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Ampeg vs. Ampeg,what do you guys think?
- Thread starter Bigduke
- Start date
I know this is probably a stupid question, but did you try it with the Ultra-Lo in the 'off' position and dialing in bottom end to taste with the bass EQ knob? I ask this because I do backline provided gigs all the time and hear other players complaining that the CL/810 is muddy and it never seems to occur to them to turn the Ultra-Lo off. The Ultra-Lo is really a low mid cut and I think it really makes the all tube SVTs sound a bit muddy/dubby. Just a thought.
AndyMan
Commercial User
I have a '72 SVT and a 1999 SVT Classic AV head w/ KT88s. I use the Classic 810.
OK HERE is a secret, I'm not sure I should divulge:
You need to use an effect or preamp between your bass and the amp. I.e., Scholtz Bass Rockman, etc. something that adds warmth.
I'm currently using a Line 6 Bass Pod XT Live, using the SVT setting, called "Classic Rock." I edit the settings according to the room. I bypass the preamp on the Classic (which is way too dirty and toneless IMHO) and go straight into the power tubes. You can cop ANY Ampeg sound recorded or live you've ever heard with the Line 6. Line 6 makes GREAT stuff, but you need to be patient and tweak things. You can also get the tone you want at any volume this way.
Massive rich bass tone to die for. The first time I gigged this setup, I pooped my pants!!!
Try an effect/pre between your bass and the Classic head--something that adds warmth.
OK HERE is a secret, I'm not sure I should divulge:
You need to use an effect or preamp between your bass and the amp. I.e., Scholtz Bass Rockman, etc. something that adds warmth.
I'm currently using a Line 6 Bass Pod XT Live, using the SVT setting, called "Classic Rock." I edit the settings according to the room. I bypass the preamp on the Classic (which is way too dirty and toneless IMHO) and go straight into the power tubes. You can cop ANY Ampeg sound recorded or live you've ever heard with the Line 6. Line 6 makes GREAT stuff, but you need to be patient and tweak things. You can also get the tone you want at any volume this way.
Massive rich bass tone to die for. The first time I gigged this setup, I pooped my pants!!!
Try an effect/pre between your bass and the Classic head--something that adds warmth.
Always amazes me:
"Dear TalkBass":
I need your help! My rig sounds muddy and unsatisfactory; Do you think it's having an affair? What should I do?"
OK, just kidding-
Dude- One of my rigs is a 3-PRO with an SVT-48HE (4x8 w/horn, no longer made; the equivalent of their 410HE w/ 8"s) and a SVT-15H.
To my ears, and my fellow players, and lots of listeners where I've per formed- This Ampeg rig is the bomb!
Yet we hear- "They don't work, they need an effect in the signal chain," yada yada.
OK Cool.
But wrong. 'Cause for how and what I play, it's perfect. For what I play, how I play, what I do, and my instrument, my approach, and so on.
In addition- I've played numerous gigs- Usually outdoor, larger settings, where the classic SVT/ 810 "Fridge" is provided as backline-
And it ALWAYS sounds great, and it always produces, and the Soundman always nails it, and- That's why this combo is used on MANY many stages throughout the World! Ampeg doesn't "provide" them- they're chosen; for a reason.
Trying out and judging gear at Guitar Center is inefficient at best.
True, there's not that many alternatives for most players, but you won't hear a rigs true colors until it's set in the mix, with your gear, in a playing and/or recording situation.
So I dunno- If the SVT set up isn't your cup of tea, try something else!
Jeez, ther's so many alternatives in that category and others-
There's such a vast amount of great gear out there, you gotta do what some fanatics do- buy it ALL!!!!
Just kidding-
I have 3 rigs I use for rehearsal, recording, local gigs, and touring.
Each one does it's thing.
No one here, myself included, can really help you choose your sound- Even if they took you by the hand to a private listening room, YOU need to figure out what floats your tone. Good luck with that, Bro!
Oh- and I wouldn't put a whole lot of stock into what they tell you at GC-
Some know their stuff, including some friends of mine there, others...
same rules apply.
Cut the cord and figure it out, my Man! It's fun---
(This is meant to be supportive, btw!)
Note smiley!
The 'Deal
"Dear TalkBass":
I need your help! My rig sounds muddy and unsatisfactory; Do you think it's having an affair? What should I do?"
OK, just kidding-
Dude- One of my rigs is a 3-PRO with an SVT-48HE (4x8 w/horn, no longer made; the equivalent of their 410HE w/ 8"s) and a SVT-15H.
To my ears, and my fellow players, and lots of listeners where I've per formed- This Ampeg rig is the bomb!
Yet we hear- "They don't work, they need an effect in the signal chain," yada yada.
OK Cool.
But wrong. 'Cause for how and what I play, it's perfect. For what I play, how I play, what I do, and my instrument, my approach, and so on.
In addition- I've played numerous gigs- Usually outdoor, larger settings, where the classic SVT/ 810 "Fridge" is provided as backline-
And it ALWAYS sounds great, and it always produces, and the Soundman always nails it, and- That's why this combo is used on MANY many stages throughout the World! Ampeg doesn't "provide" them- they're chosen; for a reason.
Trying out and judging gear at Guitar Center is inefficient at best.
True, there's not that many alternatives for most players, but you won't hear a rigs true colors until it's set in the mix, with your gear, in a playing and/or recording situation.
So I dunno- If the SVT set up isn't your cup of tea, try something else!
Jeez, ther's so many alternatives in that category and others-
There's such a vast amount of great gear out there, you gotta do what some fanatics do- buy it ALL!!!!
Just kidding-
I have 3 rigs I use for rehearsal, recording, local gigs, and touring.
Each one does it's thing.
No one here, myself included, can really help you choose your sound- Even if they took you by the hand to a private listening room, YOU need to figure out what floats your tone. Good luck with that, Bro!
Oh- and I wouldn't put a whole lot of stock into what they tell you at GC-
Some know their stuff, including some friends of mine there, others...
same rules apply.
Cut the cord and figure it out, my Man! It's fun---
(This is meant to be supportive, btw!)
Note smiley!The 'Deal
Yes,I tried with the switch on and off.Are people using this set up with metal? I had it set up where it was tighter but the low end was missing.In fact everyone in the band noticed that my lows weren't there like they were before.
Always amazes me:
"Dear TalkBass":
I need your help! My rig sounds muddy and unsatisfactory; Do you think it's having an affair? What should I do?"
OK, just kidding-
Dude- One of my rigs is a 3-PRO with an SVT-48HE (4x8 w/horn, no longer made; the equivalent of their 410HE w/ 8"s) and a SVT-15H.
To my ears, and my fellow players, and lots of listeners where I've per formed- This Ampeg rig is the bomb!
Yet we hear- "They don't work, they need an effect in the signal chain," yada yada.
OK Cool.
But wrong. 'Cause for how and what I play, it's perfect. For what I play, how I play, what I do, and my instrument, my approach, and so on.
In addition- I've played numerous gigs- Usually outdoor, larger settings, where the classic SVT/ 810 "Fridge" is provided as backline-
And it ALWAYS sounds great, and it always produces, and the Soundman always nails it, and- That's why this combo is used on MANY many stages throughout the World! Ampeg doesn't "provide" them- they're chosen; for a reason.
Trying out and judging gear at Guitar Center is inefficient at best.
True, there's not that many alternatives for most players, but you won't hear a rigs true colors until it's set in the mix, with your gear, in a playing and/or recording situation.
So I dunno- If the SVT set up isn't your cup of tea, try something else!
Jeez, ther's so many alternatives in that category and others-
There's such a vast amount of great gear out there, you gotta do what some fanatics do- buy it ALL!!!!
Just kidding-
I have 3 rigs I use for rehearsal, recording, local gigs, and touring.
Each one does it's thing.
No one here, myself included, can really help you choose your sound- Even if they took you by the hand to a private listening room, YOU need to figure out what floats your tone. Good luck with that, Bro!
Oh- and I wouldn't put a whole lot of stock into what they tell you at GC-
Some know their stuff, including some friends of mine there, others...
same rules apply.
Cut the cord and figure it out, my Man! It's fun---
(This is meant to be supportive, btw!)
The 'Deal
I was more or less trying to point myself in a better direction for the style of music i play,the 8x10 is punchy but i would like to try to get close to the tone i would like before getting into alot of pedals.I played guitar and had many pedals.I was just trying to avoid this with the bass.I am not a newbie and the guy that i deal with at GC is an excellent player and i respect his opinion.My real purpose for this post is to help others that might be looking into this set up to think before they pop $2,400.00. I think if i had to keep something it would be the cab.
Players often forget there are many variables to the end-result (including myself). I've played many boutique bass/pickup's thru crappy rigs which in-turn made the basses sound real bad. I think that combination alone is the first place to start (aka: the 'right combination' for YOU to YOUR ears).
(Other than the head voicing itself) one other thought is to try cutting the 220 mid freq.. Some bass pups have a bad low-mid response making it seemingly 'undetailed' (I find this true with some passive pups). In that case you'd be asking the amp to compensate for it, which may, but may not work for your situation.
Next could be cabinet selection. The ported v. sealed thing is a real issue to tone. You have to experiment with your bass and setup and venue acoustics and so on.
Personally, I think you'd be sorry for selling an all tube head like the Classic, unless you want to try another Ampeg product like the SVT II which will give you more tonal variations. Of course another possibility would be a separate preamp for tone shapping your pups, then a SS power amp for amplifying your sound. Remember that each rig set-up will have it's own inherent voice too.
I've always liked a bright sounding bass with a 'tube tone' giving me the best of both worlds.
Keep Rockin.
(Other than the head voicing itself) one other thought is to try cutting the 220 mid freq.. Some bass pups have a bad low-mid response making it seemingly 'undetailed' (I find this true with some passive pups). In that case you'd be asking the amp to compensate for it, which may, but may not work for your situation.
Next could be cabinet selection. The ported v. sealed thing is a real issue to tone. You have to experiment with your bass and setup and venue acoustics and so on.
Personally, I think you'd be sorry for selling an all tube head like the Classic, unless you want to try another Ampeg product like the SVT II which will give you more tonal variations. Of course another possibility would be a separate preamp for tone shapping your pups, then a SS power amp for amplifying your sound. Remember that each rig set-up will have it's own inherent voice too.
I've always liked a bright sounding bass with a 'tube tone' giving me the best of both worlds.
Keep Rockin.
AndyMan
Commercial User
The single best cab Ampeg makes in my most humble rock n metal opinion, is the SVT610HLF. The porting gives it far better and thicker low end than any of the 810's can, and gets quite loud with a SVT-CL on top of it.
Have you tried the 610HLF?
Have you tried the 610HLF?
Perhaps just try the 610 over the 810. I run a CL into the SVT-610, and it sounds waaay different than the fridge.
Dude I use an SVT4PRO head with the SVT810E cab and it rocks. I play in a metal band (along the lines of Unearth, Killswitch Engage, Gizmachi...etc) and it kills. The tone is there, the power is there, everything. I also use a Warwick Thumb B.O. 5 string, Warwick Corvette Standard 5 string, Lakland 44-01 and an Ibanez SR400 (both are going to be replaced by warwicks). I'd say try the 4PRO or maybe even the 2PRO.
I did,and the 6x10 gave a little more low end.Between the two i would take the 6x10.
Lots of great advice already, here's my opinions:
I don't think this amp and sealed 8x10 is ever going to produce
super-tight, clean, deep lows like a ported cab and a big S/S amp can.
Adjusting this amps knobs to try, is probably only going to produce mud.
I don't think many rock bassist play these rigs for their strong low-bass
response. They play them for the way they're strong low-mids sound/blend/feel
and cut through the dense mix, when played with loud distorted guitars.
I love tube amps and sealed cabs, but they're not the best choice for everyone.
Also:
Maybe your CL or cab has a slight (factory) defect of some sort.
Maybe the speaker cable you were sold is actually a short guitar cord.
I don't think this amp and sealed 8x10 is ever going to produce
super-tight, clean, deep lows like a ported cab and a big S/S amp can.
Adjusting this amps knobs to try, is probably only going to produce mud.
I don't think many rock bassist play these rigs for their strong low-bass
response. They play them for the way they're strong low-mids sound/blend/feel
and cut through the dense mix, when played with loud distorted guitars.
I love tube amps and sealed cabs, but they're not the best choice for everyone.
Also:
Maybe your CL or cab has a slight (factory) defect of some sort.
Maybe the speaker cable you were sold is actually a short guitar cord.
Reliability issues with GK? They're feeding you crap dude.
If you can, save up for the Mesa gear, it's a step up from Ampeg (IMO, a big step). Even if it's just a Mesa head, with Ampeg cabs.
On a budget I'd go with the GK RB-1001-II, it's alot less than the CL (from prices I've seen around), and it's made for 5 string basses. It has no problem at all with any of my basses low B (infact, it's better than my 400+ in that respect).
If you can, save up for the Mesa gear, it's a step up from Ampeg (IMO, a big step). Even if it's just a Mesa head, with Ampeg cabs.
On a budget I'd go with the GK RB-1001-II, it's alot less than the CL (from prices I've seen around), and it's made for 5 string basses. It has no problem at all with any of my basses low B (infact, it's better than my 400+ in that respect).
My 2 suggestions:
1. Try some different heads--you might as well test out the other (most would say superior) Ampeg tube options, a vintage SVT and the SVT-VR. Then try the higher-end GK stuff.
2. For more low-end response, seek out a 2X15 cab.
1. Try some different heads--you might as well test out the other (most would say superior) Ampeg tube options, a vintage SVT and the SVT-VR. Then try the higher-end GK stuff.
2. For more low-end response, seek out a 2X15 cab.
Actually, there was some some reliability issues with GK and many customers were coming back for returns with new amps that broke on them, I've witnessed it first hand.
