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Why aren't you using tube amps?

#61
I admit that I don't need super lightweight gear. I don't play all that many gigs, and my load-ins tend to be pretty moderate. I could haul everything on a cart. But being able to lift my rig with one finger is a pleasant luxury, especially in bad weather. And I'm curious about how the new gear sounds. So far I haven't experienced any compromises in the tone department.
 
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#62
I like bass amps that I like, regardless of whether they are tube or solid state. Turns out both of mine that I have owned over the past 21 years have been solid state.

I have a V4 guitar amp too, and that's fine for bass from time to time. Doesn't cut it for gigs, though. Too much square footage to carry to make it sound good, when I have a B-100R that IMO actually sounds better tonally.

I love a good old SVT, but hell no. I'm relatively lazy and cheap when it comes to amps, because I'm not a full time pro musician. And I drive a muscle car, so I need something that fits in the trunk.

My B-100R sounds great, lets me carry everything I need for the gig in one trip from the car, and has cost exactly $0.00 to maintain and repair since buying it new in '96 or '97. It lets me be lazy and cheap...and you wouldn't believe the number of compliments it has got on its tone. Yeah, it sounds great; obvious enough to me, since I chose it and have stuck with it for so long. But other bass players seem genuinely and routinely surprised by that, for some reason (as they think about having to get their 8x10 into their Corolla at the end of the night, and the next set of tubes they'll have to buy – all to play crummy dives for 10 bucks and a beer).

If I was a full time professional, I'd probably have an old, well-maintained SVT, a variety of cabs, and a solid state suitcase amp for a backup at gigs.

OTOH, for guitar, all my amps are tube amps (except for my belt clip or headphone amps). I haven't played anything solid state that sounds "right" to me. And tube guitar amps come plenty small and loud. I mostly use low-wattage combos for guitar (e.g. Princeton Reverb, Mesa Express, Ampeg J-12T, Gibson Skylark).
 
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#66
Nice thread!

I use a Tech21 VT500 at home which emulates an SVT through sansamp because both the Mesa Prodigy and Trace Elliot Hexavalve have rather noisy fans. This is also the backup amp I bring to gigs as it is small and convenient.

In the practice room and at gigs however, I always bring a tube amp.
 
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#67
Why aren't you using tube amps?
Often they're too heavy.
They also dictate a tone too much. I like it more transparent than what most tube amps can deliver.
Regardless of how reliable they may be, I#d have the feeling pof having to be extra careful when using a tube amp.
A Rheingold(www.rheingoldmusic.de) head would be tempting however - not as main amp, but for certain situations.
 
#69
flam said:
So I know the tube vs solid state thing gets beat to death. I'm not here for that. This is mostly for those of you who would like to use tube amps, but don't, so my question is more along the lines of:

What aren't tube amps doing that keeps you from using them?

Weight will surely be a big factor. How light would they have to get for you to consider it?

What other features aren't common to tube amps that you require?
Click to expand...
tl;dr: a lot of hassle for limited value and less flexibility

I would love to use tube amps live, but only use them when recording. Reasons for not using them live:

• Load-in: The tube heads I like are heavy and/or weird shaped, causing them to require an extra load in, or even their own special trip to carry them, whereas the class D head I'm using can be slung in a side-bag while carrying all my other stuff, allowing me to grab everything in one or two trips (depending on cab needs).

• Sonic improvement the audience hears is negligible, IMO: My class D head sounds amazing, and regardless of whether tube or ss, most of my bass tone the audience hears comes from a DI pumped into foh anyway. So for all the negatives of lugging an amp with a tube power section, it essentially just ends up being a stage monitor for my personal use. The audience isn't hearing the beautiful tube power amp tone. And if they are... meaning my stage volume is loud enough to affect FOH, that generally means it's too damn loud, jacking up the mix, and annoying the soundman.

• Less to worry about with SS: I know some might chime in and say "I've been using tubes for 95 years and 100,000,000 gigs and never had one problem", but tubes are made out of glass and sh*t happens. SS stuff busts too, its true, but worrying about fragile little glass jars inside the amp just adds to my stress.

• Less tone shaping possibilities (in general): I always find myself tweaking eq and other settings for the room. The tube amps I like have less eq options and front panel features compared to the class D amp I'm using now, which has a high pass filter, parametric eq, fx loop, lots of DI features, low and high boosts. I know some tube amps have some of that, but I haven't found one that has all of that.
 
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#72
On some level, we're buying commodities. On the one hand, we've got a product that's larger, heavier, and generally more expensive. Another product is smaller, lighter, and cheaper, and on top of that a lot easier to find and therefore replace and playtest.

You can talk about tone until the cows come home, but the gear I have gives me the tone I need at a price, size, and power that I can use. I'm not knocking tubes either - I've got a couple single ended tube amps and they're great. But comparing the pf50t and Traynor yba200 - they're both hard to find and pricey compared to a 500 watt micro head that will also be serviceable.
 
#73
Why not? Weight, and clean tone.
Also, I compared my Mesa Titan V12 against a Ampeg SVT made in 68. I was expecting to be blown away by the SVT..... Well, that did not even happen. Also compared my Ampeg SVT 4 against the SVT 2.... Same thing happened.

About weight, my Mesa Titan weights 26lb for 1200W, any SVT is at least 80lb for 300W. Make you choice.
I'm not saying all tubes a useless and meaningless. Just a matter of choices.
 
#76
flam said:
What aren't tube amps doing that keeps you from using them?
Click to expand...

Appearing in sub-compact, ultra-lightweight form factors without compromising any of the performance one gets in a ~75lb lead sled.

When someone can build a tube amp that is sonically indistinguishable from an Ampeg SVT in an 8lb package the size of a hotel bible I will buy it.

Wait, that's not entirely true: When someone can build a tube amp that is sonically indistinguishable from an Ampeg SVT in an 8lb package the size of a hotel bible I will consider buying it...and then quite probably I will pass and spend my money on something more useful to me. Because right now I already have a perfectly good sounding high performance bass amp in an 8lb package the size of a hotel bible. The fact that it's solid-state and/or that it doesn't sound indistinguishable from an Ampeg SVT has zero impact on it's applicability to the gigs I do, and hence no impact on its value to me.
 
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#78
flam said:
What aren't tube amps doing that keeps you from using them?
Click to expand...

When I started playing you could only get tube amps. Believe me it's a myth that all tube amps sound great. Many didn't.

My last tube amp was a Mesa 400+. I had some trouble with tubes blowing and the weight, about 56lbs in the case, became a problem so I moved to SS with a Thunderfunk. D class amps sound good enough these days to keep my interest.

As far as gear goes, I see no point in looking over my shoulder. Having said that I would buy another Thunderfunk if one came up at the right price but I see no benefit in tubes for me.
 

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