Double Bass Active PA with the DPA 4099b

[Ric Vice]

Now we have some really useful recordings. The Bose held up admirably jamming with my friends. I'm not sure if you can tell from the recordings but the drummer is really bashing and the saxophonist told me he was blowing his lungs out. My ears are still ringing. Keep in mind, we are talking about using a mic at these volumes.

Nice bass lines, solos and tone Don. Since you're playing without a chordal instrument, the bass sits in the mix beautifully. With a guitar I think timbre and available volume from the DPA through the Bose would be adequate. Once you add a piano to that ensemble, it would be harder for the DPA to keep up. Still it's a exquisite sound coming from the L1.

DPA, JoeMeek, GEQ, Bose L1 (https://soundcloud.com/don-sibley/oleo)

Switched out the mic for the Ehrlund and asked the trumpet player to play my bass.

EAP, JM, GEQ, Bose (https://soundcloud.com/don-sibley/all-blues)

Now you get to say you told me so. The recording comes out a little cleaner than it was in the room. There was definitely some subwoofer/floor coupling going on that was messing with clarity in first position. I'm wondering if an auralex wedge could counteract this phenomenon. I think the room had a resonance around 98hz (G). I had this slider cut by 12db and still excited the space.

Possibly, but you have to ask yourself, " how much gear do I really want to cart around to a gig", and "is it really the best system if I have to keep adding additional pieces to get it to work in a live situation. Just my take, but less is more. You have a wonderful sound, great technique, and inspired musicality. The bass sounds great on it's own, especially with a bow. So, to me the challenge is to find the least amount of gear that gets you your sound.

Ric

 

[Don Sibley]

Possibly, but you have to ask yourself, " how much gear do I really want to cart around to a gig", and "is it really the best system if I have to keep adding additional pieces to get it to work in a live situation. Just my take, but less is more.

Ric

I was thinking the same thing. I'm going to keep experimenting with the equipment I have here and I want to pair up the Big E with a Clarus+. See how that sounds.

 

[rickwolff]

you have to ask yourself, " how much gear do I really want to cart around to a gig", and "is it really the best system if I have to keep adding additional pieces to get it to work in a live situation. Just my take, but less is more. You have a wonderful sound, great technique, and inspired musicality. The bass sounds great on it's own, especially with a bow. So, to me the challenge is to find the least amount of gear that gets you your sound.

Ric

Maybe it's time for a name and club for our little group looking for the ultimate - yet relatively easy - amplified double bass sound. The Seekers? The Obsessors?? The Group suffering from Terminal Gas????

Anyway, my new toy arrived. Just tried it quickly in the practice room and will take it on the gig tonight.

What I was looking for:

- something which could handle both PU (Lifeline) and Mic (currently a Pro 35)

- something light weight so I could get it up to ear level or better stage monitoring

- something that can interface with FOH (DI line etc)

- Oh, and something fun or 'cool'

Heres what I got: I hope the pictures show up. If they don't I will re-post.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...01048082417098&type=1&relevant_count=1&ref=nf

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[rickwolff]

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I have my Pro 35 mic clipped to the Lifeline Pickup.

And yes, the new toy is the Phil Jones Bass Cub, all 13 pounds of it. In the practice room it sounds really nice with the mic and even though I was just 5 feet away and the amp angled a little bit away, it didn't show any signs of feedback at all. Looking forward to checking it out on the gig tonight.

Rick

 

[Don Sibley]

Heres what I got: I hope the pictures show up. If they don't I will re-post.

Very cool. Let us know how that works.

That ART works in a pinch. I bought one to work with my DPA but it's pretty noisy and the tube will add midrange twang to your sound. If this set up is working for you I would recommend a solid-state channel strip with variable impedance adjustment on the mic input (incredibly useful). That's the only thing this JoeMeek 3Q is missing.

Here are a couple of examples:

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http://www.musiciansfriend.com/pro-audio/summit-audio-2ba-221-tube-mic-and-line-module

 

[rickwolff]

I was probably into the second tune and thinking this might not work. Then I flipped the phase switch on my Fishman PP and all of a sudden my bass was there.

The gig was outside - a patio at a restaurant - so probably not ideal. I ran both the Lifeline and the Pro 35 at the same time. Very natural 'double bass sound'. The guitar player mentioned it several times while we were playing. it doesn't get the big bottom end like my 15 inch speaker but actually sounds more natural - it felt like I was playing my bass and not playing the amplifier.

I want to get a stand of some kind so I can get it up close to ear level, and between me and the guitar player. Tonight it was on a table off to the side.

So I have to say it is very promising. I found myself thinking that I would like to work more gigs where this little amp is sufficient. It really seems to lend itself to an 'enhanced acoustic' kind of thing. 'Perhaps this could be the start of a beautiful friendship'.

 

[Don Sibley]

I was probably into the second tune and thinking this might not work. Then I flipped the phase switch on my Fishman PP and all of a sudden my bass was there.

I need to play with phase switches more often. I just never think of it.

Here's what I did this afternoon:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/z99h2zypy1hqjzk/2013-08-07 15.21.26.jpg

Totally different sound. To me, these cabs sound even better elevated. Focused, tight, punchy. I even liked the Fishman FC on this setup, and I hate that thing. The EAP sounded even better. I can't wait to try this with the new Clarus+.

Also, I had much better luck following the advice from one of the other threads: turn the output gain way up, like 3 o'clock and then adjust volume with the input gain. Much cleaner, less "honky" tone.

 

[gack]

Badong, have you modified Big E by yourself or Mike started to do such upgrades? Your examples are great by the way, subscribed! ))

 

[Don Sibley]

I added the mounting cup with plenty of guidance from Mike but he is now offering it as an option when buying a new cab or you can send it back.

 

[rickwolff]

I can't wait to try this with the new Clarus+.

Don,

I wish I had your equipment budget. As it is I think I am 'there' for the time being. I've got some good prospects for more low volume almost-acoustic gigs and should be able to cover those with what I've got. For louder things i just use the Eminence and the BG250.

I was glad my wife didn't bat an eye when I dropped 5 large on the new Shen, but yesterday when the Bass Cub arrived she said 'I hope your done buying equipment for a while'.

It's a compromise I'm happy to make in order to be able to retire from the day gig and just have fun playing music again. As a friend of mine used to say "You're never too old to have a good childhood"

Rick

 

[Don Sibley]

I wish I had your equipment budget.

Ha ha! "Hello. My name is Don and I have an addiction."

Nah, The only money I've spent so far is on shipping, which has been considerable, but it has been invaluable try gear out in live situations. If I do end up buying the Clarus+ (more than likely) I'll have to unload the iAmp to help pay for it.

That's great that you found a rig for "acoustic reinforcement". In those situations I'm still pretty happy with my GK MBS150 and the EAP. You can't get much more portable, rugged or simple than that. It just gets wonky real quick if you boost the input gain past 10 o'clock. It only seems to work in quiet situations.

I'm looking for something to get me through gigs in weird rooms with overly enthusiastic drummers.

 

[Don Sibley]

I think I'm moving away from the powered speaker thing for now. I mounted my MAS45 on a stand and got a lot more volume before feedback with the DPA and the EAP. I think this is a good cab for this purpose since it has a limited vertical dispersion and a wide horizontal dispersion. Still looking for a front end for this cab. My iAmp Pro isn't giving me the sound I'm looking for and does not offer a mic input.

I elevated my GK MB150S on a stool and a table which had a similar result though to a lesser degree since that combo has a wider vertical dispersion. Still it helped enough that I'm going to install a stand mounting cup as described in the other thread. Plus I like having the sound source up at ear level.

 

[Ric Vice]

I think I'm moving away from the powered speaker thing for now. I mounted my MAS45 on a stand and got a lot more volume before feedback with the DPA and the EAP. I think this is a good cab for this purpose since it has a limited vertical dispersion and a wide horizontal dispersion. Still looking for a front end for this cab. My iAmp Pro isn't giving me the sound I'm looking for and does not offer a mic input.

Badong,
Although I like my QSC K8 because it's portable, It just doesn't have the low end response or smooth transition between registers, that the Audiokinesis TC 112 has with a either of my Walter Woods amps. I think that while powered speakers are a good option, a well built bass amp and cabinet will still have the advantage tonally.

I elevated my GK MB150S on a stool and a table which had a similar result though to a lesser degree since that combo has a wider vertical dispersion. Still it helped enough that I'm going to install a stand mounting cup as described in the other thread. Plus I like having the sound source up at ear level.

That's the real plus of using Mikes 4/5 because you can elevate the cabinet without loosing bass response, whereas the TC 112 was designed to be coupled with the floor. I'm sure that you could probably find one of the GK metal mounts that they designed for the amp. I had one, and it worked great. Unfortunately, I don't think they make them any more.

Ric

 

[rickwolff]

I've been REALLY impressed with my PJB Bass Cub so far. I think if I were to add the PJ PB6, the powered speaker with 6 of his neo speakers and 300 watts I would have everything covered I ever need to do (I don't play rock and roll).

The little Cub, which only weighs 13 pounds works great for those quiter gigs (I have found it does more than 'nearly acoustic' only), and adding the powered cab would bump me into a whole other catergory. Plus, the powered cab frequency response is from 30 Hz to 15K. (Yea, 30 Hz). The two items are priced reasonably in my opinion also - about $1200 for a very flexible modular setup.

Also, being that the Cub is two channel it would work well for doubling.

I guess I am done thinking about a powered PA as well.

 

[Don Sibley]

I've been REALLY impressed with my PJB Bass Cub so far. I think if I were to add the PJ PB6, the powered speaker with 6 of his neo speakers and 300 watts I would have everything covered I ever need to do (I don't play rock and roll).

I think, based on what I've read that would be a good way to go. If I didn't already own the MB150S i'd be inclined to pickup the Bass Cub. Looks like a really cool unit. 13lbs, 2 channel and ,$600, good stuff.