55-94, Electronics Question

[buzzbass]

I have a 55-94 with Duncan p'ups. I find that I need to run the little gain pot, on the inside, up pretty high to get the ooomph I'd like out of this Bass. Especially compared to the similar p'up setup in my Bongo 5 H/S. Has anyone modded their preamp to run @ 18 volts (like on a Bongo), to increase the pre's headroom. How were your results and who did the work. Thanks in advance for your advice.

 

[KJung]

I have a 55-94 with Duncan p'ups. I find that I need to run the little gain pot, on the inside, up pretty high to get the ooomph I'd like out of this Bass. Especially compared to the similar p'up setup in my Bongo 5 H/S. Has anyone modded their preamp to run @ 18 volts (like on a Bongo), to increase the pre's headroom. How were your results and who did the work. Thanks in advance for your advice.

Headroom and gain or two very different things. Going to 18 volts will not necessarily increase the actual output level, just the input level capability of the pre from the pickups prior to distorting (which is usually not an issue unless you use gorilla technique and/or a ton of bass boost on the on-board pre).

Your amp's input gain is designed so that basses with very different outputs will sound the same through your amp by varying the level of the input gain.

Make sure you are using the passive or non-padded input, and there should be no reason that you can't get a great, full volume tone out of your amp versus your bongo by turning up the input gain a touch more.

 

[buzzbass]

Headroom and gain or two very different things. Going to 18 volts will not necessarily increase the actual output level, just the input level capability of the pre from the pickups prior to distorting (which is usually not an issue unless you use gorilla technique and/or a ton of bass boost on the on-board pre).

Your amp's input gain is designed so that basses with very different outputs will sound the same through your amp by varying the level of the input gain.

Make sure you are using the passive or non-padded input, and there should be no reason that you can't get a great, full volume tone out of your amp versus your bongo by turning up the input gain a touch more.

All things being equal, IE; not messing with the amp at all. That Bongo just sounds so much fuller and thicker. The high/low mid EQ on that thing is a secret weapon. I do tend to favor a more bassey tone though, and since my 55-94 is only a 3 band, I'm thinking that 18v may help. I'm afraid the the 55-94s pre will start to clip if I turn up that inner gain pot much more, or if the battery starts to get a little low. I do have my mid select on the 55-94 set for the 250Hz setting, and that has helped. Where does everyone else set their mid switches @ ? I couldn't possibly plug the Bongo into the passive output either, it's output is just so hot. Bottom line is that I want my 55-94 to sound more like my Bongo, and I'm wondering if there is an easy way to accomplish this.

 

[KJung]

All things being equal, IE; not messing with the amp at all. That Bongo just sounds so much fuller and thicker. The high/low mid EQ on that thing is a secret weapon. I do tend to favor a more bassey tone though, and since my 55-94 is only a 3 band, I'm thinking that 18v may help. I'm afraid the the 55-94s pre will start to clip if I turn up that inner gain pot much more, or if the battery starts to get a little low. I do have my mid select on the 55-94 set for the 250Hz setting, and that has helped. Where does everyone else set their mid switches @ ? I couldn't possibly plug the Bongo into the passive output either, it's output is just so hot. Bottom line is that I want my 55-94 to sound more like my Bongo, and I'm wondering if there is an easy way to accomplish this.

Again, it makes sense to use the padded input for the Bongo, since they are so hot. You should use the non-padded, passive input for the 55-94, and adjust the gain accordingly. That will result in the same input signal hitting your EQ and power amp. The WHOLE point of having a gain control and the pad capability is to equate the different outputs of different basses.

Regarding the actual tone, the 55-94 will never sound a Bongo, nor the other way around. But, output level should have nothing to do with it.

 

[buzzbass]

Again, it makes sense to use the padded input for the Bongo, since they are so hot. You should use the non-padded, passive input for the 55-94, and adjust the gain accordingly. That will result in the same input signal hitting your EQ and power amp. The WHOLE point of having a gain control and the pad capability is to equate the different outputs of different basses.

Regarding the actual tone, the 55-94 will never sound a Bongo, nor the other way around. But, output level should have nothing to do with it.

well, I have my mid switch set @ 250Hz. I'm getting closer@ that setting. With this pre, if I turn up a lot of mids, and just a slight amount of bass, the lakie's pre starts to clip. Doesn't matter which amp input I use. Hence my question about converting to 18v.

 

[KJung]

well, I have my mid switch set @ 250Hz. I'm getting closer@ that setting. With this pre, if I turn up a lot of mids, and just a slight amount of bass, the lakie's pre starts to clip. Doesn't matter which amp input I use. Hence my question about converting to 18v.

If you are really cranking the tone controls on your pre in the upper bass/lower mid region, then extra headroom might help. My guess is, the Lakland is not 18 volt capable, and you'd have to route to make room for the extra battery even if it was. It sounds like you are trying to muscle to inherent tone of one fine instrument to match the inherent tone of another fine instrument. That is usually the recipe for endless tweaking and frustration. Play the Bongo!

Again, from your original post, you were talking about output level. 18 volt won't help you there, but using the correct input (non-padded passive) will. If you are cranking the pre tone controls enough to clip a well made preamp (9 volt or otherwise), IMO, that gets into 'operator error' territory for me.

EQ is best used to cut in general, and for those little battery operated on-board systems, is best used to tweak, not to change the inherent tone of an instrument. The higher quality and more powerful amplifier EQ is better used for that IMO.

 

[JazznFunk]

If you are really cranking the tone controls on your pre in the upper bass/lower mid region, then extra headroom might help. My guess is, the Lakland is not 18 volt capable, and you'd have to route to make room for the extra battery even if it was. It sounds like you are trying to muscle to inherent tone of one fine instrument to match the inherent tone of another fine instrument. That is usually the recipe for endless tweaking and frustration. Play the Bongo!

Again, from your original post, you were talking about output level. 18 volt won't help you there, but using the correct input (non-padded passive) will. If you are cranking the pre tone controls enough to clip a well made preamp (9 volt or otherwise), IMO, that gets into 'operator error' territory for me.

EQ is best used to cut in general, and for those little battery operated on-board systems, is best used to tweak, not to change the inherent tone of an instrument. The higher quality and more powerful amplifier EQ is better used for that IMO.

I'm assuming you're setting the gain on your amp at the max/clip point when you are setting things up with the 55-94? Dig in and turn the gain up the point where the preamp on the amp itself clips, then back it off. That ensures you get the maximum noise to signal ratio and max headroom/input out of the bass itself. My 44-02 with the LH-3 pre is monstrously big in output, with everything set flat. I do have my mid DIP switches set for 450Hz, and this control DOES change the overall tone of the instrument, even flat. The Bongo, and most MusicMans in general are more 'aggressive' than a Lakland. The LH-3 is definitely more colored and aggressive than the Bart systems that I've heard, but I have never played a Bart-equipped Lakland personally.

 

[denchiq]

My guess is, the Lakland is not 18 volt capable, and you'd have to route to make room for the extra battery even if it was.

In fact, it is. The 55-94 preamp is designed so that you can easily have it 18v, but you have to look for some place for the second battery. I hear there are some space-saving two-battery clips in the market but I've never seen one -or didn't know it.

 

[buzzbass]

I'm assuming you're setting the gain on your amp at the max/clip point when you are setting things up with the 55-94? Dig in and turn the gain up the point where the preamp on the amp itself clips, then back it off. That ensures you get the maximum noise to signal ratio and max headroom/input out of the bass itself. My 44-02 with the LH-3 pre is monstrously big in output, with everything set flat. I do have my mid DIP switches set for 450Hz, and this control DOES change the overall tone of the instrument, even flat. The Bongo, and most MusicMans in general are more 'aggressive' than a Lakland. The LH-3 is definitely more colored and aggressive than the Bart systems that I've heard, but I have never played a Bart-equipped Lakland personally.

would you suggest me setting my slector switch @ 250 or 400 500 Hz to get that low end punch. the bass pot is @ 40Hz, which is too low for what I'm trying to emulate

 

[buzzbass]

I'm assuming you're setting the gain on your amp at the max/clip point when you are setting things up with the 55-94? Dig in and turn the gain up the point where the preamp on the amp itself clips, then back it off. That ensures you get the maximum noise to signal ratio and max headroom/input out of the bass itself. My 44-02 with the LH-3 pre is monstrously big in output, with everything set flat. I do have my mid DIP switches set for 450Hz, and this control DOES change the overall tone of the instrument, even flat. The Bongo, and most MusicMans in general are more 'aggressive' than a Lakland. The LH-3 is definitely more colored and aggressive than the Bart systems that I've heard, but I have never played a Bart-equipped Lakland personally.

yes, amp gain is set so that the clip light just flickers with notes below the E string 5th fret, and most notes on the B as well.

 

[JazznFunk]

would you suggest me setting my slector switch @ 250 or 400 500 Hz to get that low end punch. the bass pot is @ 40Hz, which is too low for what I'm trying to emulate

I never went as low as 250, but I find that 425 or 450 gives me a little bit of a scoop, but still enough throaty voice to make it workable. I tend to boost mids on most other basses, but the 44-02 is voiced so well at 425Hz that I rarely touch the mid knob now. Maybe that will help? Again, it's better to cut frequencies rather than boost extremes, especially if headroom is a concern.

 

[buzzbass]

Bah, I only have a choice of 250 or 500 in the lower range.

 

[pickles]

Hey, the bongo is a cool bass with a unique sound. Just play it. Trying to get one bass to sound like another will only lead to frustration. Just love the lakland for what it is or let it go.