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Double Bass Alternatives for MAS 18

T

tito mangialajo

Feb 1, 2006
422
102
Italy
titomangialajorantzer.bandcamp.com
#1
I have an Headway EB-2. I like to match it with a good powered speaker. I play jazz mostly in little, medium room/stage (pub, jazz club, little concert hall); mostly from trio to nonet (mainly with drums). For what I read hear, the best options is the MAS 18. I trust in you. I wrote to Mike Arnopol and it's possible to have his speaker here in Italy, but I have to buy the MAS 18 blindly: no chance, I think, to test it with my bass and (my ears) before...
Could you mentioned any other speaker from worldwide major brand (I think QSC, Yamaha, EV, Mackie...) that are good and that I can possibly test here in a shop?
Or I have to strongly trust in your good comments on TB and buy with no fear the MAS 18?
Please, help me...
 
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#2
Tito,
I understand you're reluctance to do a "blind by" on the reccommendations of others. From my perspective the MAS 1/8 is the best powered bass speaker avaliable for it's weight, sound and tone.
I've played the other compeditors, whom I really respect but the 1/8 is the speaker I take out to play professionally. There are other great speakers like the Bergantino,Birdhaus 4x6, Acoustic Image Double Shot
Euphonic Audio Wizzy's. Unfortunately, they aren't powered. QSC's sound very good but their design goal is different. Just my opinion of course. You should call Mike Arnopol and talk with him.
 
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#7
Mike Arnopol said:
Just to let you know---there is a 2 week trial period for my cabs. If you don't like it--send it back for full refund. I'll tell you what---since shipping is expensive from Italy--and I'm so confident of my cabs---if you don't like it I'll split return shipping. I like Italy and Italians.
Click to expand...
I bought Mike’s MAS 16 “sound unheard,” and am very happy with it. I also like Italians; my grandchildren are half-Italian!
 
#9
Clyde or Rick
I don't have any pics of the 16 with the slant back. Could you send me a pic? A customer wants to see what it looks like. I only have pics without the new slant back.
 
#10
IMG_20190714_134038744.jpg

11 inches deep at top
14 inches deep at the bottom
The back is vertical, picture distorted that.

The TC BAB200 drives it beautifully.

Mike Arnopol said:
Clyde or Rick
I don't have any pics of the 16 with the slant back. Could you send me a pic? A customer wants to see what it looks like. I only have pics without the new slant back.
Click to expand...

IMG_20190714_133622529.jpg
IMG_20190714_133614020.jpg
 
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#11
And, just for kicks, here's a couple videos I did comparing the Acoustic Sound to the sound through a piezo (KNA DB-1) to the TC BAM200 to the MAS 16 Speaker.

On the first recording the bass is in the same room so there is probably some acoustic bleed.

On the second recording I took the bass outside of the room and behind closed doors, so ALL you are hearing is the amplified sound.

Would I use this for recording? No. BUT, in a live situation it is a total No-Fuss No-Muss setup. One trip load in and out. AND Great Sound.

- Bass
- MAS 16 with BAM200 attached
- Three cables in the bass case pocket (power, instrument and speaker).



 
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#13
rickwolff said:
And, just for kicks, here's a couple videos I did comparing the Acoustic Sound to the sound through a piezo (KNA DB-1) to the TC BAM200 to the MAS 16 Speaker.

On the first recording the bass is in the same room so there is probably some acoustic bleed.

On the second recording I took the bass outside of the room and behind closed doors, so ALL you are hearing is the amplified sound.

Would I use this for recording? No. BUT, in a live situation it is a total No-Fuss No-Muss setup. One trip load in and out. AND Great Sound.

- Bass
- MAS 16 with BAM200 attached
- Three cables in the bass case pocket (power, instrument and speaker).



Click to expand...


Rick, the sound is so much more open than your other video with the KNA-BAM200-MAS16 setup! It sounded good before, but this is great! I really thought you were using a mic, not a piezo. You changed your strings right? Did you change anything else, maybe the EQ settings on the BAM? I was surprised to see all the knobs turned CCW, but it sure works.

I have been thinking recently that my piezo was probably the weak link in my signal chain (not that it's bad, I actually really like it), the thing keeping me from more of a MBOL sound. I thought I needed a mic in order to get a more natural sound, and a mic is probably a no-go for me. BUT, your bass sounds so open and natural!
 
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#14
Thanks, Elias. That's the thing that has really surprised me (in a very pleasant way). I'm guessing that a big part of the reason that this sounds so much like a mic rather than a piezo is the 10 MegOhm input on the BAM200.

As to why this sounds better than my previous videos I don't know. The only thing I have changed is the strings - from Obligatos to Perpetuals. Seems you prefer the sound of the Perpetuals. Your describing the sound as more 'Open' might be the steel core vs the synthetic core of the Oblis which gives them a little more of a gut or 'old school' vibe. It was that vibe that moved me to the Oblis in the first place after hearing Charlie Haden and liking his sound. To me, the Perpetuals lie somewhere between the Oblis and Spirocores. They're kind of a more polite Spiro - losing the twang but keeping the clarity.

I have the bass knob turned down to 9 or 10 because it's a small room that's a little boomy, but I tend to run it pretty much like that even on the gig. Without knowing or being able to explain exactly why, I just tend to fiddle a bit with the knobs until it sound closest to my acoustic sound.

Now that I have gotten my sound to where I am happy with it I just need to engage my 'booking agent' side and get some more gigs! I'll be sending out a bunch of post cards I had made up (which I'll follow up with phone calls and possibly some in-their-faces personal visits. I had one club owner tell me ' Rick, your so PUSHY'. I answered: 'Pushy'???? You're from New York and you're calling ME PUSHY????' But she hired me and I worked there a lot until she got tired of it and closed the club.

I met a booker who had finally hired our trio, and when I introduced myself he said 'Ah, the VERY PERSISTANT Rick Wolff'. I decided to take that as a compliment.
 
#16
Mike Arnopol said:
BTW---any powered 18 now comes with the 1200 watt Pascal module and the HPF. With the HPF---it goes as loud as two 18's without.
Click to expand...
Is it still $350 extra for powered? Can the powered still drive an extension speaker?

Does the hpf make 2 18s louder than a 18 and 28 together? I was considering a 28 but maybe I should look into a powered 18 to add with my passive 18. Still not completely thrilled with the tone from my Acoustic image clarus sl(its not horrible but I think it's currently the weak link).
 
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#17
SamuelHarris said:
Is it still $350 extra for powered? Can the powered still drive an extension speaker?

Does the hpf make 2 18s louder than a 18 and 28 together? I was considering a 28 but maybe I should look into a powered 18 to add with my passive 18. Still not completely thrilled with the tone from my Acoustic image clarus sl(its not horrible but I think it's currently the weak link).
Click to expand...

While I mine definitely does not have the HPF, it does have the power amp. I've used it driving my MAS 1/8 and 4x5 with no issues. The HPF is included with the price of the new Pascal Power module.
 
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#19
The new powered 18 is 1200 watts and features a power switch that when turned off disables the power amp connection to the internal speaker. There is a speaker output jack. When the switch is turned off the extension jack functions as a passive input so the speaker can be used with an external amp. When switched on the extension jack can be used to power a second speaker. The HPF then functions for the internal speaker as well as the extension speaker.
With the HPF you will get an additional 3db of output before low end fartout. That's the same as adding a second speaker.
SO--if you have two 18's and one is powered (with the HPF) you will have the effective output of four MAS 18's. And the low end will be better controlled and punchier.
BTW---this is the best single channel pre I've used for DB. (electric, too) It's normally $500 to $600 but this seller has them for $281. I bought one and 3 friends have. Reputable seller. It was designed by Malcolm Toft, the designer of the Trident studio boards. I love his sound concept. If you only use a single channel---buy one. (only 5 left in stock}
Bassics BPA-1 Bass Preamplifier | Diffusion Audio Inc
The addition of the 1200 watt Pascal board and the HPF is $400. I cannot retrofit them into existing cabs---too much work. Winds up costing about the same as selling yours used and buying a new one.
 
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#20
BTW--one more thing. I've changed the powered 18. Four guys have them and there was a consistent problem with all four. The amount of components stuffed into the driver chamber is nuts. There was a resonance that I didn't pick up. It doesn't do it with electric (for me) but does more so with DB. I've taken the cabs back and added a mini filter to bring the resonance down. It helps but I'm not satisfied.
I've changed the design of the 18 to house the electronics outside of the active enclosure. Imagine tilting the cab forward so that the top is parallel to the floor. I think that this is a much better way to add a power module.18p 3.jpg 18p 2.jpg 18p 1.jpg It adds very little to the size and it still functions as a wedge. No air turbulence and much less vibration. All future powered cabs will be done this way. The four guys that have the Pascal/HPF cabs. If you'd like---I'll switch things out to a new cab at no cost.
Oh---and for those whining about the top slanting---it doesn't on the powered 18
 
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