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Which is loudest?

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by semborg, Mar 30, 2005.


  1. Is 4x10 louder than 2x10 + 1x15?
    (Generally)
     
  2. Sutton

    Sutton

    Mar 3, 2005
    Plainwell, MI
    louder?
    Well, a 410 will appear to be louder because it is pushing more air. And the 15 could sound extremely loud since it'll be playing lows, and thus, vibrating things. But if you're talk8ing loudness in terms of wattage, then they should all be equal.
     
  3. Is 4x10 pushing more air?
    Now I start trying calculate. Correct me if I am wrong.

    4x10 area:
    10/2=5
    5*5*pi=78.5
    78.5*4=314
    (where pi is 3,14)

    2x10 + 1x15 area:
    78.5*2=157
    15/2=7,5
    7,5*7,5*pi=176,625
    177+157=334

    With my calculation 2x10 + 1x15 has a bigger area (334) than 4x10 (314).

    Am I correct?
     
  4. yes, a 15 pushes more air than 2 10s.
     
  5. billfitzmaurice

    billfitzmaurice Commercial User

    Sep 15, 2004
    New Hampshire
    Owner, Bill Fitzmaurice Loudspeaker Design
    Insufficient data. However, the 2x10/1x15 arrangement in most cases will work to a much lower frequency than a 4x10, so if a deeper tone is what you want that's likely the better route.
     
  6. Sutton

    Sutton

    Mar 3, 2005
    Plainwell, MI
    Oh wow, I though he/she was comparing a 410 to a 210 to a 115, I didnt realize it was a 410 to a 210+115. Then the 210+115 will push more air :-\
     
  7. aha, no problem man :)
    I am a he.
     
  8. Sutton

    Sutton

    Mar 3, 2005
    Plainwell, MI
    Lets look at the 212+210 setup though:
    2x10 + 2x12 area:
    78.5*2=157
    12/2=6
    6*6*pi=113
    113*2=226
    226+157=383

    Or an 118+210 setup:
    78.5*2=157
    18/2=6
    9*9*pi=254
    254+157=411

    Lol, I'm bored, sorry
     
  9. Passinwind

    Passinwind I Know Nothing Supporting Member

    Now I start trying calculate. Correct me if I am wrong.

    4x10 area:
    10/2=5
    5*5*pi=78.5
    78.5*4=314
    (where pi is 3,14)

    2x10 + 1x15 area:
    78.5*2=157
    15/2=7,5
    7,5*7,5*pi=176,625
    177+157=334


    The problem with these calculations is that 10 inch speakers are 10 inches at the mounting centers for the bolts/screws, and the radiating area is nowhere near that big. Same with 15s as well. You also haven't taken any coupling or cancellation effects of multiple drivers into account. Now consider that you're looking at truncated conical sections, not two dimensional round plates, and it appears to be a bit of a can o' worms, no? :cool:
     
  10. Tash

    Tash

    Feb 13, 2005
    Bel Air Maryland
    Time to bust out the TI93s...
     
  11. billfitzmaurice

    billfitzmaurice Commercial User

    Sep 15, 2004
    New Hampshire
    Owner, Bill Fitzmaurice Loudspeaker Design
    Very big can of worms. Cone area alone doesn't tell you squat. You also need to know excursion, sensitivity, bandwidth (-3db) and power handling. Knowing those five specifications can allow you to make a reasonable estimate of a drivers potential output capability. If any one of those factors is unknown an accurate prediction is not possible.
     
  12. Pickebass

    Pickebass Supporting Member

    Jul 12, 2004
    San Antonio, TX
    IME the 410s tend to be louder. However, the 210/115 combination tends to be fuller and provides more depth to sound. Not exactly apples to apples.
     
  13. pickles

    pickles Supporting Member

    Mar 23, 2000
    Ventura, CA
    It is possible to overthink things, guys. :p

    Any given 4x10 will not be much different in volume than a 210+15 of the same design, assuming you get the total impedence preseneted to the amp the same.

    They will sound quite different, though.

    semborg -- just tell us what rig you are running that is not loud enough for you, and we can make specific reccomendations.
     
  14. R Briere

    R Briere Bass-ically Yours

    After reading all of those numbers, I've decided to quit playing bass and take up the piccolo. :)
     
  15. pickles

    pickles Supporting Member

    Mar 23, 2000
    Ventura, CA
    I used to used an Eden D-210XLT + Eden D-115XLT, and now use an Aguilar GS-410, both with Ampeg Pre and ~1000w power amps. I find the sounds so different that it is hard to compare the "loudness". The old rig sounded fuller and fatter, and loud as hell ... the new rig is punchy and fast and loud as hell.
     
  16. Kael

    Kael Supporting Member

    Dec 26, 2004
    Oklahoma City

    I'm old school baby. Straight up TI-85!
     
  17. ihixulu

    ihixulu Supporting Member

    Mar 31, 2000
    getting warmer
    Heh, my flute goes lower than your piccolo :hyper: ;)
     
  18. illidian

    illidian

    Jul 2, 2004
    I would think that a 4x10 would sound louder, but the 2x10 + 1x15 would sound bigger. This is assuming everything is the same, etc.

    The 4x10 will sounds louder because our ears hear mids more, which the 4x10 should have more of. However, the the 2x10 + 1x15 will sound bigger because it will give a "fuller" response.

    Disclaimer: Which sounds louder or bigger or anything is all dependant on the cabinet(s) and speakers. The best way to find out is to try the exact combination you're looking at and use your own ears.
     
  19. Bob Lee (QSC)

    Bob Lee (QSC) In case you missed it, I work for QSC Audio! Gold Supporting Member Commercial User

    Jul 3, 2001
    Costa Mesa, Calif.
    Technical Communications Developer, QSC Audio
    Which is longer, a piece of string or a piece of yarn? ;)
     
  20. Kael

    Kael Supporting Member

    Dec 26, 2004
    Oklahoma City
    Ooh, ooh, I know! :hyper:

    The yarn right......