Willie Nelson's timing

[martinc]

Hi,



Yes, live he was all over the place. I've heard stories of Willie and Merle from some of Merle's old bandmates. Sometimes Willie would sing the whole stanza, four measures worth of lyrics, in one measure. The band would look at each other wondering what was coming next. They would try to finish the stanza, unless Willie started the next stanza early. Sometimes he would, sometimes he wouldn't. It was the same thing with Merle.

Willie was much more measured in the studio. We try to stick more closely to the studio versions. But sometimes T-Willie will play around with the lyric timing, not enough to mess up the meter, usually. Just enough to be a bit authentic.

Thank you for your indulgence,

BassCliff

BassCliff: Yes..but you have not addressed WHY Willie Nelson is all over the place. Is it because, as his former 20 year bassplayer said, Willie "can't count"? Is it because he just likes fooling around with his phrasing but still knows enough to recover and know where the one is? Maybe it's a bit of both but I still believe his old bass player who should know the issue better than the rest of us.

 

[Fat Freddy]

Willie just blows where the blow blows him.......

 

[Ed Fuqua]

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[Badwater]

Willie Nelson is unique in many ways. But for me his voice and lyric timing is what sets him apart from many Texas musicians. Nevertheless, his behind or in front of the beat was consistent and had it's own groove factor separate from the melody line which added more dynamics to his songs and a touch of drama and tension you don't find with regular songwriting.

 

[ONYX]

Willie Nelson is unique in many ways. But for me his voice and lyric timing is what sets him apart from many Texas musicians. Nevertheless, his behind or in front of the beat was consistent and had it's own groove factor separate from the melody line which added more dynamics to his songs and a touch of drama and tension you don't find with regular songwriting.

The late, great Waylon Jennings said basically the same thing about Nelson---did it for dramatic effect and (maybe) to keep the band on their toes.

 

[martinc]

The late, great Waylon Jennings said basically the same thing about Nelson---did it for dramatic effect and (maybe) to keep the band on their toes.

Disagree with the bit about "maybe keeping the band on their toes." Willie played with a lot of different bands as a guest and I would think the last thing he was thinking about was testing the band.
There is lots of overthinking going on here on this thread. My take is that Willie is a creative guy and he sang and played that way. Likely no big deal in his mind.

 

[Coolhandjjl]

Lets ask Quincy Jones what he thinks of Willie...

 

[ONYX]

There is lots of overthinking going on here on this thread.

We do that a lot here on TB, don't we?

 

[martinc]

We do that a lot here on TB, don't we?

Onyx:

 

[Oddly]

What I find really interesting is that I'm getting the feeling that, for all Willie's timing/phrasing eccentricities, none of us would have him any other way.

 

[Pacman]

This has nothing to do with bass technique. Moved to Miscellaneous.

 

[StudioStuntz]

I met some dude on one of the casuals in the early seventies who told me Willie was auditioning bass players.

He also said that Willie would let his his new bandmates know that:
"If I catch you on weed...you're free'd, but if you're wired...you're fired!"

I guess he didn't want anyone speeding up his laid-back tempo.

 

[mellowinman]

Recently I've been playing along to a few Willie Nelson tunes with a view to doing them in a covers band.
I've never really listened to him while playing.
It may be just me, but he surely has an 'interesting ' approach to timing and phrasing.
The guy's a legend, of course, and I have to say I love how he puts his own spin on everything ...
but I think I'd be terrified to back him...

He's very proud of that timing. It's something he owns, and makes work, to the tune of being one of the most successful singer/songwriter/guitar player/artists in history.

Love Willie.

 

[Hurricane Jimmie]

BP has an interview with Corey McCormick who plays for Willie's son Lucas Nelson. Bee Spears advised him... "Whatever you do, don't follow Willie!"
I think WN's band are competent musicians who also have a long history with him... They get it.

 

[fhm555]

Willie and Lightnin Hopkins have something in common.
Dusty Hill told a story from back in the chitlin circuit days about jammin with Lightnin. After the set Hill is at the bar and someone asked him what it was like to play with Lightnin. Hill replied that it was cool, but Lightnin had some strange changes that caught him off guard. Unbeknownst to Hill, Lightnin was standing behind him as he related the tale of Hopkins’ strange song phrasing. He tapped Hill on the shoulder and when Dusty turned around Lightnin told him “Lightnin change when Lightnin wanna change” and walked off.

 

[baddarryl]

I wish I had read this thread before seeing him live last year. My dad loved him and I dnibble and dabble in country especially old school, but I am really a rocker at heart. We left a little disappointed that he really didn’t play very long and that seems to be a thread amongst these aging players. Maybe if I had read this thread I would’ve realized just how special it was Don’t get me wrong I realize how special it was just not the special. Kind a like Tom Petty on th. Kind a like Tom Petty on that first note you know who it is