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4x10+4x10 vs 8x10

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by bchamorro, Mar 4, 2008.


  1. bchamorro

    bchamorro

    Nov 13, 2007
    Miami, Florida
    other than portability, what is so good about owning two 4x10s instead of a single 8x10?

    how close are the tones?
     
  2. Rob Mancini

    Rob Mancini Guest

    Feb 26, 2008
    The only differences are that most 4x10"s are ported to allow more low end response and they usually include a tweeter for more high end, and the majority of 8x10"s are sealed cabs with no tweeter, which makes them have a little less on the low end (55hz is the usual low end rating) and no ultra high end past about 5khz. Some people consider that desirable, though. I'm one of them.
     
  3. maxbass

    maxbass

    May 22, 2002
    Milano Italy
    Has Rob says, it depends on the construction of the cabs you consider.

    The classic Ampeg 8x10 is a sealed cab in which each speaker is housed in a separate infinite baffled chamber.

    The Ampeg 410HE is a sealed cab in which each speaker is housed in a separate infinite baffled chamber.

    So, 2 410HE will sound just like a 810.

    With non sealed cabs things changes, and the result is less predictable.
     
  4. Liten

    Liten

    Jan 26, 2007
    Sweden
    Isn't there hundreds of these threds already??? :eyebrow:

    Well... Ill say it again..

    There is no comparing the 2.. no 2x410 of the same brand and 1/2 pecs can match a 810... (IMO and IME...)

    Ive played both types of setups.. had 2 ampeg 410's and a ampeg 810E.. the 810 will spank any of ampeg 410.. in pairs or not... (IMO!)

    Regarding portability... sure.. if you play with one cab only.. its better with a 410.. but carrying and lifting 410's insted of rolling a 810 hardly put's them in the "much more portable" category... depends on if you work solo alot.. and need to carry everything by yourself... again: (IMO)

    After I got the Aguilar DB810.. wich might be the heaviest 810 out there... Id bet money on that there isn't a 2x410 setup made that can produce a sound that I prefer and with the same punch!! ... (might be on paper somewere.. but I doubt itll hold up in reality when it comes to my preference in sound and punch!..)

    This is again all: IMO!

    :D
     
  5. snake23

    snake23

    Dec 3, 2006
    I can't stand 810 enclosures it's all punch and no low end, at least the ones I've played through. Ampeg 810 is at 58hz, that's ridiculous.I like a cab to go at least 45hz but for me 40hz is best. I don't like 10's for bass anyway.
     
  6. I don't judge cabs by the numbers on their tags, I judge 'em by how they sound.

    I've never heard anyone complain that the Ampeg 810 doesn't play low enough, unless maybe you have a 7-string or a Quake.

    I'm guessing your 'lack of low end' 810 had more to do with the amp on top of it than with the fridge.
     
  7. Rob Mancini

    Rob Mancini Guest

    Feb 26, 2008
    Two 410HE's won't sound like an 8x10" unless you turn the tweeters nearly off. At that point, I wouldn't say they sound identical, but they have more in common than Liten is making it sound. However, he is right that that it isn't quite the same. Even though the 810 is 4 separate baffles (they're baffled in pairs, not individually), they're linked together, so the vibration of the single large cab is slightly different.
     
  8. maxbass

    maxbass

    May 22, 2002
    Milano Italy
    My tweeter is always off, so I forgot it ever exists :smug:

    Still i think that, with both tweeters off, in a blindfold test, it would be very hard, if possible, to recognize 2 Ampeg 410HE vs an Ampeg fridge with the same speakers.

    Let's not forget that both 810 and sealed 410 have had different speakers over the years
     
  9. amos

    amos

    Oct 23, 2003
    SE Portland Oregon
    The majority of 8x10s out there are NOT sealed. Sealed cabs are in the minority, no matter what the speaker configuration is. Also it is not four 2x10 baffles, it's two 4x10 baffles for the Ampeg 810-E/AV

    Here's a link to the 810 manual: http://cachepe.samedaymusic.com/media/SVT810EAV-d7a9a188e93b06241978b5300b205d96.pdf

    I suppose it's worth noting that sealed cabs are in the minority for bass guitar amplification, so no mixes up my words on me.
     
  10. Liten

    Liten

    Jan 26, 2007
    Sweden
    As you say.. This is turning out to be another Ampeg thred.. :meh:

    To step further into the comparison of 2 ampeg 410he's and a 810E.. the 410he's didnt handle well @ higher volumes in the past.. that is what the 810E does best imo... don't know if they changed the handling on the 410's but in the past they were dissapointing to say the least..

    Agian.. there are 410's out there that are MONSTERS!.. handle over 1000w and got a sensitivity of 103db.. (they will have a monstorus pricetag to.. :smug: ) 2 of them can surley match a 810.. just need to do some serious testing before you can claim its the same or better..
     
  11. The AMPEG 810 IS in fact 4 x (2 )10" spkrs each PAIR in their own sealed enclosure-AMPEG used to have a PDF of the design that was downloadable-but as most Ampeg things....... It CAN function as U show - as 2 x 4x10 cabs-sorta.. BUT it is built as I described 4 lots of 2 x 10" spkrs in a sealed section inside the 810 cab.

    And there are of course MANY 8x10 cabs that are Ported & do have horn/tweeters... fender, PV, Hartke?? Behringer??? Eden? I dunno which are ported & tweetered??? but I've seen pics of a fair few.
     
  12. amos

    amos

    Oct 23, 2003
    SE Portland Oregon
    I apologize if I contributed to this thread heading towards "Ampeg land". My intention was to only correct some misinformation on this thread. I think an Eden 410XST/410XLT rig could give any 8x10 a run for its money.

    Where the Ampeg name gets dropped is the fact that it's the most commonly used sealed cab in existence therefore when people think of 8x10 they think of the punch associated with a sealed Ampeg cab. All 8x10s are not created equal however. And I would also imagine that two 410HEs does not equate to the same internal box volume (cubic inches) as the 810E, which might account for the slight differences in the setups.

    In reality though, eight speakers is eight speakers, and if you go with quality cabs I don't think you'll find much practical difference between the two setups.
     
  13. Rob Mancini

    Rob Mancini Guest

    Feb 26, 2008
    I don't know how you can discuss 8x10"s without discussing Ampeg. They invented them.

    Also, I don't know what planet you live on where ported 8x10"s are more plentiful than sealed 8x10"s, but there are way more sealed 8x10"s in existence since Ampeg was the only company to make them for years and years.
     
  14. amos

    amos

    Oct 23, 2003
    SE Portland Oregon
    I live on earth, but I live on earth in 2008, where there are more ported 8x10s than in earth in the 1970s (is this where you reside ?:))

    edit: OH OH OH WAIT--you said "8x10s in existence" -- I thought you meant 8x10s in production -- makes sense now, my bad.
     
  15. maxbass

    maxbass

    May 22, 2002
    Milano Italy
    I have a very old 410HE rated at 200 watts RMS
    It alone hangs my 300 watts all valve Mesa 400+, in a very loud band.

    I've owned an Eden 410XLT, 700 watts and 106dB.
    I've made more than one A/B test, and the 410XLT blows away the Ampeg fridge.
    It has much more volume, low end and presence than the classic Ampeg 8x10.
    But volume and low end aren't everything, and I can understand that one can prefer the fridge.
    Just like I'm happy now with my 410HE, which is less than half loud as the Eden, thus letting me push further the volume on my Mesa 400+ and hear power tubes growl at a decent pressure level


    I've A/Bed 2 410HE against an Ampeg 810, have you?
     
  16. bass.player

    bass.player

    May 30, 2006
    Belgium
    I am in the same situation right now. I really wanted a fridge but because of portability (although I know some do not agree) and the fact that I actually do want a tweeter, I bought 2 410HE's. This also gives me the flexibility to take only one with me for small gigs.

    Unfortunately I have never had the opportunity to A/B the fridge against 2 410HE's so I am following this thread with great interest.

    Lately I was considering changing 1 410HE for a 15e to get a bit more bottom end. Would this make sense or will this get me further away from the -as close as it can be- fridge sound?
     
  17. maxbass

    maxbass

    May 22, 2002
    Milano Italy
    You'll get a bit more bottom end, and you'll be further away from the fridge :)
     
  18. bass.player

    bass.player

    May 30, 2006
    Belgium
    I'll keep it like it is then.... :)
     
  19. Fretlessboy

    Fretlessboy

    Nov 29, 2007
    St Augustine Florida
    Endorsing artist GENZ BENZ/HERCULES STANDS/XSonics
    Ifr Ampeg is where you are going try the 410HLF. It has more bottom end than the HE. I stopped using 10's years ago and switched to 12's because they sound like tight and clear 15's . There are a lot of company's making them. I have a GB Uber410 and it is big and balsey sounding. I have have always prefered a pair of cabinets to one big one housing the same the speakers. I think dual boxxes sound bigger. JMO
     
  20. Liten

    Liten

    Jan 26, 2007
    Sweden
    Ive not A/B tested the 2 410's ive owned against the 810E I got after them... sorry no.. I did how ever use the same amp with both rigs.. and my comment was less a statement than a encouragement.. Im sure your new eden 410 can crash any Ampeg 810 party..

    The Mesa/Ampeg note:
    I played 2 Sunn 410's with my Sunn 300T before I got the big Aguilar rig.. and I get the "less efficient cab's lets you push your tube amp" thing.. but thats not the discussion here is it?
    And I don't whant to come across as a "Mr know it all".. I only know what Ive tested... and the 2 ampeg 410's did not sound the same or handled the same volume as my ampeg 810E.. (not on paper or irl).. Preference in sound or not.. 2 ampeg 410he's did not ad up to the ampeg 810E.. I see that they changed the specs on the 410's now.. so we may be comparing diffrent cabs.. and my short experience with those cabs were over 10years ago.. outdated...

    Hope Im not offending anyone.. just sharing what Ive tested..
     

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