Why do I so rarely hear a MAJOR 3rd in a bassline?

[Altitude]

Bunch of 'em in Sweet Child O' Mine.

But I get what you're saying. Probably kids learning to shred avoid major 3rds because they sound too happy.

When R&B and Motown were turning into rock, there was a REALLY common bassline that starts on the root, then hits the major third and walks up to the 5th. Hear it in "Let's Get It On" played slow and about 500 different James Brown tunes played fast. But that's probably not the kind of rock you mean.

 

[Blissful_Lad]

I've never played on a guitar or electric fretted bass where the Major Thirds were in tune. They're always too sharp and unsettling.

Could be the reason no one likes them.

Pure Intonation vs. Equal Temperament

The Major 3rd Problem of All Guitars in the World

 

[gumbynotpokey]

I must listen to the wrong stuff. And worse, I play them ALL THE TIME.

 

[6Bass101]

the sound = no 'power'.

This. I had a bass teacher once tell me that lingering on the major 3rd (in rock) just deflates the chord.

 

[JimmyM]

It's called "the blues."

 

[obimark]

ANother Really Cool Major 3rd song- Aces High-Iron Maiden

 

[red_rhino]

TL;DR (At least, not all 5 pages so far)
What on Earth are you listening to that you never hear a Major 3rd in the bass line? Even the statement that it is rarely used is an invalid premise.

 

[Two-Spirit]

Ok theory heads, here's a question for you: Why do so few rock baselines ever have a major 3rd in them?

I'm sure there are exceptions, but I've been transcribing a bunch of classic and modern rock tunes (Rolling Stones, Grateful Dead, Radiohead) and I NEVER hear a major 3rd in these kind of songs!

And not only that, but when I'm comping under a guitar and piano, if I do try and work a major 3rd in, it almost always sounds like crap. OK, so I realize that I am answering my first question -- but, from a theory perspective, why is this so?

Thanks for any insight!

AC\DC back in black, Cream Crossroads. I'm assuming you're referring to thirds as a single note under a chord.

 

[inanimate_carb]

Nobody has a gig tonight, huh?

 

[Chrisk-K]

Sir Paul often used a maj 3rd. Ex) Hey Jude, C/E

 

[beans-on-toast]

Do you think that the dimished frequency of MAJOR 3rds is because some bass players write predictably and can't think outside the box?

 

[Bioflava]

AC\DC back in black, Cream Crossroads. I'm assuming you're referring to thirds as a single note under a chord.

Yeah, I should have been clearer in my OP... I meant in a bass line (could be a few notes) that's covering a given chord -- didn't mean a harmonic move by a major-third.

 

[basslicks]

Are you saying the third is like a third-wheel?

 

[mflaherty]

Can you find me a rock baseline with a major-3rd?



Yup, tons of 4ths and 5ths -- but those aren't maj-3rds! Here's our recent set list (just the covers):

• Rain (Beatles)
• Cocaine (JJ Cale)
• I shall Be Released (Dylan)
• Shakedown Street (Dead)
• Althea (Dead)
• Wolfman's Brother (Phish)
• Loving Cup (Stones)
• Harder they Come (Jimmy Clif)
• Dear Mr. Fantasy (Traffic)
• Stuck in the Middle (Steeler's Wheels)

Not a single major-3rd to be found AFAIK!

Lots of F#s in this transcription.

Can you find me a rock baseline with a major-3rd?



Yup, tons of 4ths and 5ths -- but those aren't maj-3rds! Here's our recent set list (just the covers):

• Rain (Beatles)
• Cocaine (JJ Cale)
• I shall Be Released (Dylan)
• Shakedown Street (Dead)
• Althea (Dead)
• Wolfman's Brother (Phish)
• Loving Cup (Stones)
• Harder they Come (Jimmy Clif)
• Dear Mr. Fantasy (Traffic)
• Stuck in the Middle (Steeler's Wheels)

Not a single major-3rd to be found AFAIK!

 

[Rip Van Dan]

Ok theory heads, here's a question for you: Why do so few rock baselines ever have a major 3rd in them?

I'm sure there are exceptions, but I've been transcribing a bunch of classic and modern rock tunes (Rolling Stones, Grateful Dead, Radiohead) and I NEVER hear a major 3rd in these kind of songs!

And not only that, but when I'm comping under a guitar and piano, if I do try and work a major 3rd in, it almost always sounds like crap. OK, so I realize that I am answering my first question -- but, from a theory perspective, why is this so?

Thanks for any insight!

Theoretically it should work with any major chord (as opposed to minor chords). Whether you play it at all, play it as a passing note or with a longer emphasis on it is a question of how it fits with the rest of the song. Bass lines to almost all the old rock and roll songs feature a major third in the bass line. A real common run back then was I, III, V, VI or I, III, IV, V as well as the more chromatic run I, III, IV, Augmented IV, V, where everything from the three through the five are chromatic (half-step) moves.

All the Chuck Berry stuff uses major 3rds and crazy amounts of blues songs use it, especially the slow blues. The Doors song "Light My Fire" used major 3rd in the I, III, V, III, V, run against minor 7th chords (Am7 and F#m7) as well as just about everything else that Ray Manzarek played with his keyboard bass under his left hand while playing chords and leads with his right hand for the Doors.

 

[glocke1]

This. I had a bass teacher once tell me that lingering on the major 3rd (in rock) just deflates the chord.

After I post this I'll probably go play a bunch of major thirds... but I don't understand how it can deflate the chord.

 

[joebar]

I swear sometimes you guys look for things to find. Things I didn't know needed to be found.
Major thirds are everywhere.

As you were-

 

[basslicks]

 

[6Bass101]

After I post this I'll probably go play a bunch of major thirds... but I don't understand how it can deflate the chord.

I think he meant that it sounds too pretty (some one mentioned this in another post), and just used "deflate" for lack of a better word.
I mean I still use them anyway.

 

[Bioflava]

OK, ok... Consider me educated that 1) lot's of song use major-3rds, but also that (as @SLO Surfer summarizes) 2) they often sound wrong in the rock context b/c they draw too much attention to the tonal center of power chords, are too pretty, or just are inappropriate in a tune that's mostly minor.

What I'm still struggling to understand from an applied theory standpoint is why, when, for example, I'm playing under a Cmaj7 vamp with a guitarist and a keyboardist, that the maj-3rds just don't sound great. In this context, they should reinforce the tonal center and sound strong, but instead they often get in the way of the piano or guitar.