I been reading a lot of books and interviews recently from other musicians in order to advance my understanding of musical performance in general and quite a lot of them highly suggest the use of amp stands or tilt-back cabs during live shows. I can definitely see how this would improve the ability to hear yourself during a set and it would also limit blowing out the first few people in front of the stage. The strange thing is, I've NEVER seen one used in ANY show I've ever seen (live or taped). I'd like to get some feedback from those that use stands or tilt-back cabs to see if these things are legit. And if any of you have any sound board experience, chime in as well.
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Amp stands: Myth?
- Thread starter blahblahblake
- Start date
A number of people have used the On stage heavy duty T stand
http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/WS8540/
I own one and have used it on occassion. If your amp is only supplying you with the ability to hear yourself I think this is a great option it gets the speaker up to your ear and can provide better listening at lower volumes. Especially the case if you are usually within 6 feet of your amp on a small stage.
The down side is you tend to hear the upper and lower range of your bass differently and EQing it to what sounds good to you may not be what will be optimal to project into the audience. You also loose some coupling effect and low end, which may be good or bad.
If you like to create a pillow under the band, like lots of low end or are carrying the entire room with your amp this is not a great solution. Personally it became one more thing to carry and I rarely use it. I prefer two 2x10 cabinets vertically stacked when I need this kind of solution...
http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/WS8540/
I own one and have used it on occassion. If your amp is only supplying you with the ability to hear yourself I think this is a great option it gets the speaker up to your ear and can provide better listening at lower volumes. Especially the case if you are usually within 6 feet of your amp on a small stage.
The down side is you tend to hear the upper and lower range of your bass differently and EQing it to what sounds good to you may not be what will be optimal to project into the audience. You also loose some coupling effect and low end, which may be good or bad.
If you like to create a pillow under the band, like lots of low end or are carrying the entire room with your amp this is not a great solution. Personally it became one more thing to carry and I rarely use it. I prefer two 2x10 cabinets vertically stacked when I need this kind of solution...
It does help you hear, and you wont turn up as loud. The problem for me is that since placing the amp on a stand removes the floor coupling, you don't get as thick of a sound. It just changes the way the cab sounds a bit. Try it and see what you think. I do it sometimes with my epifani 210, but I wouldn't with my other cab because it doesn't sound as good in the high end.
As a sound man, having the cab at a volume that doesn't put more bass in the house than I want, given the feel and volume of the mix I'm shooting for, is the best. Thinking in that direction as a bass player, when I'm on stage setting my volume, many times I'll turn my amp all the way down and let the sound guy get my volume set. Then I'll try to add only what I need for my particular taste in feel and sound. I've found that a lot of times the house gives me the big bottom end, and I just have to turn up enough to give some lower mids to highs to supplement that. That way, the sound guy and I are happy.
In a situation like that, a stand for your cab would be excellent, because it's reducing some of the low end put out by your cab, and thus helping keep the stage mix cleaner. Tonight at a regular gig we're doing a more acoustic set, and I'm using a stand for my cab.
It sounds and feels great. I recommend you try it and see what you think.
As a sound man, having the cab at a volume that doesn't put more bass in the house than I want, given the feel and volume of the mix I'm shooting for, is the best. Thinking in that direction as a bass player, when I'm on stage setting my volume, many times I'll turn my amp all the way down and let the sound guy get my volume set. Then I'll try to add only what I need for my particular taste in feel and sound. I've found that a lot of times the house gives me the big bottom end, and I just have to turn up enough to give some lower mids to highs to supplement that. That way, the sound guy and I are happy.
In a situation like that, a stand for your cab would be excellent, because it's reducing some of the low end put out by your cab, and thus helping keep the stage mix cleaner. Tonight at a regular gig we're doing a more acoustic set, and I'm using a stand for my cab.
It sounds and feels great. I recommend you try it and see what you think.Can I sneak a new question in here? Ya or nay to amps (combo) on wheels. Will this negate the floor coupling aswell?
Oddly enough, that was going to be my follow-up question. Good call KimblesNimble. I feel like that would sort of be middle ground between no-casters and using an amp stand. I guess the ideal way to better hear what you play (regardless of monitors) while having that floor coupling effect would be to use a tilt-back amp.
This. As compared to the opposite approach which is, I'm gonna turn my 1,000 watt bass rig up really loud and EQ it to how it sounds good to ME and the sound man is just gonna have to deal with it in the house. We set our own sound from the stage and believe me, fretman's approach yields a MUCH BETTER result in the house. And is much kinder to your ears as well.
And yes, get that cabinet up off the floor if you're running bass thru the mains. Especially if it's just a 4x10... those things are useless sitting on the ground but make a great monitor for mids and highs when elevated at least a foot.
I was a guitar tech at the Grand Ole Opry for a guy that I'm in a couple bands with a few weeks back. IIRC correctly, every amp on that stage was either on casters or in an amp stand.
Here's a photo I took during the performance of my friend playing, with his amp tilted back in the monitor position:
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I was looking through my pictures to see if the bass amp was the same, and it appears that the bass cabinet was sitting on a flat, dolly with casters.
Here's a photo I took during the performance of my friend playing, with his amp tilted back in the monitor position:
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I was looking through my pictures to see if the bass amp was the same, and it appears that the bass cabinet was sitting on a flat, dolly with casters.
IIRC from what I've seen on TV, the house amp for the Opry is an SVT with 810 cabinet but I've never been able to see if it's on casters or sits on the stage. I'm assuming it rolls.
Here's another view, before the show:
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The bass amp this night had a 4 10" cabinet, you can see it tilted back, mic'd in this photo, just this side of the steel guitar.
There's a 1-15" cabinet on the far side, tucked behind that rack that still in a rolling flight case bottom.
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The bass amp this night had a 4 10" cabinet, you can see it tilted back, mic'd in this photo, just this side of the steel guitar.
There's a 1-15" cabinet on the far side, tucked behind that rack that still in a rolling flight case bottom.
IF you have PA support an amp stand would be a great idea.
However, you will lose floor coupling. I've recently bought the markbass wedge and find that even at 8" off the ground it effects the tone in a negative way. I'm going to try going a little lower at 4" and see how that does.
However, you will lose floor coupling. I've recently bought the markbass wedge and find that even at 8" off the ground it effects the tone in a negative way. I'm going to try going a little lower at 4" and see how that does.
Hi.
I have used a stand with my WM10, in order to better hear myself.
EVERY guitar player with a combo should be forced to use either a stand or tilt-back legs on their amps, everyone would be much, much happier
.
Thanks TL5 for great pics.
Regards
Sam
I have used a stand with my WM10, in order to better hear myself.
EVERY guitar player with a combo should be forced to use either a stand or tilt-back legs on their amps, everyone would be much, much happier
.Thanks TL5 for great pics.
Regards
Sam
That's the idea. In many of the indoor venues I've played at, floor coupling of the bass cabinet is the major cause of stage "boom" and a huge obstacle to getting a clean FOH mix. If you're playing outdoors it's a whole nother story and there you want as much floor coupling as you can get cause the low end absolutely disappears on outdoor stages.
BTW TL5, thanks for posting the awesome pics... since that's as close as I'll ever be to being backstage at the Opry.
Huge fan of kickback-type combos for this reason. The newer high-power kickbacks (like my Carvin BR515N) are really nice since you have so much power you can add a bunch of low end and still have the cab aimed at you. I angle my cab across the stage and everyone can hear me (I can really hear myself) without killing stage volume. I have even used it without PA support and after a few feet out, it sounds great in the audience.
One thing to mention, when you set you sound for a config that "blows under you", you will be amazed how different it can be when it is in your face.
One thing to mention, when you set you sound for a config that "blows under you", you will be amazed how different it can be when it is in your face.
Yeah, a lot of the indoor stages I've played are basically big plywood boxes and the low-end on those things can really get out of hand in a hurry.
I was going to use the Opry as an example. I have also seen many show on Palladia where amp stands are used - more so for guitars as there are still many bass players that need to use their 4 or 8x10 cabs.
On the other hand, I also see DI bass with no stage amp and a wedge or IEM.
On the other hand, I also see DI bass with no stage amp and a wedge or IEM.
I always tilt my amp whenever I can because:
a. It's only little (30W Laney RB2), and
b. It just provides me with stage clarity so I can hear what I'm playing (I also have it pointing away from the crowd towards me like a dedicated bass monitor).
When I've played venues where the stage amp is contributing to the FOH sound, it still helps to tilt the cab or raise it a bit (or find another way to get the sound hitting your head more than your shins!). I really like Tal's setup - her cabs reach to her head height anyway so no need to tilt
a. It's only little (30W Laney RB2), and
b. It just provides me with stage clarity so I can hear what I'm playing (I also have it pointing away from the crowd towards me like a dedicated bass monitor).
When I've played venues where the stage amp is contributing to the FOH sound, it still helps to tilt the cab or raise it a bit (or find another way to get the sound hitting your head more than your shins!). I really like Tal's setup - her cabs reach to her head height anyway so no need to tilt
if you "lose" floor coupling from putting it a few inches off the floor or tilting it back, you're not losing it...you're gaining high end and mids which makes the low end seem smaller by comparison. you have to elevate your cabs about 28 inches to lose floor coupling.
