• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Why am I not loud?

#22
pipedreams said:
T The svt 8-10 is 800 watts and my set up that i'm thinking about buying would be 700 watts, so hypothetically, I should have almost the loudness as the 8-10...
Click to expand...

Wrong. The number of cones has a major influence on loudness. Forget about wattage. Wattage is about the least important factor. It just happens to be easy to slap on a spec sheet, and everyone thinks it matters.

Treat it like a gas-mileage figure; your mileage will vary.

Loudness depends on cabinet design. Number of speakers. Equalization settings.

And two guitarists with 412s will bury every bassist around. Remember that your ears are over 100 times more sensitive in the upper mids than in the bass. So you're already at a huge disadvantage playing to the average human. To get a 60Hz signal sounding as loud as a 2KHz one takes +20dB, which is 20 times the power---assuming you had cabs that could handle it.

The answer is that the band must split the audio spectrum so that the bass has an area without competition. Same as you not burying the kick drum.
 
#23
So am i getting this right: Even if I have a 500 watt cab and a 200 watt cab the head will only pump 200 watts into each cab, kind of like a lowest common denominator type deal? If thats the case it would be louder just going through the 500 watt cab. Could biamping it change that? And the guitar players have crappy Marshall 4-12 cabs and heads, the cheap $600 set up not a tube amps or anything.
 
#24
No, if your head puts out 1200 watts at 4 ohms and your two cabs together are 4 ohms, it will push all of that power into those speakers if you turn it up and EQ it just right (or wrong). ...And then they will probably be no more.
 
#25
If both cabs are on a single power amp, you can't go beyond 400w (200 goes to each cab) before risking damage to the smaller cab. Try just the 15 so you're not limited by the 210.

Not biamping, but running stereo (two power amps). That allows you to set each amp appropriately for each cab. You can push the 15 more than the 210.

The guitarists can destroy you with a 50w amp; they don't need the best. A Fender Twin can overpower anything too. It's the frequency range of the instrument, not the brand or quality of the amp. Physics.
 
#26
Well at this point, I'm just wondering if I should even bother with getting a svt 4-10he, because some of you guys are suggesting that it wouldn't help that much. Maybe I should just turn downs my lows, tell the guitar players to turn down a little bit, and deal with not being that loud.
 
#27
pipedreams said:
Well at this point, I'm just wondering if I should even bother with getting a svt 4-10he, because some of you guys are suggesting that it wouldn't help that much. Maybe I should just turn downs my lows, tell the guitar players to turn down a little bit, and deal with not being that loud.
Click to expand...


That would be my suggestion..............at least until you can save up and get some QUALITY cabinets.
 
#28
Yes! Try that first! Cut a bit of your deep lows, maybe lightly boost the low mids (say 500Hz). If you can get the guitars to thin out their bottom end, that gives you the low mids to work with. Even if they don't turn down, remind them that you're going to actually play a TRUE bass part. All they're doing is slapping the bottom string when they play chords. Boring.

You've got plenty of power and good speakers, so if you can reduce the competition it should work. Of course, every guitarist thinks his amp sounds best at 11.
 
#29
No, no, no!

1) You'd want a SVT-410HLF. The HE doesn't go as low.
2) If 3 fails, you'll need more cab to keep up.
3) Tinker with your EQ. My SVT-II is at half the volume and sounds twice as good as when I had it scooped. Now the bass is a part of the music, not a muddy rumble.

Actually, as a priority list, go from 3 to 1.


*edited for a mistake
 
#31
Ampeg makes multiple product lines just like everyone else. They have several levels of product, and six different 410s. (By slapping the name SVT on everything, they're hoping you won't notice. It would be like GM labeling 30 different cars "Cadillac," from Chevies on up.)

But first work on your EQ and limiting the guitars, before spending more money. If you don't get that part solved, more equipment won't help.
 
#32
I dont even think an svt 4-10hlf could fit in my car, but the svt 4-10he could. I have a small hyundai elantra. That has been the main factor in me buying cabs not the price of the cab, but the size of the cab.
 
#33
SVT cabinets certainly aren't bad. You just have a WHOLE lotta amp and a medium amount of speaker. It's all about the cones. More speakers = more capability to produce sound.

For the record, I fit an SVT810E in the back of a 2005 Honda Civic Si (it was a hatchback.)
 
#35
pipedreams said:
So am i getting this right: Even if I have a 500 watt cab and a 200 watt cab the head will only pump 200 watts into each cab, kind of like a lowest common denominator type deal? If thats the case it would be louder just going through the 500 watt cab. Could biamping it change that? And the guitar players have crappy Marshall 4-12 cabs and heads, the cheap $600 set up not a tube amps or anything.
Click to expand...

STOP thinking about WATTAGE. It ONLY determines how much power you can put into your cabinets before the speaker coils melt, and has VERY little to do with how loud your rig is. As posted by countless posters above.

Your 2 cab (500/200) setup can only take 400W because if you pump more than that into the setup, half of the power is going to the 200W cab and if it gets more than 200W it will fail given enough time.

A 500W cab by its own, on the other hand, is not louder than a (500/200) setup that can only take 400W, because you now have about half as much speaker area. If you're going for LOUD, you want to maximize efficiency, speaker count, and speaker area. Not wattage. A 200W 8x10 would probably blow your rig away.

Oh yeah, and EQ. Cut the lows, boost the lowmids.
 
#36
christw said:
No, no, no!

1) You'd want a SVT-410HLF. The HE doesn't go as low or handle as much power.
2) You'll need more cab to keep up. A 410 + 115 is a traditional and well-accepted rig. Never a bad idea. It'll certainly help.3) Tinker with your EQ. My SVT-II is at half the volume and sounds twice as good as when I had it scooped. Now the bass is a part of the music, not a muddy rumble.

Actually, as a priority list, go from 3 to 1.
Click to expand...

You have to remember, the OP wants to add the 4X10 to a 1X15 that is rated at 200 watts. That 1X15 will be NO help at all.

pipedreams said:
what would you consider quality cabinets? I always though ampeg svt cabs were top of the line. I do understand that i have pretty weak cabs though.
Click to expand...

Just because the cab is an Ampeg, does not mean it is great. Cabs with a 200 watt rating are usually "entry level" gear.

For that head, you need to step up to cabs loaded with quality drivers that not only have a higher wattage rating, but are also more suitable to the frequencies of the bass guitar. That 200 watt 1X15 probably can only take about 50 - 75 watts of low end before farting out and turning to mud.

The thing to remember here is - you get what you pay for.
 
#38
Bass_Pounder said:
You have to remember, the OP wants to add the 4X10 to a 1X15 that is rated at 200 watts. That 1X15 will be NO help at all.
Click to expand...

Woops! You got me there. I'm gonna fix that.

Anyways, to the OP: A simple rule, although not totally true, is that you want your bass cabinets total rated watted (RMS) to be equal or greater than that of the head you're using so you don't ruin your speakers. That's all that has to do with it for the purposes of this discussion. You're gravely overpowering your speakers if you're putting 1200w into that system. Half of that (600w) is going into a speaker rated at 200w. It will be the first to fail.
 
#40
every time I've seen or played with comeback kid their bassist has used a fender P bass (american or highway 1) and ran a sansamp BDDI in front of this amp. doesn't help you much with the volume, but for overall tone you might want to look into that.
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back