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Wire nuts?

ishouldbeking

ishouldbeking

Feb 5, 2007
2,090
32
#1
I'm a complete electronics and wiring noob: having just bought a wiring harness from butch (bayou cables) I was wondering if connecting pickups via the included wire nuts is an ok idea?

I don't own a soldering iron and have never soldered anything so this seems like an idiot proof way to connect my pups. Is it a bad idea?

btw, the wire nuts included are the blue ones, and the harness looks like this:

Link Removed
 
#2
Yes, it's a bad idea.

Everybody was a noob at something when they started!

Strongly suggest you to teach yourself to solder in about 15 minutes tops. It won't cost much at Radio Shack for a cheapo soldering iron and some SILVER solder(preference).

Solder will not vibrate lose during a gig, at practice, or in the middle of that solo when the real good-looking audience members are staring at you!

Get a soldering iron, holder/stand, and some silver solder(not tin or lead-based).
Do it yourself.
Practice with other wire first.

Main things:
Heat the wire, solder, and the jack.
Avoid breathing the vapors coming off the solder.
While the solder is cooling, the wire must not be moved.
You won't need the solder wick(used to remove solder), fancy temperature controller, multiple tips, etc.

Reference sites:
http://www.mediacollege.com/misc/solder/
http://www.aaroncake.net/electronics/solder.htm

VIDEO(note he uses a very pointy tip because he's soldering very small holes.
For your jack, a standard flat tip is fine):
Invalid Link Removed

Thanks once again to Mr. B, my GREAT electronics teacher in the 70's and chief engineer of that great R&B station at the time in New Orleans WBOK, for showing us the RIGHT way to do this in our night school classes at Delgado.
 
#3
Hmm. I just watched a few how-to videos on soldering wires, one even from a guitar stand point... I'm sure I can learn how to do it... guess I'll just have to budget a little bit extra for the tools. Thanks for the advice!
 
#4
ishouldbeking said:
Hmm. I just watched a few how-to videos on soldering wires, one even from a guitar stand point... I'm sure I can learn how to do it... guess I'll just have to budget a little bit extra for the tools. Thanks for the advice!
Click to expand...
Do learn. Even if you don't use it often it may save your butt when something breaks on the road.

Wire nuts are for temporary testing only.
 
#5
Wire nuts can work fine for years and years but solder is better.

A usable iron, flux and solder from Radio Shack would run you about $10 to 15$.

Soldering isn't all that hard but it does require a bit of skill. Be sure to practice making the solder flow on some junk first and remember that you can kill your pots and caps by over heating them.
 
#6
I am not the world's worst solderer, but I'm pretty bad, and since I totally blew it with a new pickup install, I just ordered a couple harnesses from Butch today, too. He said he's including wire nuts as well. Quite frankly, I'm going to use them and I don't care if people find it acceptable or not. Nobody will know but me anyway...well, you all will too, but I don't have to deal with you all ;)

While I will agree that solder is the best way to go, wire nuts are fine, and will hold as long as solder, plus they have the extra added bonus of making pickup changes dirt simple. I have outdoor lights that are wired with wire nuts, and they've lasted close to 20 years. So if they'll hold up, I think my bass will, too.
 
#7
JimmyM said:
While I will agree that solder is the best way to go, wire nuts are fine, and will hold as long as solder, plus they have the extra added bonus of making pickup changes dirt simple. I have outdoor lights that are wired with wire nuts, and they've lasted close to 20 years. So if they'll hold up, I think my bass will, too.
Click to expand...
It's not that they don't work, but my main concern is that they'll come loose and fail or go intermittent at an inopportune time.
 
#8
They really don't come loose, though, unless you get the wrong size. But some people feel more comfy with solder connections, and I really can't blame them. Me, I have a better chance of it coming loose if I solder.
 
#9
Geez some of you guys amaze me. Wire nuts will work perfectly and are used on most major electrical projects from household to major industial. Look at your house wiring what do you thing it is held to together at contact points...wire nuts. I have had alot of electrical devices thru the years fail and a wire nut was never the cause. I agree in fine wire and electronics its not the norm but i thought to do this myself. If you are so worried they could come apart (they wont )take a wrap of black electrical tape around them.
 
#10
bassbully said:
If you are so worried they could come apart (they wont )take a wrap of black electrical tape around them.
Click to expand...
+1
All of my ELECTRICAL wiring connections with wire nuts have tape(Scotch 33) put on them. Still solder electronic connections though. My basses get beat on and even punched depending on which songs we play that gig. Hand-soldering pin connectors on a 24 channel snake cable in the 70's taught me both patience and good soldering practice.
 
#11
Solder...solder...SOLDER!!! PERIOD!

Guitar wiring is NOT house wiring. When resistance builds up in contact connections carrying any appreciable current due to galvanic reaction between the two mating surfaces, heat is generated, which further increases resistance in a vicious cycle of breakdown, to the point where so much heat can be generated that the mating conductors can weld themselves together, and the surrounding oxygen in the air or even in the copper, supports the process of oxidation. With low-level audio signals, it is slow degradation of signal, sometimes so slow that you might not notice problems until things are really suckin'!

Solder creates an intermediate alloy bond that prevents this from happening.

Galvanic reaction is a process whereas minute electrical currents are generated when the surfaces of two different metals touch. Even if both mating conductors are copper, unless the copper is 100% pure (almost impossible to guarantee), there will be problems, unless the impurities (trace metals) in both conductors are also exactly the same. You have a better chance of finding a snowball in hell!

I work on TONS of musical and electronic gear, and the #1 problem is, by far, any form of solderless connectors.

Do it right, and learn soldering. It really isn't difficult. C'mon, they have old ladies doing it in factories!
 
#13
jrfrond said:
Solder...solder...SOLDER!!! PERIOD!

Guitar wiring is NOT house wiring. When resistance builds up in contact connections carrying any appreciable current due to galvanic reaction between the two mating surfaces, heat is generated, which further increases resistance in a vicious cycle of breakdown, to the point where so much heat can be generated that the mating conductors can weld themselves together, and the surrounding oxygen in the air or even in the copper, supports the process of oxidation. With low-level audio signals, it is slow degradation of signal, sometimes so slow that you might not notice problems until things are really suckin'!

Solder creates an intermediate alloy bond that prevents this from happening.

Galvanic reaction is a process whereas minute electrical currents are generated when the surfaces of two different metals touch. Even if both mating conductors are copper, unless the copper is 100% pure (almost impossible to guarantee), there will be problems, unless the impurities (trace metals) in both conductors are also exactly the same. You have a better chance of finding a snowball in hell!

I work on TONS of musical and electronic gear, and the #1 problem is, by far, any form of solderless connectors.

Do it right, and learn soldering. It really isn't difficult. C'mon, they have old ladies doing it in factories!
Click to expand...
Well now you're making me think, dang you!
 
#15
jrfrond said:
Solder...solder...SOLDER!!! PERIOD!

Guitar wiring is NOT house wiring. When resistance builds up in contact connections carrying any appreciable current due to galvanic reaction between the two mating surfaces, heat is generated, which further increases resistance in a vicious cycle of breakdown, to the point where so much heat can be generated that the mating conductors can weld themselves together, and the surrounding oxygen in the air or even in the copper, supports the process of oxidation. With low-level audio signals, it is slow degradation of signal, sometimes so slow that you might not notice problems until things are really suckin'!

Solder creates an intermediate alloy bond that prevents this from happening.

Galvanic reaction is a process whereas minute electrical currents are generated when the surfaces of two different metals touch. Even if both mating conductors are copper, unless the copper is 100% pure (almost impossible to guarantee), there will be problems, unless the impurities (trace metals) in both conductors are also exactly the same. You have a better chance of finding a snowball in hell!

I work on TONS of musical and electronic gear, and the #1 problem is, by far, any form of solderless connectors.

Do it right, and learn soldering. It really isn't difficult. C'mon, they have old ladies doing it in factories!
Click to expand...

I guess someone should tell Butch at Bayou Cables to stop selling his Kits with wires nuts then?

I do have a queston. If a solderless conection is so prone to fail as you say why are they so widly used in musical and electroincs gear? My therory of wire nuts is that they will send the signal and conduct ....thats all i was saying.
 
#17
Since I rarely do anything halfway, I ordered myself a decent soldering iron and the necessary materials... but it won't get here for another week or so, and all my fun new guitar parts arrived today. There's no reason I couldn't just put the wiring kit and pickup in now using the wire nuts for the time being and then solder it in a week or two, right?

Although I won't be able to desolder the stock pickup wires so I suppose I'll have to cut them... but besides that there's no major problem with doing this?
 
#18
bassbully said:
I guess someone should tell Butch at Bayou Cables to stop selling his Kits with wires nuts then?

I do have a queston. If a solderless conection is so prone to fail as you say why are they so widly used in musical and electroincs gear? My therory of wire nuts is that they will send the signal and conduct ....thats all i was saying.
Click to expand...

Solderless connectors are used for convenience in assembly...period. Things just snap together.

You heard from "Johnny Crab" about the soldering of snake cable. I did that with patch bays back in the 70's. Now, telephone company techniques are employed with ID (Insulation-Displacement) connectors, also called "punchdowns". BIG problems!!! Do you know how many problems this has caused for recording studios AND Ma Bell alike???

As much as I like soldered connections, even I am realistic and know that solderless connectors have their place. However, being a service tech and engineer, I know better, and my gear gets soldered.

Here's a hint: if you ARE going to use solderless connectors, coat the mating surfaces of them with DeOxIt 100 or another Caig product called "R5 Power Booster". It protects the metals from oxidation.
 
#19
It would take years for the wires to build up that kind of resistance where it affects the tone. Quite frankly, I'm still not sure if I buy it. I believe it could happen, but just how much resistance that little wire nut can create compared to an entire amp rig, I don't know. I'm no expert, though, and I'd like to hear more experts weigh in.
 
#20
It is interesting to see this generate so much debate... clearly there are a slew of differing opinions. I ordered a soldering iron since it's a skill i've wanted to learn for a while, even though i've been scared to attempt it. Plus now I'll be able to mess around with some of the build your own clone kits, who knows, sky's the limit.
 

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