Chef
In Memoriam
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1600w too much
- Thread starter heath_the_great
- Start date
..im taking my cab and pre into the store on saturday...should be funHere's a thought:- go on to one of the professional sound reinforment forums and ask the same question. Link Removed
They will tell you that it is far too much power. In their view your amplifier is there so that you can produce the correct tone and so you can hear yourself. Any more than that and:
your output goes straight down the singer's mic.
The singer needs too much foldback to overcome you,
Then you get into a feedback zone and all the while the sound guy can't balance you with the rest of the band.
You get "good" sound but the whole band gets bad sound.
Alternative that THEY would suggest:- 400W amp, beer crate, point the speaker at your head, DI out job done. Let the man work.
They will tell you that it is far too much power. In their view your amplifier is there so that you can produce the correct tone and so you can hear yourself. Any more than that and:
your output goes straight down the singer's mic.
The singer needs too much foldback to overcome you,
Then you get into a feedback zone and all the while the sound guy can't balance you with the rest of the band.
You get "good" sound but the whole band gets bad sound.
Alternative that THEY would suggest:- 400W amp, beer crate, point the speaker at your head, DI out job done. Let the man work.
Chef
In Memoriam
Just because you have 1600 watts does not mean "turn it all the way up and use all 1600 watts all the time."
Having significantly more headroom than you need adds beef, fullness, etc. You can "feel the horsepower" behind even your quiet notes, and dynamic changes become much more responsive.
Having significantly more headroom than you need adds beef, fullness, etc. You can "feel the horsepower" behind even your quiet notes, and dynamic changes become much more responsive.
maybe, JUST maybe, not everyone is right...MAYBE i want a poweramp like that FOR HEADROOM, maybe i dont want to ask them, just because they said the sun shines out their ass doesnt make it true...ive seen plenty of bands around town where the bassist runs his amp alone, not di'ed where the guitarist or whatever is and it sounds great
that and i really dont like a di'ed sound....the speaker cabinet really makes it for me, if i di, it takes away the whole point of having a cabinet, all id need to take is my ampeg pre then, which, not only looks like **** on its own, but i love the sound of my cabinet
that and i really dont like a di'ed sound....the speaker cabinet really makes it for me, if i di, it takes away the whole point of having a cabinet, all id need to take is my ampeg pre then, which, not only looks like **** on its own, but i love the sound of my cabinet
i REALLY disagree...i have a 300w peavey, a 1978 USA peavey, with 2x 410's, it really doesnt cut it for how clean i wantbmc said:
I subscribe to the "Tim Allen" ideology... MORE! 
Actually, not exactly. I tried running my power amp, just dumping 270w into each of my 112's. That should've been fine. But, when I just took 1 of my 12's to rehearsal, it simply wasnt near enough, as the power amp was clipping.
I dont EVER want to see the clipping light come on.
So, I bridged my power amp... I have a full sound, & life is good. Depending on how many 12's I take, I run either 800w or 1140w.
Actually, not exactly. I tried running my power amp, just dumping 270w into each of my 112's. That should've been fine. But, when I just took 1 of my 12's to rehearsal, it simply wasnt near enough, as the power amp was clipping.
I dont EVER want to see the clipping light come on.
So, I bridged my power amp... I have a full sound, & life is good. Depending on how many 12's I take, I run either 800w or 1140w.
McHack said:I subscribe to the "Tim Allen" ideology... MORE!
Actually, not exactly. I tried running my power amp, just dumping 270w into each of my 112's. That should've been fine. But, when I just took 1 of my 12's to rehearsal, it simply wasnt near enough, as the power amp was clipping.
I dont EVER want to see the clipping light come on.
So, I bridged my power amp... I have a full sound, & life is good. Depending on how many 12's I take, I run either 800w or 1140w.
800 or 1140 watts for rehearsal?
Do you wear hearing protectors?
It is my understanding that the speaker rating of GOOD speakers is based on continuous power over a certain amount of time. In order to blow a good 400-watt speaker you'd have to be playing really loud or with an outrageous amount of low end EQ to blow it using a big amp. However, I notice a fuller sound from a SS amp that has a lot of head room as apposed to one without. It is for that reason I like using a big amp. You do, however have to pay attention to your volume. Pay attention to the output lights on the power amp. If the –20 light is on and the –10 light blinks on the peaks you are running between 25 to 200 watts. However if the –10 light is solid and the –0 or clip light is blinking you are running between 200 to 1600 watts and of course if the –0 or clip stays on, get ready for a melt down.
Chef
In Memoriam
bmc said:
Again, 1600 watts avaiable does not have to mean 1600 watts used!!!
I often run an Eden Navigator into a qsc/plx 1602 bridged at 1600 watts into either a Schroeder 1210 (rated 800 watts), or SWR Henry 8x8 (rated 475 watts).
I very seldom turn the Nav input up over 1/2, output over 1/3, and run the qsc at full power.
The result? Huge solid low end, great dynamic response, even at low rehearsal volume.
You don't have to turn everything all the way up!!!
bmc said:
Who says I use it all.... I just said, I was clipping 270w. Specifically, peaks were clipping it... NOT a continuous load. BUT, because I value my speakers, I refuse to run clipped power into them, so I bridged my power amp.
Whats what having the overhead of power is about. Having so much on hand, that you DONT need it... to avoid the clip.
In truth, I've never needed to run all 800 a rehearsal, & havent seen a clip light come on since I bridged my power amp.
McHack said:
You do realize that you have the potential to damage those speakers without ever seeing a clip light with that setup right?
That being said, there's nothing inherently wrong with using an amp capable of 800W into a cab rated for 300. Under most normal circumstances the average power would be less than 300W (even if you were seeing a little clipping on peaks) with that setup, given dynamics. Start compressing your signal and you might quickly run into problems, though.
Clipping isn't inherently bad for speakers, too much average power is, and that can be acheived without ever clipping.....
McHack said:
I'm sure you're not running it full out. I just have a different take on performance requirements in a band context. My experience from the past 30+ years has taught me a lot of things.
1.Playing quieter on stage gives more flexibility and control of the FOH sound. That's important to us to ensure repeat business.
2. As much as I love 10 in speakers, 12 inch speakers, tubes, racks, combos, pedals, headroom, etc, every room and stage sounds different. If we, not I, can get a good band sound first, I will do my best to get a stage sound I can live with. I can do that with a 100 watt amp. I am sure I can do it with a 2,000 watt amp.
from my experience
the most i've used is 2 svt's with 4 8x 10's or 4 2x15's
that is 600w rms and i used that in 2500 person venues
ther players using huge marshall, mesa, fender, and orange stacks
with two guitars, keys, drums, horn sections
and i always had enough power
in fact more than enough power for the boys on stage or the boys in reinforcement
playing everything from metal to r & b
and not to get into a pissing match but i have used swr, g-b, trace, kustom, carvin and others and when they say 300w rms i don't know how they are measuring their gear but it just does not sound like 300w
so maybe that may be part of the issue
but maybe not
the most i've used is 2 svt's with 4 8x 10's or 4 2x15's
that is 600w rms and i used that in 2500 person venues
ther players using huge marshall, mesa, fender, and orange stacks
with two guitars, keys, drums, horn sections
and i always had enough power
in fact more than enough power for the boys on stage or the boys in reinforcement
playing everything from metal to r & b
and not to get into a pissing match but i have used swr, g-b, trace, kustom, carvin and others and when they say 300w rms i don't know how they are measuring their gear but it just does not sound like 300w
so maybe that may be part of the issue
but maybe not
vocals, drums and the guitar depending on the room....i dont like going through the p.a if i can avoid it...i dont like being soft on stage, and pumping it all out of FOH, i like to feel it, if im soft on stage it just doesnt feel or sound right, i like to really pump out a huge soundbmc said:
el_Kabong said:So why did you bother asking if it was too much power? Seems to me you don't want to hear any opinion that's contrary to the one you already have.
well ive been confused after looking at acme cabinets, with them saying the more clean power you pump in the better they sound, and after seeing people pump 2000w into the b4, i just had/have no idea how my peavey will go or how much i should pump into it, and i still dont know, its all confusing to me
