• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

410UL Series I vs. II A/B comparison

KJung

KJung

Supporting Member
Apr 9, 2005
44,589
1,595
Wisconsin
#1
Hey guys. A really quick post and thread on the 410UL I vs. II.

There is a lot of interest in the 410UL since it is one of the lightest and loudest full size 410's on the market. I've been using the original 410UL for quite a few years now and really like it. Given this is my favorite cab of all time for delivering the tone I like (modern J Bass with SS roundwound strings), I thought I'd get the updated model to see what it is all about.

The original 410UL is voiced wonderfully for that grindy, modern 'Will Lee-like' modern J tone... big low end, lot's of definition and growl in the upper mids, and a very airy, musical treble response. While I love this voicing, some feel the upper mids are a little too aggressive, and the lower mids not quite punchy enough in relation to the big low end.

To this point, Gary (MacGroove) is the only TBer I know who has owned both and directly compared the two, and after pounding on both with my Thunderfunk and LMII with a couple of J's, I agree with his post of a couple of weeks ago.

They sound quite similar, with the primary difference being a slightly more compressed deep low end and a very, very subtle shift of the mids from the more upper mid range (maybe 600-800hz) to lower mid range (maybe 250). IMO, the differences are quite similar to the differences I heard between Vic's Series I and Series II 310UL's.... with the Series I being a little punchier and with more bass extension, and the Series II being a little more compressed in the low end, and a little 'flatter' in the mid voicing. I can hear how Vic and Tom Bowlus would hear the Series II as a more 'balanced' voicing (from their experience at NAMM and with my 410UL at a couple of hangs)... but it's pretty darn subtle to my ear.

My feeling is, as Gary mentioned, the subtle change is in the 'right' direction for most players. However, one of the strong points of the original model is its ability to punch through a busy mix and project that wonderful paper cone upper mid growl that, to me, makes a J bass sound like a J bass. It seems the Series II has lost just a little of that... it's just a touch more 'polite'. However, you can get both to sound virtually identical to my ear with a little EQ.

So... Nick didn't mess anything up here:D and this continues IMO to be a wonderful cab for pop/funk/modern country applications.

I'll post up again in a couple of weeks when I have the Series II on some gigs.

Edit: The subtle voicing change works well with the SD800.. which was my hope (based on descriptions by Gary, Vic and Tom Bowlus). The LMII/410UL(I) and SD800/410UL(II) sound quite a bit alike, with the slightly less present upper mids of the II working well with the very upper mid present SD800... nice!
 
#2
PS.... unbelievably, the Series II actually feels a touch lighter than the 57 pound Series I. I think another TBer who swapped the Eminence (Series II) for B&C's (Series I) in a 212 cab felt the same thing... the B&C"s are a little heavier. Cool!
 
#8
Nice review. And very similar to what I hear with my UL 112 S1 and S2. (Actually, the S1 and S2 112's work together very nicely!) And, depending on your personal tastes, both 112's sound fantastic.

Just wondering if the S2 4x10 is more efficient than the S1 4x10.
 
#9
Ken, It was good to see you again today. In our quick hang today I felt that the Series II sounded too hi-fi for me with the LM II. But the LM is a bit hi-fi for my taste anyway. It was too articulate for my sloppy touch with your AC and round wounds. With my (dead nickels) NYC it did sound really big though. Anyway, I'd love to hear it with the T'funk.:D

How light was it? Ken could pick it up without help from Katie!:D
So it may be lighter then the Series I.
 
#10
KJung said:
PS.... unbelievably, the Series II actually feels a touch lighter than the 57 pound Series I. I think another TBer who swapped the Eminence (Series II) for B&C's (Series I) in a 212 cab felt the same thing... the B&C"s are a little heavier. Cool!
Click to expand...
I just weighed the S1 and S2 UL310 and they were the same weight. FWIW, anyway.
 
#12
burk48237 said:
Ken, It was good to see you again today. In our quick hang today I felt that the Series II sounded too hi-fi for me with the LM II. But the LM is a bit hi-fi for my taste anyway. It was too articulate for my sloppy touch with your AC and round wounds. With my (dead nickels) NYC it did sound really big though. Anyway, I'd love to hear it with the T'funk.:D

How light was it? Ken could pick it up without help from Katie!:D
So it may be lighter then the Series I.
Click to expand...

+1 :D

I look forward to the hang at Dino's on Thursday.
 
#15
The Diaper Geni said:
Thanks. Reason I ask is my S2 is quite a bit more efficient than my S1. "Quite a bit more" is subjective, I know, but there is a noticeable difference.
Click to expand...
By this you mean the S2 sounds louder to you than the S1? If so, with my UL310's, I've had opposite results... mainly due to that mid peak on the S1's.
 
#18
The Diaper Geni said:
Actually, the S1 and S2 112's work together very nicely!
Click to expand...
This may seem really odd, but I have the exact same results with the UL310's. It's kinda' cool because I have one of each for more options when using as a single and pairing with certain heads, but when used together, they compliment each other in a really cool way. Ken's heard this first-hand and can attest to this as well.
 
#19
KJung said:
The original 410UL is voiced wonderfully for that grindy, modern 'Will Lee-like' modern J tone... big low end, lot's of definition and growl in the upper mids, and a very airy, musical treble response. While I love this voicing, some feel the upper mids are a little too aggressive, and the lower mids not quite punchy enough in relation to the big low end.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the comparison!

Like anything else tone-related, results for one piece of gear will vary depending on the player's technique and the rest of the gear he's using. I mostly use P-style basses, and (perhaps because of this, or perhaps not) I'm one of those players who prefers mids voiced a little lower. That said, I agree that J-style basses sound punchy and snappy as heck through the S1 UL410... they do indeed sit well in the mix.

Ken, I've read a comment or two from others that differences between the S1 and S2 cabs are subtle, but you seem to feel they're more pronounced... is that correct?
 
#20
Fuzzbass said:
Ken, I've read a comment or two from others that differences between the S1 and S2 cabs are subtle, but you seem to feel they're more pronounced... is that correct?
Click to expand...


No, actually relatively subtle, but you can hear it. The S2 still does not have the low mid oomph of your SA410, and still has a much bigger, wider low end. However, the upper mids that some don't care for have been somewhat attenuated on the 410S2. So, I'm with Gary on his earlier comments.... if you liked the S1, you will like the S2... in some cases and with some heads, maybe better. If you thought the S1 had a little too much upper mid presence, but in general liked the cab, the S2 might be different enough that it would work for you. If the S1 was really not your thing, IMO, the S2 is more similar than different... it's still quite articulate, big, and to my ear, actually more 'modern' sounding than the S1, which was capable of quite a bit of mid growl and aggression to my ear.

My guess is, from our previous discussions, you would like the S2 better than the S1 that you had, but not as much as your SA410!
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back