I'm 38, started out on eub some 8 months ago. Got a real and true acoustic Bass at the beginning of the year and there are no other basses or instruments in general anymore. I come from drumset, some ethnic and classical percussion, guitar and bass guitar. I have studied in a conservatory and played drums professionally. I quess I'm converting at the moment. Double bass and the ability to play it has been a dream of mine for a long time and now I'm living that dream. I'm obsessed by the sound and the physical nature of this divine instrument. I believe that you and I both will learn how to play it, enjoy the trip!
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Double Bass 30yo, too old to learn DB?
- Thread starter ladysingstheblues
- Start date
It's never too late! I've taught several adult beginners with ages 40 - 60. They did really well!
Thankyou all for your replies. Today I'm picking up a bass as a short term rental from an esteemed local Luthier (a student model). I feel this will give me a good chance to get to know the instrument. After playing some piano and guitar, I am looking forward to this more challenging opportunity to develop my aural skills and attack a far more physical instrument.
A couple of you mentioned looking inside for motivation; I understand and agree with this, however my inspiration does often come from external sources - the beautiful sound, listening to jazz on records and seeing it played live, the aesthetic beauty... My plan will be to work on fundamentals with dedication and humility. I will be trying a few recommended local teachers before deciding which might make the best fit. There are many talented players/teachers around! I will also have to pick up a bass specific theory or exercise book, I have seen some names floating around here.
It's very inspiring to hear of people of all different ages who have picked up this instrument and made it sing for them. I LOVE reading your personal stories!
In response to another poster who asked why not slab bass - from an early age I've always been drawn to the sounds of piano, cello and double bass, instinctively loving the walking bass lines I encountered in a Fats Domino record, boogie woogie and rhythmic and swing stylings, listening for these sounds in music I heard. I have a passion only for the acoustic sound, as such I never cared much for BG or even EG. Later on in life I discovered JAZZ. For so long I have been humbled, admiring and in awe of the amazing players I see performing on this instrument. It's finally hit me that this admiration comes from an internal interest and passion to touch this instrument myself; and as I have the means now as an adult to explore this dream i'm going to take the plunge.
I don't have any aspirations of performing on stage, but I would love to be able to CREATE music with others, jam and produce that incredible swing sound and play my very own first walking bass line. These are things that no doubt will keep that fire going, as I have been immersed in jazz music and culture for a long time now.
Can't wait to start making sounds on this thing
A couple of you mentioned looking inside for motivation; I understand and agree with this, however my inspiration does often come from external sources - the beautiful sound, listening to jazz on records and seeing it played live, the aesthetic beauty... My plan will be to work on fundamentals with dedication and humility. I will be trying a few recommended local teachers before deciding which might make the best fit. There are many talented players/teachers around! I will also have to pick up a bass specific theory or exercise book, I have seen some names floating around here.
It's very inspiring to hear of people of all different ages who have picked up this instrument and made it sing for them. I LOVE reading your personal stories!
In response to another poster who asked why not slab bass - from an early age I've always been drawn to the sounds of piano, cello and double bass, instinctively loving the walking bass lines I encountered in a Fats Domino record, boogie woogie and rhythmic and swing stylings, listening for these sounds in music I heard. I have a passion only for the acoustic sound, as such I never cared much for BG or even EG. Later on in life I discovered JAZZ. For so long I have been humbled, admiring and in awe of the amazing players I see performing on this instrument. It's finally hit me that this admiration comes from an internal interest and passion to touch this instrument myself; and as I have the means now as an adult to explore this dream i'm going to take the plunge.
I don't have any aspirations of performing on stage, but I would love to be able to CREATE music with others, jam and produce that incredible swing sound and play my very own first walking bass line. These are things that no doubt will keep that fire going, as I have been immersed in jazz music and culture for a long time now.
Can't wait to start making sounds on this thing
Wow, you almost made me cry reading your post. I love your attitude!
I played for several years in my 20's and studied DB at a well-respected university. But I set it down at age 27 and hadn't played it since.
That is, until last October at age 42, when I finally picked it up again. Considering where I should be at this point had I kept up with the instrument, I occasionally find myself somewhat frustrated to be back to an intermediate stage. I certainly regret the lost years, but I certainly do not regret picking the double bass back up. Every minute I spend with it is pure joy.
I played for several years in my 20's and studied DB at a well-respected university. But I set it down at age 27 and hadn't played it since.
That is, until last October at age 42, when I finally picked it up again. Considering where I should be at this point had I kept up with the instrument, I occasionally find myself somewhat frustrated to be back to an intermediate stage. I certainly regret the lost years, but I certainly do not regret picking the double bass back up. Every minute I spend with it is pure joy.
Now that I've got it home, advice on how to proceed? I've had a play before, thinking about the things teacher raised such as posture and positioning of hands, playing open strings and a few notes in first position (if i recall correctly?) on each string. I have just found a copy of Simandl and Ray Brown's bass method which I will look at tomorrow. I have another lesson coming up in a few days. Loving the sounds and it looks lovely, too! Your advice appreciated - esp duration of practise advised 
Advice from a fellow beginner
Listen to your body. The guys here aren't kidding about the physicality of the instrument. It takes time to build up the strength and stamina. Enthusiasm may cause you to initially work through the pain and discomfort but it will eventually catch up with you. I had some lessons specifically talking about form so I didn't establish bad habits.
Probably the best advice I got was to use a stool rather than stand. It helped work on applying the necessary pressure to play the notes without trying to do so with hand grip strength applied from behind with my thumb. Before I switched I was suffering from hand and in particular thumb strain.
Good luck and enjoy. I am surprised by how much I am enjoying playing the bass. There is something very honest about this instrument.
-Warren
PS. I am loving this threax
Listen to your body. The guys here aren't kidding about the physicality of the instrument. It takes time to build up the strength and stamina. Enthusiasm may cause you to initially work through the pain and discomfort but it will eventually catch up with you. I had some lessons specifically talking about form so I didn't establish bad habits.
Probably the best advice I got was to use a stool rather than stand. It helped work on applying the necessary pressure to play the notes without trying to do so with hand grip strength applied from behind with my thumb. Before I switched I was suffering from hand and in particular thumb strain.
Good luck and enjoy. I am surprised by how much I am enjoying playing the bass. There is something very honest about this instrument.
-Warren
PS. I am loving this threax
30 is definitely not too old to pick up an instrument. I bought my first upright when I was 32, and now, at 39 it is how I make 75% of my income. I do wish I'd started earlier, but my motivation is definitely more focused in my 30s than it was in my 20s, and much more so than my teens when I started electric bass, and progress has come much more quickly.
Enjoy the journey!
-b
Enjoy the journey!
-b
Yup. 30 is too old for anything. Write your epitaph and shut 'er down, bro.
Yeah! Another one hooked!
Ed & Chris got it – it's the sound!
[aside to Chris F: Listening to clips you've put up etc I'd have thought you started when knee-high to a grasshopper. Wow, 35? That's inspiring!]
+1 to what others said of the physicality of it, don't play through pain – discomfort, sure, but not pain. I ignored it when I was first starting out (at 40 from essentially ground zero ie no musical background to speak of) and after injuring my elbow tendons, now have to mollycoddle my right arm.
Thanks for the inspiration Ladysingstheblues, my practice regimen had fallen off a bit and your thread, the post quoted in particular, has re-ignited the incentive to just practice and enjoy that sound.
Plenty of Late Boomers on TB...
Thankyou all for your replies. Today I'm picking up a bass as a short term rental from an esteemed local Luthier (a student model). I feel this will give me a good chance to get to know the instrument. After playing some piano and guitar, I am looking forward to this more challenging opportunity to develop my aural skills and attack a far more physical instrument.
A couple of you mentioned looking inside for motivation; I understand and agree with this, however my inspiration does often come from external sources - the beautiful sound, listening to jazz on records and seeing it played live, the aesthetic beauty... My plan will be to work on fundamentals with dedication and humility. I will be trying a few recommended local teachers before deciding which might make the best fit. There are many talented players/teachers around! I will also have to pick up a bass specific theory or exercise book, I have seen some names floating around here.
It's very inspiring to hear of people of all different ages who have picked up this instrument and made it sing for them. I LOVE reading your personal stories!
In response to another poster who asked why not slab bass - from an early age I've always been drawn to the sounds of piano, cello and double bass, instinctively loving the walking bass lines I encountered in a Fats Domino record, boogie woogie and rhythmic and swing stylings, listening for these sounds in music I heard. I have a passion only for the acoustic sound, as such I never cared much for BG or even EG. Later on in life I discovered JAZZ. For so long I have been humbled, admiring and in awe of the amazing players I see performing on this instrument. It's finally hit me that this admiration comes from an internal interest and passion to touch this instrument myself; and as I have the means now as an adult to explore this dream i'm going to take the plunge.
I don't have any aspirations of performing on stage, but I would love to be able to CREATE music with others, jam and produce that incredible swing sound and play my very own first walking bass line. These are things that no doubt will keep that fire going, as I have been immersed in jazz music and culture for a long time now.
Can't wait to start making sounds on this thing
Ed & Chris got it – it's the sound!
[aside to Chris F: Listening to clips you've put up etc I'd have thought you started when knee-high to a grasshopper. Wow, 35? That's inspiring!]
+1 to what others said of the physicality of it, don't play through pain – discomfort, sure, but not pain. I ignored it when I was first starting out (at 40 from essentially ground zero ie no musical background to speak of) and after injuring my elbow tendons, now have to mollycoddle my right arm.
Thanks for the inspiration Ladysingstheblues, my practice regimen had fallen off a bit and your thread, the post quoted in particular, has re-ignited the incentive to just practice and enjoy that sound.
Plenty of Late Boomers on TB...
Here's my story:
I couldn't get into the high school band because they already had about 5 guitar players, so I got my first lessons in double bass and was able to join the band. After graduation I had a 25 year lay-off from bass as I focused and gigged on guitar. Fast forward a quarter century. Faced with the same dilemma as in high school -new band needs bass player, so at the tender age of 42, I acquired my first doghouse and jumped head-first into the deep-end. From there it's been a whirlwind of activity...I've played outdoor festivals, church services, even did the scary thing and performed as a duo with only a trumpet player -all with my upright!
I guess that's my convoluted way of saying 30 years old is really not too old to do anything. Go for it.
I couldn't get into the high school band because they already had about 5 guitar players, so I got my first lessons in double bass and was able to join the band. After graduation I had a 25 year lay-off from bass as I focused and gigged on guitar. Fast forward a quarter century. Faced with the same dilemma as in high school -new band needs bass player, so at the tender age of 42, I acquired my first doghouse and jumped head-first into the deep-end. From there it's been a whirlwind of activity...I've played outdoor festivals, church services, even did the scary thing and performed as a duo with only a trumpet player -all with my upright!
I guess that's my convoluted way of saying 30 years old is really not too old to do anything. Go for it.
Advice - I was thinking i'll take weekly lessons, and I have the choice of 30, 45 or 60 mins.... What suffices at this point?
Additionally, I am mostly interested in jazz and pizz, but should I be trying to incorporate some arco from early on?
What duration did you practice when starting out - a certain length of time, like 20 mins.... or just til muscles tired (not painful, just tired)?
Love reading your replies, very inspiring to read of other adult learners. AWP and feral feline thanks for the heads up
Additionally, I am mostly interested in jazz and pizz, but should I be trying to incorporate some arco from early on?
What duration did you practice when starting out - a certain length of time, like 20 mins.... or just til muscles tired (not painful, just tired)?
Love reading your replies, very inspiring to read of other adult learners. AWP and feral feline thanks for the heads up
My knee-jerk response would be to say at least 60 minute lessons because that's what's worked for me. But I just took up singing seriously and my teacher who has a very good track record of turning out great singers insisted I start with 30 minute lessons so as not to overload and frustrate me. That's probably exactly right on for a beginner adult student.
Yes play with the bow from day one. It helps your intonation immensely and you learn about drawing sound out of the instrument in ways pizz will never reveal.
As for how long you practice I'm not going to be quite as rainbow/sunshine as others have been and say that if you don't need to play this instrument save yourself the grief and walk away now. If you do need to play it then play it as often as you are able to in a clearly focused a manner. Simple, no?
Just don't ever play through pain.
Yes play with the bow from day one. It helps your intonation immensely and you learn about drawing sound out of the instrument in ways pizz will never reveal.
As for how long you practice I'm not going to be quite as rainbow/sunshine as others have been and say that if you don't need to play this instrument save yourself the grief and walk away now. If you do need to play it then play it as often as you are able to in a clearly focused a manner. Simple, no?
Just don't ever play through pain.
Save myself the grief and walk away now? Uh oh....
Thanks for the advice on arco...
Check out some bowed solos from Paul Chambers or from Slam Stewart, they'll both likely make you want to get workin' hard on bowing. And if not, bowing will still help your intonation, you will not regret bowing in the long run. I find I'm bowing more & more as required/requested by bandmates, on gigs, at jams.
My Lesson Time Suggestions:
Take a 60-minute lesson, as in one.
Were you able to stay focused the entire hour or were you overwhelmed by too much info? Did it tire you out physically? If you zoned out or cramped etc, try the 45-minute lesson. Ask yourself the same questions, still too much? Take half-hour lessons until you're comfortable, bump up the lesson length as/when you can. Obviously, if you have no problem with an hour, then take an hour lesson! I find an hour flies by and I wish my lessons were for the entire afternoon.
*Take anything I offer with a grain of salt, 'cause I'm a newb like you (I've just been a newb longer), but pay heed to the F-men, ie Chris and Ed, they've got the experience and credibility. Keep hangin' out here and you'll get to know who the other TB 'old hands' are who offer great advice.
My Lesson Time Suggestions:
Take a 60-minute lesson, as in one.
Were you able to stay focused the entire hour or were you overwhelmed by too much info? Did it tire you out physically? If you zoned out or cramped etc, try the 45-minute lesson. Ask yourself the same questions, still too much? Take half-hour lessons until you're comfortable, bump up the lesson length as/when you can. Obviously, if you have no problem with an hour, then take an hour lesson! I find an hour flies by and I wish my lessons were for the entire afternoon.
*Take anything I offer with a grain of salt, 'cause I'm a newb like you (I've just been a newb longer), but pay heed to the F-men, ie Chris and Ed, they've got the experience and credibility. Keep hangin' out here and you'll get to know who the other TB 'old hands' are who offer great advice.
I started at 51 or 52 - can't remember exactly - and I've been getting younger every day.
I did play electric bass prior...but it's really a totally different instrument.
I did play electric bass prior...but it's really a totally different instrument.
I always teach new student's first lesson or two at 45 min. Then you get a good sense of what is needed and adjust accordingly.
The bass is definitely a very physical instrument. See if your teacher, or ones your looking at, has any experience with the Alexander Technique or Feldenkrais Method. These are systems of biomechanics - knowing and applying proper technique to not just maximize playing but also to minimize - or steer clear of - potential injurious situations or techniques.
The bass is definitely a very physical instrument. See if your teacher, or ones your looking at, has any experience with the Alexander Technique or Feldenkrais Method. These are systems of biomechanics - knowing and applying proper technique to not just maximize playing but also to minimize - or steer clear of - potential injurious situations or techniques.
So, here's my advice about how long a lesson should be with a teacher. It depends on the teacher and the student. I think it's a good idea to shop for teachers, trying 3 or 4 before you commit to one. But, once you commit, commit completely. Do as they tell you even if you don't think it makes sense. Give that 8 to 10 months. If they haven't earned your admiration and trust after 8 months or so, consider switching. I had one very experienced classical teacher who, IMO, had little insights to playing the bass. Great player and significant recordings. But, he had few prescriptions about how to play better but lots of criticism. Great player, lousy teacher unless you're 8 years old. I had another teacher who was working regularly. Great player but no insight about how students could play better.
The best way to find a teacher IMO is to find someone whose playing you admire and whose teaching style seems to work for you. Too often great players make awful teachers and vice versa. Find someone, if possible, who is both. If you can't find someone local then use Skype as a last resort. Sometimes 2 or 3 lessons are necessary to make that determination.
Honestly, students who aren't kids can be more difficult to teach than kids. Kids can be lazy, undisciplined, and distracted, but adults tend to think they know better and want to focus on flashy things rather than the basics that they need to attend to. For this reason, I find many teachers unwilling to accept adult students. It happened to me when I picked up the upright at 40+; a potential instructor asked me how old I was on the phone and then declined to teach me after recommending that I try to hear as much live music as possible. Seriously self-serving IMO.
My lessons with my current teacher tends to last 3 or more hours. They're exhausting for me but I get a tremendous amount out of them. We meet every 6 weeks or so between his travel schedule and mine. He tends to try to go easy on me, but I take his criticisms to heart and try to do exactly as he prescribes beyond their intent, to their intended meaning. So far, I think he's the best teacher I've ever had - tough, but right about what I need to do. IMO, too many adult students just *dabble* at their instruments and if that's your goal, then have it! But if your goal is to give John Patatucci some serious competition in a few years then you need to be prepared for some long hard hours, years of hours.
I have a few adult students and they tend to visit every other week for an hour. I try to refer them to someone more qualified than me, but usually it becomes obvious that they're not that serious and need someone to help them without expecting them to become world class players. I'm all for that because I feel that anyone who can enjoy making music should do so and improve their skills.
Many times we go longer than an hour but given their goals and current abilities, an hour+ is about right for them. If they would just follow my advice, I think they'd make more progress towards their goals, but, everyone has to carve their own path. That must be the all-time teacher's lament, IME, because most students tend to adapt my carefully prescribed prescriptions based on my years on the upright and their current lack of ability to: I'll practice a few minutes what was prescribed fairly half-heartedly and the result is less than great progress over several months and then practice what I enjoy playing again and again until my practice time is passed. Contrast that with my teacher's recommendations: I practice his recommendations more than twice as long.
In the end, you need to ask yourself, do you just want to have fun with the double bass or do you want to master it. The latter takes years of seriously hard, agonizing work. The former is done nearly every day.
The best way to find a teacher IMO is to find someone whose playing you admire and whose teaching style seems to work for you. Too often great players make awful teachers and vice versa. Find someone, if possible, who is both. If you can't find someone local then use Skype as a last resort. Sometimes 2 or 3 lessons are necessary to make that determination.
Honestly, students who aren't kids can be more difficult to teach than kids. Kids can be lazy, undisciplined, and distracted, but adults tend to think they know better and want to focus on flashy things rather than the basics that they need to attend to. For this reason, I find many teachers unwilling to accept adult students. It happened to me when I picked up the upright at 40+; a potential instructor asked me how old I was on the phone and then declined to teach me after recommending that I try to hear as much live music as possible. Seriously self-serving IMO.
My lessons with my current teacher tends to last 3 or more hours. They're exhausting for me but I get a tremendous amount out of them. We meet every 6 weeks or so between his travel schedule and mine. He tends to try to go easy on me, but I take his criticisms to heart and try to do exactly as he prescribes beyond their intent, to their intended meaning. So far, I think he's the best teacher I've ever had - tough, but right about what I need to do. IMO, too many adult students just *dabble* at their instruments and if that's your goal, then have it! But if your goal is to give John Patatucci some serious competition in a few years then you need to be prepared for some long hard hours, years of hours.
I have a few adult students and they tend to visit every other week for an hour. I try to refer them to someone more qualified than me, but usually it becomes obvious that they're not that serious and need someone to help them without expecting them to become world class players. I'm all for that because I feel that anyone who can enjoy making music should do so and improve their skills.
Many times we go longer than an hour but given their goals and current abilities, an hour+ is about right for them. If they would just follow my advice, I think they'd make more progress towards their goals, but, everyone has to carve their own path. That must be the all-time teacher's lament, IME, because most students tend to adapt my carefully prescribed prescriptions based on my years on the upright and their current lack of ability to: I'll practice a few minutes what was prescribed fairly half-heartedly and the result is less than great progress over several months and then practice what I enjoy playing again and again until my practice time is passed. Contrast that with my teacher's recommendations: I practice his recommendations more than twice as long.
In the end, you need to ask yourself, do you just want to have fun with the double bass or do you want to master it. The latter takes years of seriously hard, agonizing work. The former is done nearly every day.
Why put age limitations on starting to play any instrument? This topic seems to pop up regularly, whether someone thinks being in their 20s, 30's, 40s, 50s, 60s, or beyond is "too old." I started DB in my 40's, and even managed to complete a bachelor's degree in music after that. I had a background in piano, guitar, and electric bass, so that helped, and continue to find DB the most challenging, yet most rewarding musical experience possible.
TCL, I liked your post but must disagree with this little bit:
A lousy teacher is just that, regardless of the age of the student.
~~~~~~~~~
I had a few piano lessons with a variety of teachers when I was quite young (6-7). Didn't amount to anything, didn't retain any of it at all other than the memory of wasted afternoons. I know in my heart if a teacher then would've asked me what I liked (Pinetop Perkins, Jelly Roll Morton etc from my Dad's oeuvre) , and then taught me a simple boogie-woogie left-hand bass line I would've been hooked. Instead I was fed the usual "twinkle little star" drek. I understand, now as an adult, the reasons to teach Tinkle Tinkle Little Wee as building blocks to other more advanced material. As a kid, however, it simply alienated me from piano lessons which were soon unceremoniously dumped. Different people have different ways of learning, just as teachers have different methods of edifying – getting a good match is paramount.
On a parallel slant, I like the idea of teaching/learning as per language. When first learning a language, either as an infant or as an adult learning a non-mother tongue, we learn things that we can use right away. "Hellos", "goodbyes", "My name is..." and "I'm hungry". The grammar, the heavy-duty learning, comes later. Imagine trying to teach a toddler subject, verb, predicate while they're still struggling with pronouncing "juice".
I'm not a trained educator, though I have taught MTBing and other skills. I'm not a very good student. So, once again, take my ramblings with proverbial salt.
The trick is, get 'em hooked and then sneak in the medicine with the spoonfuls of sugar.
A lousy teacher is just that, regardless of the age of the student.
~~~~~~~~~
I had a few piano lessons with a variety of teachers when I was quite young (6-7). Didn't amount to anything, didn't retain any of it at all other than the memory of wasted afternoons. I know in my heart if a teacher then would've asked me what I liked (Pinetop Perkins, Jelly Roll Morton etc from my Dad's oeuvre) , and then taught me a simple boogie-woogie left-hand bass line I would've been hooked. Instead I was fed the usual "twinkle little star" drek. I understand, now as an adult, the reasons to teach Tinkle Tinkle Little Wee as building blocks to other more advanced material. As a kid, however, it simply alienated me from piano lessons which were soon unceremoniously dumped. Different people have different ways of learning, just as teachers have different methods of edifying – getting a good match is paramount.
On a parallel slant, I like the idea of teaching/learning as per language. When first learning a language, either as an infant or as an adult learning a non-mother tongue, we learn things that we can use right away. "Hellos", "goodbyes", "My name is..." and "I'm hungry". The grammar, the heavy-duty learning, comes later. Imagine trying to teach a toddler subject, verb, predicate while they're still struggling with pronouncing "juice".
I'm not a trained educator, though I have taught MTBing and other skills. I'm not a very good student. So, once again, take my ramblings with proverbial salt.
The trick is, get 'em hooked and then sneak in the medicine with the spoonfuls of sugar.
