ADVICE: Bigger amp, still good tone at lower volume?

[JahRiddim]

I have been playing through my Roland Cube 20XL for home practice for a couple years since picking up the bass. I play a passive, Fender Aerodyne. I now have experience playing on bigger rigs in both studios and small stages. Of course, no question the tone is better when I am playing out.

I am looking to purchase a mid-sized combo or amp/cab for home that will sound good at lower volume for home (2-3 volume) and can still project well when I want to cart it to a rehearsal or small gig (7-8 volume). Tone is most important and I also need to ensure I don't shake my neighbors next door (I live in a house, but close to neighbors). Finally, I generally play Blues and Reggae, with a bit of funk and rock.

Been checking out all the regular options in the 1x12, 1x15, and 2x10 setups in the $300-600 range. It is difficult to know how good they will sound at home at low volume vs testing in a big, open store.

Appreciate any advice and experience. Thanks!

 

[beans-on-toast]

The key to low volume / neighbors and good sound is elevating the speakers as close to ear level as you can and position yourself close to the amp.

Experiment by trying it with your Roland Cube and see how much you can turn down.

 

[JahRiddim]

Thanks for your response. To clarify, I am looking for a bigger rig that I can take out + play at lower volumes at home. The Roland Cube won't work anywhere, but my home office. My main concern is which larger rig (1x12, 1x15, and 2x10 setups in the $300-600 range) which will work at higher volumes at rehearsals and small gigs, but will also sound good at lower volumes at home. Hope this makes sense.

 

[Rick James]

The amp will have pretty much the same response at any volume, unless you're preferred tone relies on overdriving the amp and/or speakers. The subjective tone at low versus high volumes will be very different, with any amp, because what you hear changes with volume. Google 'equal loudness'. Get whatever sounds best to you where it's most important, on stage, and live with it at home. For best results at home you'd boost the low and high EQ compared to how you have them set at high volume.

 

[beans-on-toast]

Thanks for your response. To clarify, I am looking for a bigger rig that I can take out + play at lower volumes at home. The Roland Cube won't work anywhere, but my home office. My main concern is which larger rig (1x12, 1x15, and 2x10 setups in the $300-600 range) which will work at higher volumes at rehearsals and small gigs, but will also sound good at lower volumes at home. Hope this makes sense.

My point was, any bigger rig can be played at lower volume levels, elevating it to ear level helps keep the volume level even lower. Crack the volume open on the amp, use the bass’s volume control if necessary. It doesn’t have to be loud, just because it’s a bigger rig. For at home practice, good enough.

 

[pfschim]

I have long advocated that you should use your live rig as your practice rig unless there is some factor preventing that. In my experience, the habit of using your live rig as your practice rig will make you more familiar with the live rig which can only help you get the most out of it for live work. Again, IMO/IME.

As has already been said, all amps have a volume knob ... and while they may behave a bit differently when turned way up than at very low home practice volumes its still a good practice.

The only thing I have noticed over the years is that when an amp is turned pretty far up its available power/volume levels .. the resulting tone/sound does have a tendency to become more touch sensitive (totally to be expected) ... so there is that.

 

[chaosMK]

I find that bigger cabs tend to want a little more juice before they fill in a satisfying way. Higher end cabs can make a difference. I still enjoy my Mesa PH112, used it as my primary for a few years in a medium-loud rock band with two guitarists. Worked great on stage. For more br00tal situations I use a 4x10 or two.

There are endless good options for combos. I was impressed by GK MB at one point. I helped my friend load it off stage and it weighed almost nothing and sounded surprisingly big/punchy during their set.

 

[seamonkey]

Your hearing changes. See: Equal-loudness contour - Wikipedia

When playing quieter you lose sensitivity in lows and highs. Most often you can tweak the tone controls to boost the bass back up. But some bass cabinets just aren't designed well and don't reproduce bass well. They are only designed for cranking bass volume levels, and at cranked levels you don't need as much bass as you would at quiet levels.

Most cab makers will not even publish real measurements on what their cabinets can do. It would make life easier if they did.

So instead, Many retailers give you a 30 day trial, take advantage of it to try out a cab at home, gig, and rehearsal. It's the second best way to know

 

[mbell75]

Thanks for your response. To clarify, I am looking for a bigger rig that I can take out + play at lower volumes at home.

Any of the 100, 200 or 500 Fender Rumble combo amps.

 

[Wasnex]

I have been playing through my Roland Cube 20XL for home practice for a couple years since picking up the bass. I play a passive, Fender Aerodyne. I now have experience playing on bigger rigs in both studios and small stages. Of course, no question the tone is better when I am playing out.

I am looking to purchase a mid-sized combo or amp/cab for home that will sound good at lower volume for home (2-3 volume) and can still project well when I want to cart it to a rehearsal or small gig (7-8 volume). Tone is most important and I also need to ensure I don't shake my neighbors next door (I live in a house, but close to neighbors). Finally, I generally play Blues and Reggae, with a bit of funk and rock.

Been checking out all the regular options in the 1x12, 1x15, and 2x10 setups in the $300-600 range. It is difficult to know how good they will sound at home at low volume vs testing in a big, open store.

Appreciate any advice and experience. Thanks!

I think you are worrying too much. I have a basement full of amps ranging from 12.5W up to 2,500W and they all sound great at low volume. The one issue you may need to be concerned with is fan noise. My vintages SVTs are the worst in this respect. The fans are even noticeable on stage. I used my first SVT in a big band (jazz); people in the band made lot's of jokes about the amp being ready for take off and such.

One area where you need to crank up to get a certain sound is when you are pushing a tube amp into saturation. A big tube amp will develop a different sound and feel as it is pushed to the edge, so you need to crank up if this is your goal. My SVTs sound great a low volume, they are just super clean and punchy.

 

[Matthias]

IME a bass sounds better when you dig in at least a little and not just pet the strings. Same is true for speaker cabs. So a 500W amp and cab will not have the same sound and feel at bedroom level as at higher volumes. Despite of that it can give you a very clean and 'hifi' sound.
Any kind of 'loudness' control ('contour', 'voicing', 'aural enhancer', whatsoever) will help. You definitely need different EQ settings with less mids ('smiley EQ') at low volume.

 

[InhumanResource]

Thanks for your response. To clarify, I am looking for a bigger rig that I can take out + play at lower volumes at home. The Roland Cube won't work anywhere, but my home office. My main concern is which larger rig (1x12, 1x15, and 2x10 setups in the $300-600 range) which will work at higher volumes at rehearsals and small gigs, but will also sound good at lower volumes at home. Hope this makes sense.

I would put a GK MB210 on your shortlist for sure. I have the 212 and it suits every situation I've thrown at it so far.

 

[whatever4]

I live in an apartment. If I try to use my gig rig, the 4 x 10 moves too much air, and I can physically feel the bass at low volumes, which would upset the neighbors unless I EQ the bass all the way down and play with nothing but treble that gets buried in fan noise. For a good full low-volume practice sound, I like a tiny practice amp with a 6" or 8" speaker or headphones.

 

[arbiterusa]

I have long advocated that you should use your live rig as your practice rig unless there is some factor preventing that. In my experience, the habit of using your live rig as your practice rig will make you more familiar with the live rig which can only help you get the most out of it for live work.

This. I fully agree, and have never done anything else. How are you going to know how to make it happen at the gig otherwise?



Believe it or not, this sounds great at low volume.

 

[Downunderwonder]

Beware of bedroom / loungeroom best ever tone. Frequently it will not do you any good at a gig.

Your main concern is having enough rig for the gig.

Some light reading for you:

I am a 210 vertical stack believer!!

 

[bobyoung53]

Most amps that sound good loud will sound good soft and any amp can be used in your bedroom if you turn them down enough, don't worry about that. I live in an apartment and have checked an SVT head for several days with a 15" speaker in my bedroom with no complaints at all and actually it was one of the best sounding practice rigs I've ever used.
You're going to need a lot less bottom playing in a live band than in your bedroom, what sounds good in a bedroom with sound like mush live. The more gigs you do with your amp the better you'll know the amp and how to set it to different room vagaries. I usually start with the tones set close to 12 o'clock and go from there.

 

[sikamikanico]

My experience is that low volume sound is different than high volume, but I guess that depends on how low your low volume needs to be...

But why not continue using the Roland for practice, and focus on getting a combo for playing out?

 

[Wasnex]

My experience is that low volume sound is different than high volume, but I guess that depends on how low your low volume needs to be...

No one is arguing against this point. The Fletcher Munson curve virtually guarantees that you are correct. That doesn't mean a powerful amp will not sound good at low volume. It just means you need to adjust the controls as you turn down.

 

[cableguy]

I would start with a micro head of your choice/budget. Add one small cab of your choice/budget. (2x10, 1x12, etc) Add another identical cab for more volume or a bigger separate cab for bigger gigs. 4x10 or 8x10 cabs come up pretty cheap used.

 

[JahRiddim]

Thanks for all your responses. I think the key messages are:
1. A good rig of any size should sound good at both higher and lower volumes (but might need some tweaking of EQ levels)
2. It is good to practice with a rig that you will use both home and out, so you can really know it.
3. Probably good to check the fan noise at low volumes.

I live 2 hours from the closest music shops, so not the easiest to pickup and trial at home.

Currently looking at:
1. AMPEGs BA-112 & 115
2. Fender Rumble 100
3. TC Electronic BG250- 112, 115, & 210
4. MarkBass JB School & 121P (if I can find one used)
5. Based on recommendations, I will see if I can find the GK MB combos anywhere.

Thanks for your responses!