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Ampeg SVT Classic Tube Questions

BassBeginer64

Supporting Member
Aug 6, 2018
1,680
2,758
Riverside Ca
Just purchased a 2006 Ampeg SVT Classic, and was wondering what are you running for tubes?, I am staying with the sovtek 6550's that are in it.
but I would still like to hear what you are running in yours.
As for the 12AX7's what make? what gain levels on the triodes in the 90's high 90's 100 plus?
iI have started using the JJ gold pin, they seem very quite on noise close to -82 decibel's , and are in the mid 90's on gain.
I usually just us standard JJ's for the 12AU7's being in the -83 plus decibels no microphonics and usually matching triodes , pretty much a tuff lil tube for 20 buck.
 
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If the output tubes bias correctly (following the procedure in the owner's manual) and there aren't any obvious preamp problems, rock on! Small-signal tubes like 12AX7 and 12AU7 can last a long time. There's no harm in having known good spares (one of each type).

I have a CL, it came to me with some rather well-used Sovtek 6550s that had obvious bias issues, I ended up with JJ KT88s. I sorta wish I had need for that much brute power so I'd have an excuse to take it out more often!
 
Have new sensor tung sols in my SVT, they replaced a well worn set of winged Cs which had been very reliable in that amp but were starting to wear and were no longer very well matched. I tried a set of JJ in between, but one failed out of the box and they were the last set of JJ 6550s I bought (the vendor blamed my amp and wouldn’t warranty them so also the last tubes I bought from that vendor).

I’m not too picky on the small signal tubes, I usually go for the tung sol or mullard branded tubes from new sensor out of habit, but between all my amps I have preamp tubes from basically every manufacturer and “brand” out there. I use whatever works and isn’t noisy.
 
If the output tubes bias correctly (following the procedure in the owner's manual) and there aren't any obvious preamp problems, rock on! Small-signal tubes like 12AX7 and 12AU7 can last a long time. There's no harm in having known good spares (one of each type).

I have a CL, it came to me with some rather well-used Sovtek 6550s that had obvious bias issues, I ended up with JJ KT88s. I sorta wish I had need for that much brute power so I'd have an excuse to take it out more often!
Same for me, problematic sextet of Sovtek’s replaced with JJ KT88’s.
 
I used to have a Heritage CL, did a little tube experimenting, and stayed with the stock JJ’s. The only time I noticed a difference was when I switched V1 in the preamp, and changing others made no difference to my ears. If I used one of my NOS tubes or a new Tung Sol I bought for comparison, it got brighter, and I didn’t like it as much so I stayed with the JJs.

I’ve played plenty of rental SVTs loaded with Sovteks, and they sounded great to me. Like the phrase my late dad came up with, if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it.
 
Far more important that the 6 power tubes are adequately matched and properly biased. Same with the 12AU7 drivers,( 12BH7s in the old amps). Unless you're slamming your amp into heavy growl (as we old farts did in the 70s) what's in the sockets really won't affect the overall sound. In the 2 SVT heads I owned back then, the preamp section used a 6C4 which always became microphonic. The original American made 6550 TungSols were just as good when I sold the head after 10 yrs as they were when I bought it. The other head used 6146Bs,, which until applying the corrective mod blew out repeatedly, I was getting Motorola branded tubes from a friend who maintained police radios, after the mod the tubes lasted. Current day personal opinion: Tubes made today are all COW SHHT! KT88s seem to stink the least. Different preamp tubes may sound different because most are out of spec - a 12AX7/7025/ECC83 (all the same tube) is spec'd at 100; in the heyday of tubes a tube out of spec went in the factory scrap.
 
Yeah, I'll be checking the 6550 tubes out on my maxi matcher, same with my preamp tubes, and agreed @Short4since64 the tubes made these days are cow pies, I will buy 5 and return 3 most of time , and don't get me going on paying extra to get checked for microphonics or matched triodes on gain ratings, that's a whole other rant ..........I really feel bad that you seriously cannot believe the ratings on buying tubes without having or knowing someone with tube test equipment to verify.
I say this due to from purchasing from many resellers and they each use there own test equipment and each sellers read differently, I log my power tubes in each head from vender with there listed IP and my tested IP
 
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Far more important that the 6 power tubes are adequately matched and properly biased. Same with the 12AU7 drivers,( 12BH7s in the old amps). Unless you're slamming your amp into heavy growl (as we old farts did in the 70s) what's in the sockets really won't affect the overall sound. In the 2 SVT heads I owned back then, the preamp section used a 6C4 which always became microphonic. The original American made 6550 TungSols were just as good when I sold the head after 10 yrs as they were when I bought it. The other head used 6146Bs,, which until applying the corrective mod blew out repeatedly, I was getting Motorola branded tubes from a friend who maintained police radios, after the mod the tubes lasted. Current day personal opinion: Tubes made today are all COW SHHT! KT88s seem to stink the least. Different preamp tubes may sound different because most are out of spec - a 12AX7/7025/ECC83 (all the same tube) is spec'd at 100; in the heyday of tubes a tube out of spec went in the factory scrap.
Guy said that bought SVT-Classic. You're writing about old SVT. Not much in common other than "300W tube power".

Anyway, I find Sovteks best current prod. sounding tubes for SVT-CL. Had JJs, had tung-sols, had EH. They are all ok, but Sovtek had something that just sit right. more ooomph and tube sound, whetever you call it.
 
First of all, let me say that tone will always be subjective, especially when discussing the rather subtle differences you get with different tubes. If you're happy with the tone you get with your current tubes, that's what you should stick with.

Now for MY opinion on JJs:

JJ have several different types of 12AX7. You didn't specify which ones you're using.

The most commonly seen type is the JJ ECC83S so I'll assume these are the ones you're using.

The JJ ECC83S is in my opinion a rather muddy sounding tube with poor low/high frequency extension. I also find that they test weaker than most other 12AX7s when new and often go fast downhill from there. The only good use I've personally ever found for this tube is to soften the tone of overly bright guitar amps.

For my taste, pretty much any other 12AX7/ECC83 will be better. At least tonally.

There's also microphonics and ruggedness to consider of course, and in this respect the JJ ECC83S is at least better than average (for current production tubes anyway). This makes it a relatively safe choice for gigging/touring.

In contrast, JJ's long plate 12AX7 (the ECC803S) is tonally FAR superior in my opinion, but also far more prone to microphonics. This makes it a poor choice for giggin/touring.

Also, unless you buy JJs tested/matched by a re-brander and base any comparisons on whatever arbitrary scale they use, it doesn't really make sense to make any assumptions about gain or noise levels. They can be all over the place in my experience, not very consistent. The quality control (that in the golden age of tube manufacturing used to happen at the factory) is now left to the re-brander or the end-user. Tube factories today ship out tubes that are WAY out of spec. Of course, Aspen Pittman (Groove Tubes) is to blame for this, after he somehow managed to convince guitar players that selling out-of-spec tubes was a feature rather than just a way to get rid of tubes that in the past wouldn't have passed QC. Then everyone else soon realized that they could also get rid of all those out-of-spec tubes in the back, by selling them as lower/higher graded tubes.

Anyway...

If your amp is mainly for gigs/touring, I would just stick with whatever you've got. Those are cheap tubes that can be easily replaced if they break from transport or heavy use. We are after all talking about relatively minor tonal differences. At least in the context of a live gig.

If the amp is mainly for recording.... Well, that's where I would seriously consider some decent NOS preamp/driver tubes, to bring out those last 10% of tonal bliss from that amp (NOS output tubes are sadly not a realistic option at this point).

NOS 12AU7s are still readily available at reasonable prices. That's a no-brainer really.

NOS 12AX7s are a different matter. They have become outrageously expensive, but there are still SOME bargains to be found.

Early 60s GE 12AX7 long/grey plates are superb in bass amps and can still be found at more reasonable (or at least less insane) prices than other NOS tubes, because they're not popular among guitarists and the hifi-crowd. The reason for this is the slightly rolled off highs you get with the early 60s GE longplate, but this won't matter at all in a bass amp.

If you wanna go nuts with NOS there's nothing I've found that beats a late 50s Mullard long plate ECC83 in bass amps. These are GLORIOUS sounding tubes in bass amps (and any other amps for that matter). But I honestly wouldn't bother at the prices these late 50s Mullards sell for these days. You could buy an entire amp for the same price...

And of course, most of the 12AX7s that are sold as NOS today aren't really NOS, but used tubes, and in many cases very worn or even faulty. Buyer beware! 12AU7s are much safer to buy NOS. They're usually still actual NOS tubes in original packaging.
 
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Guy said that bought SVT-Classic. You're writing about old SVT. Not much in common other than "300W tube power".

Anyway, I find Sovteks best current prod. sounding tubes for SVT-CL. Had JJs, had tung-sols, had EH. They are all ok, but Sovtek had something that just sit right. more ooomph and tube sound, whetever you call it.
Agreed that the CL is a cheap knockoff of the glorious 69-70s amps, but other than exchanging plentiful 12AU7s for unavailable 12BH7s for the drivers, the power sections are essentially the same. The preamp is a different animal altogether.
 
If the Sovteks are biasing properly, I would run them till the start having problems. AFAIK Sovtek 6550s actually have a fairly decent reputation for reliability.

I believe JJs are the best choice for replacements, but they are not perfect. Also, my perception is Eurotubes may have the best quality JJs of the big US tube vendors. But I have heard many bad stories about them refusing to honor warranty claims. Quite a few TB members refuse to do business with the company.

My perception is the New Sensor brands can sound really good, but consistency and reliability is lower than JJ. Lot's of comments about problems with amps that run the tubes at high voltage, like the SVT. In particular I have had an extremely high failure rate with EHX.

Shuguang was previously my #2 choice. They stopped making tubes around 2012 and reports suggest they have recently started again. No idea if the new production is as good as the old.

I don't worry as much about the reliability of small signal tubes because they don't typically need to be matched. I personally dislike the JJ ECC83S, but you might love it in your SVT CL. Some say it makes the CL sound more like a vintage SVT.
 
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If the Sovteks are biasing properly, I would run them till the start having problems. AFAIK Sovtek 6550s actually have a fairly decent reputation for reliability.

I believe JJs are the best choice for replacements, but they are not perfect. Also, my perception is Eurotubes may have the best quality JJs of the big US tube vendors. But I have heard many bad stories about them refusing to honor warranty claims. Quite a few TB members refuse to do business with the company.

My perception is the New Sensor brands can sound really good, but consistency and reliability is lower than JJ. Lot's of comments about problems with amps that run the tubes at high voltage, like the SVT. In particular I have had an extremely high failure rate with EHX.

Shuguang was previously my #2 choice. They stopped making tubes around 2012 and reports suggest they have recently started again. No idea if the new production is as good as the old.

I don't worry as much about the reliability of small signal tubes because they don't typically need to be matched. I personally dislike the JJ ECC83S, but you might love it in your SVT CL. Some say it makes the CL sound more like a vintage SVT.

Shuguang is back online but I haven’t seen their 6550 in many places, Ruby has it but it’s a few dollar more expensive than the KT88. The Shuguang KT88-98 is readily available and the Ruby KT88STR version is as well. These have been the most reliable KT88s for me. I know Andy has mentioned Mesa had a hell of a time getting reliable KT88s from anyone for their amps, but that may also be a factor of the conditions in their amps. Some of the new sensor brands have been really hit or miss for me as well, especially at ampeg/hiwatt/etc voltages.
 
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Agreed that the CL is a cheap knockoff of the glorious 69-70s amps, but other than exchanging plentiful 12AU7s for unavailable 12BH7s for the drivers, the power sections are essentially the same. The preamp is a different animal altogether.

CL is not "cheap knock-off" - it's just different design and more polished sound than the raw old SVT. It stood the test of time and is no.1 backline bass amp all over the world for 30 years. That means something. I still have one. I have few old SVTs, but played last show with CL and was really happy with the sound. Anyway, 12AU7s are not worse than 12BH7. Different. The Heritage version sounds excellent
 
If it helps. When I bought my studio only 2013 SVT-CL, the UPS store improperly packaged and the ride destroyed the crap out of it. Broken power board solder joints, a horribly microphonic V1, broken screws, ripped shield tape, among other issues.

I did all the repair work, and whadayaknow, those Sovtek 6550s are some tough buggers. Still going!

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