Why have an onboard preamp if you don't tweak it?

[Jared Lash]

I've lost count of the number of times that I've seen guys state that they "always leave the preamp set completely flat" or have an active bass and yet "always run it passive".

Now, there are some benefits to having a buffer and a lowered impedance but that's something that can be accomplished with something like Creation Audio's Redeemer circuit and without an actual preamp.

Interestingly enough two people that fit the statements above are Fodera players, Janek Gwizdala and Richard Bona respectively. In that case, it's even more surprising since their basses have a very well regarded AND very expensive set of active controls courtesy of the Pope preamp.

Am I alone in thinking that this is odd?

 

[bongomania]

You're right, but I'd also guess that the people in question have not removed their Pope (or whatever other) preamps and swapped in a Redeemer to see if it makes a difference to them. They bought the really nice bass with the nice preamp, they like the way it sounds "flat", and they leave it at that.

Also, "flat" may not be "flat", really--the preamp may have a hardwired EQ profile even with knobs set to zero/noon.

 

[kraigo]

In the case of my Skyline 55-01, it's the perfect fretted five string for me, except it's not available passive. Another reason is to buffer the pickups so they don't lose high end to capacitance in the cable. A Redeemer circuit is an example.

I prefer passive basses, but I'd go for an on board buffer, especially if I ran it phantom with a TRS cable like EBS amps do for you.

KO

 

[cassanova]

They bought the really nice bass with the nice preamp, they like the way it sounds "flat", and they leave it at that.

That's the only logical reason I can think of as to why people would do it. If it doesn't sound good "flat," then why buy the thing?

 

[spade2you]

I do use EQ. Long ago, I'd use the EQ to boost my signal if I were to solo. I don't really solo any more, so I stopped.

Picked up some Rob Allen basses years later, which have a much hotter signal. Ended up boosting the EQ to get a little more volume. I soon discovered I liked the bass to be a little EQ'd so I could allow each bass to really speak in its' own voice. I then shaped my amp EQ to allow some amp influence but plenty of influence from each different bass.

 

[XtheDeadPawn]

I got a ATK305 that I tweak like crazy. I normally only leave the volume alone up about 75% or if I got it switched to the ATK setting (The Ray setting) it'll be up all the way as I feel every ray should be up all the way to get that classic pick punk ray click tone.

 

[Jared Lash]

I guess what confuses me about this phenomenon is why someone would bother with the controls in the first place.

I can certainly understand the "baked in" EQ of an onboard pre and how most do color the tone.

But in the case of a Fodera it makes little sense to me because the Pope pre is designed to be as uncolored as possible. Also, being custom instruments, why not just ask for the preamp to be installed without the holes/pots for the bass/mid/treble. You could easily get a bass that simply had controls for volume and balance with the EQ controls fixed in the "flat" position and not requiring knobs.

It just seems strange that if someone doesn't ever touch their preamp controls that they would bother having them at all on a custom instrument.

Clearly Anthony Jackson felt that way with HIS Fodera.

 

[David Jayne]

Clearly Anthony Jackson felt that way with HIS Fodera.

AJ is far, far pickier about tone than most. He tried a bunch of pre's, but felt they all added distortion. His bass is the result of many years of trials and custom builds leading up to the bass he plays today. I can't think of anyone who's put as much effort into it as he has.

 

[lowfreq33]

Leave the bass flat, dial in your tone on the amp's eq, then your bass eq is free to use for quick adjustments on the fly.

 

[cassanova]

It just seems strange that if someone doesn't ever touch their preamp controls that they would bother having them at all on a custom instrument.

For any on stage tweeks that might be needed for live performances.

 

[dukeorock]

I guess if your rig sounds best to you 'flat' (whatever that could possibly mean) then great! Myself...bit of a tweaker

 

[Munjibunga]

Leave the bass flat, dial in your tone on the amp's eq, then your bass eq is free to use for quick adjustments on the fly.

That's what I do. I like to be able to make changes for particular songs at the bass.

 

[Korladis]

Maybe they bought their basses because they love the way the bass feels to play, and the way it sounds just plugged into an amp?

Seems simple enough to me. I don't have any active basses, but if the bass felt amazing to me and sounded good with no adjustments, I dunno, maybe I'd get one. I played a Schecter Scorpion a while ago that was amazing and I would have considered buying if I had the money, despite not usually liking active basses.

 

[Jared Lash]

Leave the bass flat, dial in your tone on the amp's eq, then your bass eq is free to use for quick adjustments on the fly.

For any on stage tweeks that might be needed for live performances.

Certainly. That's what I do (when using an active bass) and I think what most players do. But then, anyone who takes that approach doesn't fit the description of someone who always leaves the bass set flat.

 

[Brad Johnson]

Doesn't seem odd to me at all. I can think of several reasons to have a preamp with EQ and not use it or have an active bass and only run it passive.

Preamps aren't only for EQ tweaks, they can also boost the overall signal. My Bartolini preamped basses have an internal gain control and I can make the bass appreciably hotter than passive and it makes a huge diffence back at my rig. I usually run my basses flat but I still have the ability to tweak on the odd chance that I might want to; showing the capabilities of the instrument to others, playing at lower than normal volume, etc.

Resale value. If a preamp is standard in a particular model, not having one typically won't help resale value. Most custom basses seem to have preamps. It's expected at the higher price points. I recently had a nice Clement that was a single pickup model with no preamp. Sounded great passive but I have no doubt it would've been easier to sell with a preamp and maybe a second pickup.

You get a bass and find out afterwards that you prefer running it passive. Sometimes this may not happen until years down the road. Seen it several times.

Tastes change.

It's better to have something and not use/need it than not have it and end up needing it, particularly in the case of a preamp which is usually a standard item on a higher dollar instrument. I can't recall any builders offering a discount for not having one so if you're paying for it anyway...

 

[MegaSwing]

Yup.

All things being equal, nothing is equal.

 

[bassbenj]

Certainly. That's what I do (when using an active bass) and I think what most players do. But then, anyone who takes that approach doesn't fit the description of someone who always leaves the bass set flat.

I agree, as "always" is not the same as "usually". I "usually" leave the preamp flat but that is certainly not "always". The main things that come to mind are playing a passive bass through a DI with no tone controls! Talk about feeling helpless! Another is when you have two basses on stage and switch. As others have noted I like to use the preamp on each bass as well as on the amp to achieve some kind of "compromise" where each bass is reasonably "dialed in" and all you have to do is grab it, yet the preamps on each still allow a certain degree of control while playing.

Personally I love passive tone, but sometimes you just need some control. Obviously handiest is EQ on the bass, next is EQ on a separate preamp, next is on the amp, and last is A DI with none at all and sound guy (if there is one) does it for you. The other side of that equation is that active bass preamps tend to not be as high quality as the ones in amps or separate preamps.

But "always" and "usually" are not the same thing.

 

[KingRazor]

It's because I don't like adjusting the preamps in active basses that I just want to have a buffer circuit. Gives all the benefits of a preamp other than EQ.

 

[SoVeryTired]

I have an active bass with 3-band EQ. Set flat. Why did I bother getting an active bass then? I didn't - I got the best feeling and sounding bass within my budget, and it happened to be active. 'Active' is just part of the bass, not a feature I specifically chose.

That being said, I'm starting to (with the PA guy's permission) boost the mids on occasion, so I'm starting to use the EQ more. But I can totally understand why people don't mess with the controls. It's like having a J bass and only using the bridge pickup, if that's your chosen sound - the neck pickup just came with the bass, like a free gift.

 

[tycobb73]

I have a bass with an active passive switch. Active sounds different than passive. Active is a little more midscooped. I always leave the controls flat and run it active.