• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Advice on Singing and Playing...

Mike Sorr

Mike Sorr

Oct 24, 2012
3,010
3,168
Manchester, NJ
www.graceandpeace.org
#1
Lately I've been asked to sing lead on a few songs while playing bass. I have always been awed by players like Geddy, Sting, Phil Lynott, Chris Squire...guys who are excellent players and can sing while they're playing. I must have some kind of mental block when it comes to this because for the life of me I can't coordinate it. Now, I admit I do not consider myself a lead vocalist, but I do it out of necessity when called upon and always sans bass. When I sing backups I need to dumb down the bass lines as much as possible to be able to pull it off. Can anyone offer advice on the best way to practice this? I always seem to automatically gravitate to either the bass line or the vocal line at the expense of the other. Do I need to partition my mind somehow to think in two directions at once or something?
 
#2
I am no expert, but had the same problem until about two years ago. I worked on singing to a basic walking blues style bass line. Most bass players can play these lines in their sleep, which is important. For me, after getting it so I could sing while my fingers were "busy" it sort of clicked for me.
Good luck!
 
#3
find something you can play or sing really , really well .... like ' in your sleep ' good ... !! try working in a vocal part ( or bass part ) line by line .... I would kinda make my own scribbled notes to help guide me ... but Don't Ever keep playing the same thing wrong - over and over ... !! stop / slow down and get it right ... if you get it in your head " wrong " ,... it's much harder to get it Right ... or find a couple tunes where the bass and vocal kinda take turns .... or sing some tunes with very straight bass parts to get a better feel for the timing of playing and singing ... or try just ' talking / speaking ' the lyrics to get a feel for the timing and placement of the Words ... then ad the melody/pitch ... you have a little mental roadblock ... don't try to knock it down , just work around it .. !!
 
  • Like
Reactions: brian_bazz
#4
Yes to talking the words. I started on rhythm guitar and learned how to sing and play on that instrument by reciting under my breath (not singing) the lyrics so I know where the chord changes are. This grew into increasing the reciting into singing. And with this band I now do sing backup out loud.

On the bass I still follow the lyrics and sing, under my breath, for the same reason - so I know where the changes are. You really do not want to hear me sing a solo... others do a much better job, and in this band neither I or the drummer sing out loud.

Practice reciting and take reciting to singing would by my recommendation.
 
#6
Also, I read one of my heroes just keeps on going over the bassline sat on the couch, and once he can talk to the wife who popped in to ask something and he's able to answer while still playing that bassline; he's got it down.
Only then he'll work on the vocals. For me that works too, but it's weird how some of the easier parts (be it, vocal or instrumental) can still be really tough to do simultaneously...
 
#8
Try to learn songs that are written and sung by bass players...those seem to be the easiest for another bassist/singer to learn...while I'm learning the bass line...I memorize the words and melody...so that all parts are second nature for me seperately...then I listen to what syllables are being sung for every bass note during the most difficult passages...and coordinating the timing of the two as I practice...I try to make sure I don't have to crib at all by the time I get to band rehearsal...having the words and melody down...plus the bass part...and work on smoothing everything out counting on the band to pick me up while I work through the weak spots...hope this helps...
 
Last edited:
#9
Mike Sorr said:
Lately I've been asked to sing lead on a few songs while playing bass. I have always been awed by players like Geddy, Sting, Phil Lynott, Chris Squire...guys who are excellent players and can sing while they're playing. I must have some kind of mental block when it comes to this because for the life of me I can't coordinate it. Now, I admit I do not consider myself a lead vocalist, but I do it out of necessity when called upon and always sans bass. When I sing backups I need to dumb down the bass lines as much as possible to be able to pull it off. Can anyone offer advice on the best way to practice this? I always seem to automatically gravitate to either the bass line or the vocal line at the expense of the other. Do I need to partition my mind somehow to think in two directions at once or something?
Click to expand...

I have played a lot of Rush, having played every song in their pre Clockwork Angels catalog at some point or another. And I can say that the "secret" is to simply know BOTH parts so well that you can think about one or the other without the other suffering for it. It all needs to be perfect muscle memory, more so the bass part, but also the vocal line. For particularly tricky sections, try and work out how the vocals and bass move together rhythmically. You need to understand the polyrhythms that are going on there and internalize it as one part, not unlike playing drums. It's very much practice, and it happens with every individual song. you need to know it well enough that you don't need your full concentration to sing or play it correctly so that you have brainpower to spare for the other parts.

So to summarize, rhythm is of the utmost importance, and the rest is just all practice.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Crazy_Jake
#11
I sing several songs lead and as a matter of principle I play the original bass parts to the songs while seeing - ie no dumbing it down. The process for me when I am learning to sing and play a song - learn the bass line for the song - play it a million times until your fingers just work on auto pilot - at that point add in the vocals - rinse and repeat. There are no shortcuts imo
 
#13
There are other threads on this, but for now, some stuff I've noticed...

One, know your range as a singer and don't sabotage yourself trying to sing anything that's just out of your range. That will include a great deal of Sting for most of us, unless you're a high tenor.
Two, start simple - simple melodies to songs where you know the lyrics cold and can sing them in your sleep, simple root-pumping bass lines. Avoid syncopated songs where the lyrics and vocals are all out of synch. I found Better than Ezra's "Good" to be a good tune to start singing with. Try more complex parts once you've gotten used to the simple ones, and watch where accented syllables and accented notes fall together - they give you landmarks.

Three, breathe. For some reason, I keep catching myself holding my breath while playing bass. Make an effort to breathe deeply through your bass playing. Practice doing that even when you're not singing.

Four, "hear" the note you're singing in your head. If I'm mentally listening to my bass line I tend to get dragged off pitch vocally and usually wind up flat.
 
#15
Good advice here(pages 3 & 4 mainly):
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

The "playing with your eyes closed" is equal to "playing in a completely dark room". Both make you learn your instrument. I've come to realize it is very similar to putting a right hand and left hand keyboard part together as described by my son. He'd get them both down separately and then practice them together. If you watch "singing bass players" you can see(in their eyes) them going between the vocal and the bass line in their mind....IMO.
 
#16
I do both all the time, as well as play fretless. It becomes less difficult the more you do it. The thing that helps me the most is to not really concentrate on either thing, but rather to try to produce a whole sound. You know what the tune is supposed to sound like, use your ears and make that sound come to life.
 
  • Like
Reactions: oldfclefer and RDUB
#17
I'm once again tackling the Police tribute band... 5th try in ten years! Of course I'm assuming the Sting role. Anyone who has played a number of his song will tell you that although the bass lines aren't super complex, marrying them to his lyrics is often quite challenging due to his penchant of writing and singing vocals that counter rhythm to the bass lines. A few years ago, I stumbled onto a trick that really helped me with my dual role as singer and player.I found this trick to help master it.

Find the root of the pulse, and learn to sing to that first. In this case, on "Driven To Tears", it's the low "A" on the down beat. The first vocal line of the song comes in on that first up-beat. If I put the "A" root in bold and underneath, it would look something like this:
...."How can you say that you're not responsible?"
A A A A

....."What does it have to do with me?"
A A A A

Note that the first words in the lyrics are sung on the up beat, just after you play the defining "A" that establishes the tempo. Separately, practice the bass line until you get it down. After you think the line is pretty automatic, then start trying to put the two together. Take it slow. It won't come easy at first. But it will come.

PS. Here's the blogpost I wrote about it a couple of years ago.

 
#18
Mike Sorr said:
Lately I've been asked to sing lead on a few songs while playing bass. I have always been awed by players like Geddy, Sting, Phil Lynott, Chris Squire...guys who are excellent players and can sing while they're playing. I must have some kind of mental block when it comes to this because for the life of me I can't coordinate it. Now, I admit I do not consider myself a lead vocalist, but I do it out of necessity when called upon and always sans bass. When I sing backups I need to dumb down the bass lines as much as possible to be able to pull it off. Can anyone offer advice on the best way to practice this? I always seem to automatically gravitate to either the bass line or the vocal line at the expense of the other. Do I need to partition my mind somehow to think in two directions at once or something?
Click to expand...

I know this is an old thread but I just got on here a few days ago. You left out McCartney by the way. I recall reading something from Sting about singing while playing bass, he said he deliberately left "holes" in his playing to allow him to sing easier to it. I am struggling with singing while playing right now. I never had a problem with this on either rhythm guitar or keyboard but for some reason playing bass and singing, even background, is difficult for me. I feel like I'm a guy who can't walk and chew gum simultaneously at times.
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back