Why are 5-string P-basses so rare?

[Fuzzbass]

Apparently some people think that they can

Some people have ACTUALLY PLAYED the pickups you are "dubious" about for extremely vague reasons, and like them.

 

[Skip Chucker]

Roscoe is building and selling them.

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These are all just from one store.


I'm having them build me an LG-3005 PJ.

 

[Killed_by_Death]

Some people have ACTUALLY PLAYED the pickups you are "dubious" about for extremely vague reasons, and like them.

If they're willing to accept the >>compromises<<, that's on them

I'm noticing the basses in the photo above has the proper design, extended coils on the 2-pole side.

Are those the kinds of pickups you're talking about that people are playing and liking?
I could get behind that design, but others I'm dubious about & remain so.

edited to add the explanation about compromises

 

[matante]

*an apostrophe does not ordinarily make a plural, but it does in this case. There: I feel better.

Wrong. It's Ps and Js, not P's and J's.

It's also '50s and '60s, not 50's and 60's.

 

[Killed_by_Death]

Those 3/2 design changes are obviously not difficult,

I think the first time they needed to make the change it wasn't easy. They would have had to change the wire diameter & the amount of windings & experiment.

 

[chris_b]

Same here! Mike Lull PJ5 with rosewood neck.

+1

My Lull is 3 tone sunburst, tort and rosewood. I love it for looking just how a bass should look!

 

[Ric5]

Nice. That's becoming a popular pickup combination. I lust after a Sandberg like that and am a moment of weakness away from writing an expensive email to Nino Valenti about one. Bet it sounds good, let me know if you ever play it out around here.

Yes it is a good combination. I also have a 3 band preamp and a toggle for the bridge pickup for single/series/parallel operation

Also the bass is a frankensteined 4-2-5 parts bass.

And it looks cool

 

[Ric5]

The 3/2 pole pickup should cancel hum the same as a 2/2 pickup.

It is not the number of poles it is the number of coils that cancels hum.

 

[Killed_by_Death]

Incorrect, it's the size of the coil.

A coil with the same diameter of wire as another with the same number of coils & a different coil length or diameter will generate a different output level than the smaller or larger coil.

To say that's incorrect goes directly against the laws of Physics.

I explained this twice previously (even giving milliVolt examples), how are people not getting it?

 

[Stevorebob]

To repeat myself, I'm not commenting that they hum or they're noisy.
I'm commenting that compromises are necessary in the design to make them completely hum-canceling. Why are you guys not getting that part?

The only design I'd trust is that reverse-p with the extended 2-pole coil.

I think the point being missed is that the compromises to have a hum-free split-coil 5-string are not a significant engineering challenge and they have a marginal negative impact on the tonal result. This has been done, and done again, and for a long time. It does not have to be believed. It works. Really, it does.

 

[Killed_by_Death]

not a significant engineering challenge

Are you certain of that?
I'm betting it wasn't that simple the first time around.

They would have needed to make compromises, what were they?

 

[Stevorebob]

Are you certain of that?
I'm betting it wasn't that simple the first time around.

My friend, I am certain. I have played the instruments.

 

[Killed_by_Death]

I assume you're using "friend" loosely, considering how we butt heads like this

You played them, you didn't design the pickup
The level of challenge is unknown to you.

Anyway, I'd rather discontinue this "discussion".
I know what I know & that's that. I'm also not an ERB player.

 

[Stevorebob]

I assume you're using "friend" loosely, considering how we butt heads like this

No, I am using “friend” respectfully. You’re a smart guy, clever too, but occasionally you lock into some truths that just aren’t. I’m merely trying to help you see another perspective. Peace, my friend.

 

[Killed_by_Death]

There is truth to it, they had to make compromises to get the noise cancellation to work. (Aguilar & Nordstrand got it right!, w/o compromising)
The initial design was probably not that easy, unless they have heaps of experience like Lindy Fralin.

 

[Stevorebob]

There is truth to it, they had to make compromises to get the noise cancellation to work.
The initial design was probably not that easy, unless they have heaps of experience like Lindy Fralin.

Yes, indeed. The thing is, every good pickup maker can do it. It’s been figured out for a long time. That’s all I’ve been trying to share.

 

[Killed_by_Death]

I'm just trying to dispel the myth that you only need two coils to cancel all the hum, it's simply not the only requirement.

 

[Stevorebob]

I'm just trying to dispel the myth that you only need two coils to cancel all the hum, it's simply not the only requirement.

I think the pickup makers know that — whether or not the players do — and that’s kinda all that matters.

 

[Killed_by_Death]

Fender needs to go back to school. The hum-buckers in my MIM Blacktop Precision were almost as noisy as single-coils.

After seeing Nordstrand & Aguilar's take on a 5-string P-style pickup, I'm a bigger fan of their products than previously.
That's a very clever solution that everyone should follow.

Looks like DiMarzio has decided to not even be in the compromise, can't find their 5-string P-style pickups.

 

[Stevorebob]

Fender needs to go back to school. The hum-buckers in my MIM Blacktop Precision were almost as noisy as single-coils.

After seeing Nordstrand & Aguilars take on a 5-string P-style pickup, I'm a bigger fan of their products then previously.
That's a very clever solution that everyone should follow.

Looks like DiMarzio has decided to not even be in the compromise, can't find their 5-string P-style pickups.

Great! Now, how about 5-string Jazz hum-cancelling split-coils? They are all asymmetric — 3+2 — are all these inferior, prone-to-hum pickups, too?