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Ampeg Vietnamese Cabs - Run away!

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#22
JakePonderosa said:
I don't know if anyone else can testify to this, but I own a MIA SVT-410 HLF (circa 2000-ish) that's missing enough tolex now to know that it is most definitely built from some sort of wafer/fiber board. Upon discovering this, I took out a speaker to find an assortment of lumber inside. The baffle is built from quality plywood. However, from what I remember, all the internal bracing looks like MDF or something similar. A buddy of mine has the same cabinet (produced a year or to later), and we found the same results. Anyways, I've been doubting the QC and material choice of Ampeg for a while now.

With that said, after almost 8 years, it works fine and still sounds great. I just definitely thought I bought a plywood cabinet (thats what I was told and read), not something I would feel like I'd have to take unnecessary measures to protect... It's hard trying to baby a 110 lb. cabinet out of that back of an SUV by yourself...
Click to expand...

Well. again maybe I just WANT to love Ampeg-
I bought my SVT-48HE about 5 years ago- it's literally been around the country, and then the world with me, prety close to it anyway.
First thing I did was buy an excellent Tuki cover, then a flight case when I went took it overseas. Barely has a scratch on it.
I'm always careful when transporting my stuff, and try to keep things under control when it's on a stage.
(And it's been in Clubs ranging from first-cabin to...
DUCK! Here comes another beer bottle!:D)

My SVT-15E is about a year old, still SLM, but a later build than the 4x8- (speakon jack, etc.)
Seems solid to me. The website claims they're made of baltic Birch IIRC, maybe that's changed, they haven't updated the site.
I would wager that like most companies Ampeg/LOUD uses Eminence-designed & built drivers, of course I may be mistaken. But I'd be interested in knowing if in fact, there has been a spec change.
Same with the cabinets themselves. Only an "insider" could say whether or not LOUD has started using different woods, or has gone to MDF or OSB or whatever. Maybe Mr. Tiers has some knowledge.
I'm not about to take off the tolex on my cabinets, and btw, the tolex seems to be as well-applied and as durable a grade as any other tolex-covered cab.

I think that with reasonable care, the Ampeg cabs will be as durable as needed. certainly able to hold up.
My main criteria would be their sound, and I'm really not certain that the new builds from Overseas haven't made the grade in that respect.

Like I said- here's hoping that Ampeg makes it all work- for them and us.
 
#23
IMO Ampeg QC went to the ****** a long time before Loud took over. The heads have always been at least somewhat solidly built, but the cabs have been made out of the MDF/particle board or whatever it is for a while I think. If QC is getting worse, then its sad to see such a great company fall into the profit game as opposed to customer service.
 
#24
I might be wrong but it seems that alot of their endorsing artists have pulled out. I don't know if this is just because of increasing competition in the bass amp industry as a whole (ie more choices). Has anyone else noticed this trend?

My SVT4 and cab are MIA. I'm not too concerned about it since they never move (they stay at church). My only complaint is I think the head is awfully quiet for a supposed 1,000+ watt head. I think my GK 1001 RB is actually louder given the same room size and all other factors considered.
 
#28
There was a change to baltic birch type ply a bit before the factory closing.

However, the baltic birch is THINNER than the old OSB. So it might look less strong. Not so.......

I fully supported the move to the thinner baltic birch........ I had been pressing for it before that.

OSB is fine, it is really pretty strong stuff. In fact, Electro-Voice was using it in THEIR cabinets years ago, back while SLM was using all-plywood construction as a selling point against EV.

The PROBLEM with OSB is that it does not take IMPACT as well as plywood in general, and baltic birch in particular, and RUSSIAN plywood in extra-special particular.


I demonstrated this to people at SLM..... A common hammer, and a foot square piece of wood.

Hitting it pretty hard punched a hole clear through 18mm OSB.

Hitting it quite hard dented standard 3/4" (18mm) plywood.

Hitting it very hard dented 18mm baltic birch (Finply). 15mm Finply started to show a little on the back side sometimes.

Hitting it as hard as I could stand to hit BARELY MADE A MARK on 15mm RUSSIAN birch plywood.

Back while SLM made the Audio Centron PA stuff, we pull-tested cabinets that were for hanging up. We pull tested CE-34F cabinets made of Finply and also Russian plywood.

The Finply broke and allowed the bolts to tear out at 7000lb, about 1.5 metric tons equivalent weight on one support point.

The 15mm Russian plywood was barely dented when the testing machine broke at almost 11,000 lb , about 2.5 metric tons equivalent weight. We don't know where the actual breaking point was.

Why do I mention this?

Because the Vietnam cabinets as I understood it, were SUPPOSED to be made with Russian plywood, not the Finply. Probably they were, but maybe that changed. There is some asian plywood that is kinda funky.

'Nuff said.
 
#32
1st off, as always thanks to Mr. Tiers for providing info and insight into what was/is happening at Ampeg. Really great to hear about developments at what to me is one of the great mfrs. of gear for bass guitar.

As far as dealerships go, I guess I find it kind of sad that some players SUPPORT their local not carrying Ampeg any more...
There sure isn't going to be a shortage of Ampeg dealers as far as I can see. GC carries them, every major on-line retailer does too, so it won't be too difficult to find product if you want it.

I haven't noticed any great exodus of endorsers, either, leastwise not from the website. Bootsy, George Porter, and many other "superstar" users still seem to be on the roster.

I absolutely respect the Moderator's position on staying away from the offshore issue. It just opens up too many cans of worms-politics, economics, and personality- a bit much for a forum on bass amplification!

The fact is that Loud now owns Ampeg, and moved production. Sad to me that makes some players anti-Ampeg.
If it "walks" like an Ampeg and "talks" like an Ampeg, hopefully it'll still be an Ampeg, at least sonically.

Without going for drama, every bassist owes something to Ampeg, it was an absolutely instrumental company in the development of the bass guitar and the modern rhythm section, from the B-15 to the SVT, to the many other trend-setting amps and cabs.

I'd at least hope that as bass players, somehow, we'd hope for the brand to endure, and remain on the market.
If LOUD didn't take over from SLM, that might not be the case, so....
I say as long as they keep on making them, and as long as they still sound like Ampegs...
I'm OK with that.
 
#33
I went to my local dealer a little while ago, and the manager mentioned that they were slowly pulling away from being an Ampeg dealer. The only cabs they had in stock were US built ones that they have had for awhile. The only Asian made stuff were a few 115 and 112 combos.

Oh well, I guess it doesn't bother me. I just picked up a NOS US made SVT610HLF tonight---bought it from a guy who has a PA/backline rental company. He had bought two of em, and this one hadn't been taken out of the box yet. SO, I got a brand new US made 610, with padded Ampeg cover, for $650. Not too bad of a deal.:smug:
 
#34
To a few of you, my sig line (or any other mods sig) has nothing to do with how we moderate. It is a personal statement of our own. We have to bite our tongues at times on hot topics that we personally would like to discuss but can't. Why? Because, just like everyone else, we also have to follow the rules of Talkbass.

Also, to be blunt and to the point, this is NOT a US government run forum. It is privately owned and therefore the 1st Amendment doesn't apply here. In other words, you don't have the right to just say whatever you feel like regardless of the rules. You agreed to the Terms of Service when joining Talkbass and part of that is following the rules. Period.

Finally, Psycho Bass Guy has been kind enough to provide a link to a forum where you can discuss this topic in a different way. I suggest making use of it if you really feel you are being "oppressed" as the rules here will not change on this anytime soon.
 
#35
Back on topic here...

To me this is no different than the topic of the MIJ Fenders or anthing else in popular discussion now days in regards to the almighty "Made in America". .

To me if it's made in Vietnam to the exact specc's as the US made stuff I'm going to play it and many others will as well. I bought my Ampeg monster stack after falling in love with the sound and durability. It happens to be made in the US, I guess before LOUD outsourced, but my point is that I would gladly pay that money again if it were Vietnamese made. There are bound to be products that get past quality control anywhere and everywhere in the world.

Answer me this. If it sounds great, looks great, and performs great (durable) then what does it matter what countries workers produce it especially if you've got one of the company's marketing director's email address posted in this very thread?
 
#37
Nicka said:
Answer me this. If it sounds great, looks great, and performs great (durable) then what does it matter what countries workers produce it especially if you've got one of the company's marketing director's email address posted in this very thread?
Click to expand...

Trouble is, there have been increasingly numerous reports of amp failures since Loud bought Ampeg. Loud does not provide warranty service or parts for repair. There are several reports of lower quality factory parts being substituted to the detriment of tone and durability. Also, if you think being able to contact someone in the ad department makes up for cheaping-out production and making shoddy products that are virtually unserviceable, you need to try getting your car fixed by the guy who wrote the ads to sell it to you the next time it breaks down.
 
#38
Psycho Bass Guy said:
Trouble is, there have been increasingly numerous reports of amp failures since Loud bought Ampeg. Loud does not provide warranty service or parts for repair. There are several reports of lower quality factory parts being substituted to the detriment of tone and durability. Also, if you think being able to contact someone in the ad department makes up for cheaping-out production and making shoddy products that are virtually unserviceable, you need to try getting your car fixed by the guy who wrote the ads to sell it to you the next time it breaks down.
Click to expand...

YEAH this makes me glad I've got USA made Ampegs, Tho ONE is still under -??WARRANTY????:rolleyes: I think if anything DID go wrong with it I'd take it to my tech anyways. Hang on.... He works for the shop I got the V4BH from-on commision with tube gear- So...... hopefully IF..anything DID go wrong.... I could get it done by him anyway-thru warranty?!?!?!?!?! We'll see I s'pose-or hopefully NOT! :rollno:Hopefully NOTHING will go wrong with the V4BH.
 
#39
It seems to me that Ampeg SVT CL's have the same price point now (~$1500.00 USD) that they had when they were made in the USA. None of the prices have been lowered as far as I can tell. At least not significantly. Any advantage for moving manufacturing is soley for the benefit of Loud and not the consumer.
 
#40
The biggest problem as I as an outsider see it, is that there is not enough openness about the move to Vietnam, the moving back amps to China, the components in the products and the woods being used and os on. Ampeg is not working to improve the trust, and the customer loyalty. Bad business, imo.
 
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