An Observation Regarding Rap

[Brad Barker]

this is actually a serious question. what is the difference between "hip-hop" and "rap"?

well, according to the magazine the source when i read it in the 90s, hip-hop is the (sub) culture and rap is the music of the (sub) culture.

the other aspects of hip-hop, apparently, included breakdancing, dj'ing, and graffiti. (no wonder why cheeze isn't a fan! )

 

[Wrong Robot]

this is actually a serious question. what is the difference between "hip-hop" and "rap"?

I personally don't really care to differentiate all that much, I just listen to music, whatever it's called, I don't mind as long as it sounds/feels good. That said, the 'official' distinction of rap from hip hop is that rap is a form of music and hip hop is a form of culture.

Again, I don't really care myself, I don't like the idea of falling into a clique and acting a certain way based on defining yourself(ostensibly, on someone else's motives) But that's the way a lot of people see it. Hip hop is more than just rapping, it's breakdancing, djaying, tagging and, more modernly, acting/dressing a certain way...etc.

You could think of it how there is punk rock and punk culture(which I've always thought was really dumb, despite liking punk rock)

 

[Wrong Robot]

I've always been shocked that bass players wouldn't like rap music, being that it is almost entirely rhythmic. Talk about groove, there it is.

 

[cheezewiz]

I've always been shocked that bass players wouldn't like rap music, being that it is almost entirely rhythmic. Talk about groove, there it is.

Yes, but unless there is an actual bass guitar on the recording, why would a bassist care?

 

[Bruce Lindfield]

IMHO all rap is musically challenged.

I like this definition!!


So it's like :

I can't be bothered * to invent my own beat - I'll sample one!
I can't be bothered to come up with a chord sequence - I'll sample one!
I can't be bothered to write a melodic line for the verse...I'll rap!
I can't be bothered to think of a catchy chorus - I'll sample one!!

* Insert : "and I don't have the musical skills or imagination" where appropriate!!

 

[Wrong Robot]

Yes, but unless there is an actual bass guitar on the recording, why would a bassist care?

Rhythm is rhythm. If it has a groove, and you appreciate groove, then I don't see how you could dislike the music.

 

[Brad Johnson]

I'm a self proclaimed rap hater. However, I'm MUCH more likely to give rap "music" backed by actual instruments, such as "Roots" a listen, rather than some jerk braggin how big his package is backed by samples and other "non instruments".

Cool... the thing is, there's several choices like that out there. I don't want to hear the braggin on the package nonsense either, so I don't listen to it. OTOH for a musician to actually be exposed to Common or Mos Def, etc. and consider the entire genre non-musical as some have done in this thread seems nonsensical... unless they haven't been exposed. But then, shouldn't they realize that by now?

The truly funny thing is that that Common has one cut that's bragging, some people would seek that out, solely to complain about it... ignoring everything else.

I'm not a big fan of Rap but I can admit that some of it is actually above the norm.

 

[Bruce Lindfield]

Listen to the Roots, The Streets, Common, Kanye West, NWA (they were negative yes, but they were speaking the truth), Run DMC, Common... The list goes on forever. You shouldn't judge whats popular.

"The Streets" - not popular!!??

It's all over the radio here and I hate it!! That guy is the most talentless and musically-challenged person I have ever heard on the radio in et last 30 years !!

It's not dance music, it's dreary and dull with no musical redeeming features whatsoever - and the lyrics (rap) are so awful I would be embrassed if it was produced in a junior school poetry class!! :scowl:

 

[Brad Johnson]

I like this definition!!


So it's like :

I can't be bothered * to invent my own beat - I'll sample one!
I can't be bothered to come up with a chord sequence - I'll sample one!
I can't be bothered to write a melodic line for the verse...I'll rap!
I can't be bothered to think of a catchy chorus - I'll sample one!!

* Insert : "and I don't have the musical skills or imagination" where appropriate!!

It's pretty obvious what's "challenged".

 

[Wrong Robot]

I like this definition!!


So it's like :

I can't be bothered * to invent my own beat - I'll sample one!
I can't be bothered to come up with a chord sequence - I'll sample one!
I can't be bothered to write a melodic line for the verse...I'll rap!
I can't be bothered to think of a catchy chorus - I'll sample one!!

* Insert : "and I don't have the musical skills or imagination" where appropriate!!

Ridiculous! I know you're hip to all sorts of world musics so it's kinda surprising to hear you say something like that. Melody and chords aren't the be all and end all of music. You clearly don't listen to rap music for you to make such absurd statements.

Historically, Rap music is sampled because those doing it were too poor to buy instruments/training. Contemporarily, Rap music is barely sampled, save for the occasional bit here or there, opting instead for fleshed out productions with multiple layers of rhythmic complexity(live, synthesized and sampled instruments). The rapper, assuming he's a good one, works like a jazz soloist, providing rhythmic improvisation ontop of a rhythm track.

The music is about groove 100%. Surely you can appreciate that.



(but I agree, "the streets" sucks, I have no idea how he became popular, still though, for you to gauge an entire musical movement on the vapid pop trash is a little presumptuous don't you think?)

 

[cheezewiz]

Rhythm is rhythm. If it has a groove, and you appreciate groove, then I don't see how you could dislike the music.

Well, I guess we just differ then. I love groove. I play bass. I don't like rap. Don't pinhole me in your preferences.

 

[Bruce Lindfield]

It's pretty obvious what's "challenged".

Well ...certainly not my intelligence!!

 

[Mon Rominee]

I don't hate on any genre as much as I hate on the vast majority gravitating to the lowest common denominator offerings of said genre, and exploiting / transforming it into a mass-consumable lifestyle.

From bubblegum Hot-Topic punk to Jeans-West hip hop flayva, kids are getting entirely the wrong message, because of the status quo. A fear of alienation from their peers. whatever it is, I can't stand to look at todays youth and wonder WHY they choose to be so easily categorized. I know it's same as it ever was, but never in my life has it been more apparent.

MTV brand hiphop is a gate-way music simply to promote company wares. Damned if I don't roll on 20's, bangin my subs wearin my Ecko. Same thing with pop punk. same with all the commercial offerings. Same as it ever was. And I don't even mind so much that the kids buy into it as much as it saddens me that the reason they buy into it so completely is because, to me, it appears they don't want to take the effort to realise there is more and better out there. I hate to make such a broad generalization, but these kids look downright miserable. Rude. dissaffected.

I know I come off as "old", but what happenned to kids having any kind of manners?

Aw hell, I'm getting off topic again.

Mon

 

[Wrong Robot]

Well, I guess we just differ then. I love groove. I play bass. I don't like rap. Don't pinhole me in your preferences.

I'm not trying to. I just think it's odd is all. Truly, if it weren't for my affinity for rap music(and RnB as well), my sense of groove would have never matured to where it has. I recognize this, and as a bass player, am always awfully surprised to see such a bias against rap music when it so perfectly encompasses what so many bass players profess to be 'all about'. I can't help but think, it's not about the music, and that's just kinda sad.

 

[Bruce Lindfield]

(but I agree, "the streets" sucks, I have no idea how he became popular, still though, for you to gauge an entire musical movement on the vapid pop trash is a little presumptuous don't you think?)

Well - of course my first post was being humorously ironic - but I didn't expect many people to get it !!

But my second was deadly serious - "The Streets" is the worst excuse for "music" I've ever heard!!

 

[Wrong Robot]

But my second was deadly serious - "The Streets" is the worst excuse for "music" I've every heard!!

Ya, pretty much, I'm really surprised that people actually listen to that garbage, but, just goes to show. It's not about the music

 

[Brad Johnson]

Yes, but unless there is an actual bass guitar on the recording, why would a bassist care?

Because there's more to music appreciation than just hearing "your" instrument?

Why would a bassist care about "Boogie On, Reggae Woman" or "Higher Ground" by Stevie Wonder?

I know a lot of musicians who only listen to their instrument in whatever music they're listening to... that's unfortunate.

One of my favorite cds over the last couple of years is Joshua Redman's "Elastic". No bass guitar, "just" organ, drums and sax. Or check out Soulive.

 

[Brad Johnson]

Well ...certainly not my intelligence!!

Merry Christmas.

 

[Brad Johnson]

Well - of course my first post was being humorously ironic - but I didn't expect many people to get it !!

But my second was deadly serious - "The Streets" is the worst excuse for "music" I've ever heard!!

The irony was...?

 

[Bruce Lindfield]

Christmas and rap - a match made in Hell!!??


If you have to have a joke explained ...it tends to lose something!!