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Why are our 412 cabinets different from guitarists?

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by remainthesame, Oct 6, 2013.


  1. remainthesame

    remainthesame

    Sep 24, 2008
    Hey guys, I was at a show the other day and I got to thinking...

    Most of the 412s I've seen have speakers placed diagonally and the cabinet is about the same dimensions as a 610.

    My question is, why don't they just make them square like guitar cabs? I'm sure there's probably a few manufacturers who do, but none that I've seen so far.

    I'm not looking for a 412 so you don't have to recommend me anything, I just want to know why they do it.
     
  2. Jazz Ad

    Jazz Ad Mi la ré sol Supporting Member

    You will also notice that they are a lot deeper. The same goes for 4x10s.
    It is a matter of tuning. Most guitar cabs are either closed or open, rarely ported.
    A guitar cab barely ever goes under 100 Hz. We use a lot more power and need to go much lower. It takes bigger cabs.
     
  3. remainthesame

    remainthesame

    Sep 24, 2008
    then why do we even bother with 410s? theyre smaller than 412s. if lower=bigger cabs, then why dont guitarists use the 410 and bassist use the 412?
     
  4. Because speaker size has nothing to do with how it performs :rolleyes:
     
  5. remainthesame

    remainthesame

    Sep 24, 2008
    no no no i know that. you guys arent understanding what im getting at. this isnt a noob question. im asking why dont they make 412s SQUARE like guitar 412s.

    i know drivers are tuned differently. i know speaker size doesnt matter. and thats the point i was trying to make when you quoted me.

    i can already tell this thread is going to be another giant misunderstanding
     
  6. Because of the internal volume the cab needs to work properly.

    If it was the same size as a guitar cab, it would have to be very deep (front to back), making it too weird of a shape to carry/transport.
     
  7. Chef

    Chef Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    May 23, 2004
    Columbia MO
    Staff Reviewer; Bass Gear Magazine
    Some builders do make square-ish bass 412's.
    Marshall does, I think.
     
  8. remainthesame

    remainthesame

    Sep 24, 2008
    im talking about the size of the CABINET not the drivers
     
  9. remainthesame

    remainthesame

    Sep 24, 2008
    thanks for chiming in chef. i figured that somebody made square 412s, but i was wondering if there was a specific advantage to making them diagonal.
     
  10. Chef

    Chef Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    May 23, 2004
    Columbia MO
    Staff Reviewer; Bass Gear Magazine
  11. Chef

    Chef Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    May 23, 2004
    Columbia MO
    Staff Reviewer; Bass Gear Magazine
    Personally, I like a taller cab, as it gets the sound up closer to my ears.
    This is why I mostly play two 112's, stacked vertical.

     
  12. boamedt

    boamedt Supporting Member

    Jul 2, 2008
    Santa Rosa, Ca
    The trace Elliot 1248 I believe that's the number was the 4X12 te made for their tube heads....it was a very square, look it up......
     
  13. Zoa

    Zoa

    Dec 28, 2009
    In addition to what Bass Pounder said, diagonal 412=somewhat less awful dispersion.
     
  14. halfjackson

    halfjackson

    Feb 19, 2010
    Boston, MA
    ^ Absolutely! I've also had success with different kick back designs. And given the choice between two 4x12 cabs, one square and one verticle, I'd choose the verticle one. Although, I'll never buy another 4x anything can again, as long as as I'm the one lugging it.
     
  15. Chef

    Chef Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    May 23, 2004
    Columbia MO
    Staff Reviewer; Bass Gear Magazine
    halfjackson: love the profile pic mate ;)
     
  16. The short answer.............

    Bass cabs are not the same size as guitar cabs because they need MORE internal room.

    If you take a guitar 4X12 cab and load it with bass speakers, it will most likely sound like ass.
     
  17. remainthesame

    remainthesame

    Sep 24, 2008
    sweeeeet
     
  18. SactoBass

    SactoBass A retired civil engineer who likes all-tube amps! Supporting Member

    OP: ^^^ this is getting closer to the real reason.

    Setting the drivers in a diagonal arrangement is to reduce comb filtering. The best arrangement is to have the drivers positioned perfectly vertical. Diagonal positioning of the cones is finding a happy medium between the worst positioning (horizontal) and the best positioning (vertical).
     
  19. halfjackson

    halfjackson

    Feb 19, 2010
    Boston, MA
    Thanks, Chef!
     

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