, offers the chance to raise questions or PM me if there are any.... or to gain more info on any specific point i raised.
You may again read something else into this reply, but if you take no real interest in what i do, or get to know me and my style then you will form a distorted opinion of who i am and what i write.
I usually press my thumb into the face of the instrument, since there aren't any places on my bass (Epiphone EB-0) that sound right when I pluck near them.
I anchor on the pup of my p bass or neck pup if I'm playing another bass. I somehow manage to mute with the fingers of my right hand. I'm not sure how I do it, I'm sure it's very unorthodox and not recommendable, but I seem to make it work.
The thread is sort of bogus, and illuminating at once. An 'anchor' is a heavy immovable object. I tend to 'rest' my thumb in various places as I chase the sound I want for a situation. In a driving, repetitive groove, I will 'anchor' my thumb to use as leverage for the attack. For a ballad? I might rest it on the bottom of the fingerboard, for a lighter tone. For something that demands agility? I'm usually too busy to consider it, but it's not 'anchored'
I didn't think he was dismissive or condescending at all. He's just pointing out that all we have is anecdotal evidence and you can't really come to a conclusion without seeing what the OP is actually doing. I have no idea how you read that from what he said...
