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Double Bass Ampless Etiquette

N

Nathan Parker

Oct 10, 2008
698
14
Seattle, WA
#1
I have a question for those of ya'll that regularly go with no amp.

As a preface, I have been amp-free for the last couple of months. I have tweaked my setup, technique and style to the point where I can play most local gigs without an amp. I have a K&K something or other that I can quickly put in should the need arise, but it really hasn't come up so far. That being said, there have been a few circumstances where it was necessary to go into the P.A.

So, that brings me to my question; Is it my responsibility to bring my own microphone and mic stand? The couple of times I've used the P.A., I've just used a vocal mic (Shure 57 or something) with a stand they have. No one else has to bring their own mics, as far as I can tell, but people seem to give me a bit of the ole stink eye when I tell 'em that I want to use the P.A. with the house microphones.

Should I just sack up and buy a mic and some kit to go with it, or should I continue to "stick it to tha man", as it were? Just wanted to get some other opinions.
 
#2
I think that in any locale, a general pattern emerges for who brings what. And it is seldom based on any lofty principles, but is simply what has evolved. In my locale, the bandleader (i.e., whoever has booked the gig) will typically bring a small PA if necessary for supporting a singer or horn players. It seems most of them expect that the bassist will bring an amp, so they don't really bother to think about supporting the bass. If I showed up and needed to be mic'd, a bandleader might be a bit annoyed just because it would be an unexpected thing that they haven't considered.

I would suggest owning a mic plus trimmings. This might include an XLR to 1/4" adaptor. Don't get anything that needs phantom power.
 
#3
It's not really a moral stance, I bought microphone that I thought sounded good with my bass so that I wasn't at the mercy of what was left in the bag at whatever venue I happen to be at. There's also less guesswork about futzing the sound the fewer variables in the equation. If I have the same bass, the same hands, the same mic then any difference in the sound is pretty much the room and the sound guy and that gives a pretty good direction to go in.
 
#4
What they said. Keep in mind that the bass is WAY down on the list as to who gets the best microphones as well. I have an EV RE20 that I carry around and a small telescoping mic stand with a gooseneck that has a relatively small footprint. It's a small set up which means it's easy to carry around and the mic sounds great on bass in a live setting. It's rare to find a mic of that caliber on a live gig and even if there were, the bass wouldn't be getting it.

Generally speaking, the more prepared you are, the greater the probability of a good result. You can't prepare for every contingency but having your own mic and stand will eliminate a lot of sound issues.

mark
 
#6
calivox said:
Generally speaking, the more prepared you are, the greater the probability of a good result. You can't prepare for every contingency but having your own mic and stand will eliminate a lot of sound issues.mark
Click to expand...

+1

If you are considering a mic as your means of being heard, I'd treat the situation the same as selecting a pickup for your instrument. You wouldn't expect every venue to have a bass pickup on hand.

Imagine if you were handed one of those old Polytone toothpick things that weighs half a pound and leaves indentations on your bridge.

Get a mic and stand. You'll be happy.:) Might as well bring an amp too.

Sometimes I think bandleaders with PA are as worried about changing the usual mix balance, and the distractions involved in accomidating something new. Adding the bass to the PA mix changes everything in the territory of the mix.
 
#7
There can be a minor issue to beware of, going into an unknown situation with a bass and a mic. The bass could overwhelm the power demands on the PA system if it is a small one like one of those Fender suitcase rigs. To make matters worse, many bandleaders are just a bit on the clueless side about what can and can't be done with a very small PA.
 
#8
I think that all depends upon the sound that is going to be used for FOH. I always bring my preamp and go directly into the PA, because we bring our own PA. If we are using someone else's PA, we ask in advance if we need to bring amps or if we can go direct into the PA. I don't own a good amp for a double bass, and don't plan on purchasing one.
 
#9
Thanks for the replies, fella's. Just to be clear, I'm referring to bigger venues. In smaller places, mainly places that seat less than 150 people, I can project a big enough sound to not need any support. I guess I need to go out and buy my ass some more gear. I'm sure my wife is gonna love that. Any ideas of how to sweet talk her into it, or perhaps a money laundering scheme where I can disguise my purchase?
 
#10
Bigger venues should have a mic. I went with out an amp for many, many years and I never had trouble in bigger venues. I am getting old with less to prove so I use an amp if feel like I might need it (with one of those Polytone toothpick things!).

In earlier years, I used to tell drummers they could play quieter or bring me an amp - I can't believe that actually worked, looking back!!
 
#12
Personally I always use an amp in larger venues. Most venues for that matter. Nothing like being inaudible to get a leader to not call you again... at least in Chicago. That said I do what Eric says. I try to never send a 'direct' signal to the house. Just mic. Amp on stage so I can hear myself better and hopefully play more in tune.

4125846991_39b5c89034_m.png
 
#13
fingers said:
Personally I always use an amp in larger venues. Most venues for that matter. Nothing like being inaudible to get a leader to not call you again... at least in Chicago. That said I do what Eric says. I try to never send a 'direct' signal to the house. Just mic. Amp on stage so I can hear myself better and hopefully play more in tune.

4125846991_97e23b1947_o.png
Click to expand...

Agreed. You have to factor in whether it is leader or collective music - who has what invested in it. If it is just a gig who cares about nice acoustic sound? If it is collective or your music, or music you really care about you make different decisions. A mic is not a bad idea, I don't own one.
 
#14
damonsmith said:
Bigger venues should have a mic. I went with out an amp for many, many years and I never had trouble in bigger venues. I am getting old with less to prove so I use an amp if feel like I might need it (with one of those Polytone toothpick things!).

In earlier years, I used to tell drummers they could play quieter or bring me an amp - I can't believe that actually worked, looking back!!
Click to expand...

They should have a mic, but sometimes they don't if one isn't requested/specified in the contract.


Hope I didn't offend you Damon. I wish I still had my Polytone. I used it before I "knew" any better. I used that and the FRAP preamp with 4 9v batts into a new at the time '70's Yamaha board. A lot of my live tracks from gigs ended up being used on local radio ads. Bassists always wanted to know how I got "that sound" from my old Kay bass. One guy came down and commented that the Polytone pu looked like a house jack between the legs of the bridge. But it worked really well!

Again I think that what calivox said about being prepared, and what fdeck said about the power limitations of small PA rigs is really important.

Heck, you don't even need a stand, you can wrap a affordable dynamic mic like a Shure 57/58 in a towel or foam, place it between the bridge feet, and be free to concentrate on making music.
 
#15
I turned up at a charity gig once in a hall with about 120 people. They had a 300W per side FOH system with 15" speakers, but whoever loaned the PA out for the gig had said "no bass through the PA". Luckily I had brought my 10" 30W Roland keyboard amp. So at least, I heard me.

What cheesed me off the most, was the acoustic guitarist put more subsonics into the PA system than my upright setup would have. Usually I have no problem with going into the PA, and I always have a mic and a mic pre with me. The preamp can provide XLR or phono lead which is appreciated if the sound person is running out of mic inputs. There is usually a line in or such free on the mixer.
 

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