Any Motorcycle Riders? Advice for a Newbie?

[McHaven]

I'd like to discuss some protective gear. I don't want to spend $1000 on gear, and I've been trying to make due with what I already have.

Boots: I have some steel toed construction boots that I've been wearing on the bike. They come well over my ankle, seems like I get good traction. They have a very aggressive tread. Do motorcycle boots offer that much of an advantage over work boots? I'm worried mostly about traction, especially on little bits of gravel. My work boots honestly look more protective than all the motorcycle boots I've looked at.

They may work okay, sure. I like my motorcycle boots specifically due to padding, comfort, and mid calf length. Motorcycle boots tend to have impact resist material in the spots you want it. If you ever have the bike fall on you, having a peg jammed in your ankle hurts like hell.

Pants: I wear my work jeans, though I'm sure the would get ripped up if I went down. Do I need overpants, or is that overkill in the city?

To be honest, I seldom wear my riding pants, unless I'm hitting the highways. Jeans will be shredded if you go down though. Finding comfortable riding pants can be a challenge. I've got a nice ventilated pair, that I can wear jeans under, or if its really hot, just gym shorts.

Jacket: I do own a leather jacket, though it wasn't made specifically for riding a motorcycle. Any reason this wouldn't be sufficient?

There is more to a riding jacket than just abrasion resistance. Leather is the best when it comes to abrasion, but just as important is impact padding. Even with the nicest leathers, its going to hurt like hell when you hit the ground. For summer, I wear a mesh jacket with extensive armoring. A really good feature is back armor that only bends naturally with the spine. It helps to prevent you from bending the wrong way and injuring your back in an accident.

Gloves: Would leather work gloves be enough? I saw some motorcycle gloves as well when I was looking at boots, and they felt very flimsy. Almost like the batting gloves baseball players wear. I did see some with knuckle protection. These gloves were definitely a fabric, I was expecting them to be leather.

Well, typically the hands are the first thing to hit the ground. You should get something with good abrasion resistance, but I've never felt the need for knuckle guards or things like that. I wear deerskin leather gloves. Seem fine to me. Sure, there are lots better, but in my mind, its enough. They also make gauntlets, that extend up the wrist for extra protection, as well gloves with kevlar on top of the fingers and hand for abrasion.

Eye Protection/helmet: I should just go with a full face helmet, and that would take care of eye protection as well. What about sunglasses, I don't want to be blinded if I'm riding into the sun? Do they count as eye protection if I wore them with a half helmet? Think I could slip a pair of sunglasses under a full face helmet?

Do not cheap out. Go full face, try on a bunch, make sure it fits you properly. A helmet is supposed to be like another layer of your skull that moves with your head to absorb impact. Wearing a helmet too big, where your head freely moves inside is still bad. For bright sun, they make tinted visors (which are really easy to get on and off) and yes, you can fit sunglasses in a helmet. Maybe not your nice big aviators, but you cant fit some. How do you think people with glasses ride Just don't try and put the helmet on with your glasses on. Kinda hard to do.

Is it just me, or does it seem like most protective gear is designed to make you look like Master Chief?

There's two main schools of riding gear. Cruiser guys dress like pirates and the Village People. Sport squids dress like they're going to the beach (sandals, maybe a shirt, shorts), and tourers look like space men. Of course, these are broad generalizations and stereotypes.

I'm wondering how many people use or have used their bike as a main source of transportation. I can almost afford to buy a used Rebel or something similar. After I had the bike, insurance and gas would be SO cheap compared to the car (she burned 18 gallons of premium every week or so). I believe my dad's insurance is 200 bucks a year because of the low displacement. It's not year round transportation, but I could get around without borrowing a parent's car. Or maybe I'm just trying to justify buying my own bike...

I use my bike as my main transport 90% of the time. Unless I'm carrying a bunch of stuff, or need to pick someone up, I'm on the bike. With saddlebags, I can fit just about everything I need. Grocery shopping with a bike is great, because you really have to pick and choose what you can carry, which often helps you cut down on junk food/unnecessary stuff. However, I would make sure you either have a friend or a family member with a truck and loading ramp, just in case.

 

[McHaven]

Ice is not your friend on/in any vehicle...particularly one with two wheels...

here is a used Ural w/hack for $8000.00: Invalid Link Removed

here's three for $7000.00: http://www.cycletrader.com/Ural-Motorcycles/search-results?make=Ural|2321128&vrsn=hybrid

Sure, sidecar hacks are great and all, but not a Ural! I mean, yes they may be the best, if only, manufacturer produced hack at the moment, but damn. It's a copy of a 60 year BMW design. You'll be lucky to hit 60 on a Ural.

Also, for gear, listen to PhilBiker. He speaks the truth.

 

[Philbiker]

Specific recommendation: Scorpion brand helmets. I like mine quite a lot, and it was very inexpensive!

 

[McHaven]

Specific recommendation: Scorpion brand helmets. I like mine quite a lot, and it was very inexpensive!

Invalid Link Removed is great for finding discounted helmets. Typically they have last year's graphics, which can severely reduce the price. My Shoei was only 150 bucks.

 

[greekorican]

I went to take the road test at the DMV today, I passed on my first attempt. I had to wait in line on the bike for about an hour before they tested me, and the thoughts inside my head were getting to me. After an hour to over-think everything, I had myself almost convinced that I had forgot how to use the clutch, how to lean/turn, etc. I was a bundle of nerves by the time it was my turn. The road test for my drivers license was the same way. It's one thing to operate a vehicle by yourself, and it's another to do it while someone from the state is watching you while holding a clipboard.

I can see in some MSF Beginner Course videos on youtube that everyone puts down only their left foot when coming to a stop. I can see that you might want your foot on the rear brake, but other than that, I'm stumped. I don't see any advantage to having just your left foot on the ground. There must be a good reason why they teach this, I'm curious why.

I have seen several websites about motorcycle police officers that swear by staying in the friction zone and feathering the rear brake when making slow tight turns. That is how I've been doing U-Turns and the cone weave test, and it definitely helps. I'm wondering: 1) Do you use/recommend this technique? I haven't seen mention of it outside of motorcycle police officers, it doesn't seem very common. Is this something MSF teaches? 2) Just how bad would this be for the clutch? It's not my bike, so I'd feel bad if I wore it out quickly.

Thanks for the advice guys!

 

[KillerQuebec]

I would surmise that when coming to a stop you should have already down shifted into first and therefore have no need to use your left foot for anything other than holding the bike up. You need the right foot on the brake if you are not level to keep the bike steady.

Also consider coming to a stop on the right side of the lane so your left foot is coming down on the crown of the road so you don't have so far to reach. Think about what would happen if you put down your right foot on a heavily crowned road. The footing will be a couple of inches lower than the center of the bike. this will cause you to freak and lose your footing.

congrats on passing the test. apparently you can turn and stop. yippee!!!

 

[CBRStingray]

I went to take the road test at the DMV today, I passed on my first attempt. I had to wait in line on the bike for about an hour before they tested me, and the thoughts inside my head were getting to me. After an hour to over-think everything, I had myself almost convinced that I had forgot how to use the clutch, how to lean/turn, etc. I was a bundle of nerves by the time it was my turn. The road test for my drivers license was the same way. It's one thing to operate a vehicle by yourself, and it's another to do it while someone from the state is watching you while holding a clipboard.

I can see in some MSF Beginner Course videos on youtube that everyone puts down only their left foot when coming to a stop. I can see that you might want your foot on the rear brake, but other than that, I'm stumped. I don't see any advantage to having just your left foot on the ground. There must be a good reason why they teach this, I'm curious why.

I have seen several websites about motorcycle police officers that swear by staying in the friction zone and feathering the rear brake when making slow tight turns. That is how I've been doing U-Turns and the cone weave test, and it definitely helps. I'm wondering: 1) Do you use/recommend this technique? I haven't seen mention of it outside of motorcycle police officers, it doesn't seem very common. Is this something MSF teaches? 2) Just how bad would this be for the clutch? It's not my bike, so I'd feel bad if I wore it out quickly.

Thanks for the advice guys!

There are a couple of reasons for this. Taking off with the rear brake partially on is useful. It helps you keep things smooth and provides good stability and control until you get going. As mentioned, you should already be in first gear and ready to move off before you actually stop (in case of emergency - like a cager about to rear-end you), so there is no need to keep your foot on the gear lever. Also, it affords you the luxury of not needing to be constantly squeezing the front brake with your hand if you're on an incline. Your hands can fatigue quickly (or cramp) when you spend a lot of time at traffic lights.

 

[Tsal]

One more option for upper body protection, a zippered protective mesh jacket - all the plastic you could want, just throw any slightly oversized jacket/shirt on top and you'll be protected. These start around 150 bucks, so they're not that expensive, either.

 

[gm2_in_co]

One more option for upper body protection, a zippered protective mesh jacket - all the plastic you could want, just throw any slightly oversized jacket/shirt on top and you'll be protected. These start around 150 bucks, so they're not that expensive, either.

Of course this one is around $300 and seems available only in limited sizes.

 

[Tsal]

Of course this one is around $300 and seems available only in limited sizes.

Oh yeah, that's a Dainese one, it's bound to be a bit more expensive as it's a name brand. I'm not sure, but I think they originate in enduro racing and I've seen dozens of cheaper brands who have their own versions, starting at $99. Check out stores that sell motocross gear, should find some. Apparently some ATV stores sell them, too.

 

[greekorican]

I am still interested in taking an MSF class, as I don't want to end up smeared all over the pavement. But I'd also like to get my money's worth, the classes are a bit pricey. Is the Beginner course still worth taking if you already have basic skills? They offer an Experienced Rider course, with the following description:
* Smoother, More Defensive Riding
* Advanced Braking Techniques
* Advanced Shifting Techniques
* Body Steering
* Counter steering
* Swerving
* Limited Space Maneuvers
* Cornering and Apexes
* Throttle Blipping

I'm thinking about taking this instead instead, but then again it might be over my head. It's also only $125. Maybe I'm rushing the learning process, but whenever I learn anything, I go all out. I learn best when I'm challenged. Think the advanced class will be too much for me to handle? Maybe I should put some miles under my belt and then take it?

Any tips for transitioning to riding in traffic? I was already riding around the neighborhood on the street before yesterday (illegal, yes, but we only own one bike). I stuck to side streets, and spent a bit of time on some smaller main streets. I've been driving for 3 years and feel perfectly confident in a car in most situations. Without all that metal around me, that confidence is gone. What really makes me uneasy is situations where you accelerate from a stop up to the speed of traffic, ie: right turn out of a parking lot, when a red light turns green. I haven't even tried a left turn at light yet. I have no complaints with this bike (Honda Rebel), other than that you run through each gear incredibly fast. I've gotta shift up to 2nd before I make it through the intersection, and up to 3rd before I make it up to the speed of traffic (30ish). I could probably hit the speed of traffic in 2nd, but all the power seems to be in the low rpms. If you don't get up to speed fast enough, you've got people honking, tailgating, or trying to swerve around you.

I've always heard people say if you rode a motorcycle, it made you a better driver. I totally understand why now. Even with the limited experience I have, I can see the effect it has on my driving. I also notice every single motorcycle on the road ever since I started learning. Everyone should learn to ride, or at least drive a stick shift. The road would be a safer place. I never learned to drive a stick shift, but the manual transmission makes you plan ahead. It forces you to scan further down the road to figure out what gear you need to be in. My next car will have a manual.

EDIT: I took my first bug to the face yesterday. It was just a fly, but I'm surprised how much a fly hurt at 30 mph. I'm gonna try on some full face helmets later today, because that was disgusting. I really liked the half helmet because you can feel the wind in your face, but after this incident maybe wind in your face is not such a good thing. Can anyone name a brand or specific helmet that doesn't make you look like Master Chief/Power Rangers? Obviously looking cool is not more important that protecting your head, but I think most of the full face helmets are butt ugly.

How does a tinted visor work at night? It would be nice to not have to change visors depending on what time of day I go out. My dad says when he was my age, they all wore sunglasses at night, just because it looks cool. Obviously he doesn't recommend it...

 

[McHaven]

I'd start with the basic. You may breeze through most of it, but it does teach some very good fundamentals, and can help you recognize and eliminate bad habits.

Coming from a stop to match traffic can be scary at first. The throttle is your friend. Shift evenly and smoothly and it won't be a problem.

For helmets, I like my Shoei. I don't think it's too "Power rangers" looking, just maybe Space Man.

Some helmets have really easy quick release visors, so you can change once the sun goes down quickly. Otherwise, you may just want to wear sunglasses under your visor.

Wind in the face can be fun. I don't like it at high speed though. Of course, visors are adjustable and you can always wear it open. Full face helmets are really more about the chin protection than the visor. Half-helmets can have visors as well. That chin-strip area is one of the most damaged areas in a crash, so you do want that protection.

Also, another suggestion for highway speed/long distance: Ear plugs. Sounds strange I know, but it helps tremendously with focus. You can still hear everything you need to (engine, other cars, etc) but it cuts down wind noise and really helps with your focus by eliminating the wind noise. For me, wind noise is a distraction, and can actually prevent me from reaching the speed I need. I really don't like wind noise. With the ear plugs, wind noise is drastically reduced (i wear 35 decibel ear plugs) and it makes me much more comfortable and focused.

 

[KillerQuebec]

Dude,

You get an insurance discount for taking the MSF courses. It will more than pay back the tuition.

 

[Tsal]

EDIT: I took my first bug to the face yesterday. It was just a fly, but I'm surprised how much a fly hurt at 30 mph. I'm gonna try on some full face helmets later today, because that was disgusting.
How does a tinted visor work at night? It would be nice to not have to change visors depending on what time of day I go out. My dad says when he was my age, they all wore sunglasses at night, just because it looks cool. Obviously he doesn't recommend it...

Sunglasses have their advantages during the day, for example being polarized and having prescription lenses, plus you can take them off for the night easier than a visor. I have polarized prescription lenses with light brown "roadview" tint, they work well even during cloudy weather. However, the latest trend in helmets is to have a second, small "sunglass visor" inside the main visor. There's also a lot of half-face helmets with large visors, but of course the full helmets offer better protection for your face, so it's a matter of choice. You might even get both full and half face helmets, it's not unusual to have 2-3 helmets hanging around. When choosing a helmet, notice that different manufacturers have slightly different shape in the bowl and different amount of padding, so try them out beforehand.

Oh, and remember to wear bright colors when riding, and keep your headlights on. You'd be surprised how much a white jacket helps visibility. I've seen guys on black bikes, no lights, black jacket, black helmet. Good luck with being seen in less than optimal conditions

 

[McHaven]

Oh, and remember to wear bright colors when riding, and keep your headlights on. You'd be surprised how much a white jacket helps visibility. I've seen guys on black bikes, no lights, black jacket, black helmet. Good luck with being seen in less than optimal conditions

Headlight switches haven't been an option in the states since the 1960s.

 

[CBRStingray]

Oh, and remember to wear bright colors when riding, and keep your headlights on. You'd be surprised how much a white jacket helps visibility. I've seen guys on black bikes, no lights, black jacket, black helmet. Good luck with being seen in less than optimal conditions

Actually, most studies seem to conclude that the colour of clothing worn by the riding has no effect on visibility. All bikes have their headlights designed so that they are always on. You can't switch it off.

 

[Tsal]

Actually, most studies seem to conclude that the colour of clothing worn by the riding has no effect on visibility. All bikes have their headlights designed so that they are always on. You can't switch it off.

Here ya go:

Research from New Zealand reaffirms the value of bright motorcycle helmets, reflective clothing, and daytime headlight usage. Just choosing a bright-colored helmet can cut your crash risk by 24%.
Invalid Link Removed

In my opinion, where the visibility comes to play is when the steel-snail drivers take a quick glance in their rearviews before switching lanes, or in busy crossings where there's many things to observe. When there's a bright color there, it tends to get noticed even with a quick glance.

The thing why motorcycles are harder to recognize, I think, is with the pattern recognition type of our brains. Most drivers are subconsciously on the look out for cars and trucks: double headlights, large hoods, large windshields, large squareish lump of metal. When there's a small object like a motorbike, and especially if the bike is in half-shadow, not on contrasting background, against sun glare etc., it's easy for the brains not to register any "threat" at all.

However, what the drivers ARE looking out for, is the colors of a police motorbike. The local police has white bikes and white helmets, and people sporting that combination have noted that a lot of drivers tend to slow down when they see them coming at them, even to a point when they have been given the finger afterwards

 

[McHaven]

Here ya go:

However, what the drivers ARE looking out for, is the colors of a police motorbike. The local police has white bikes and white helmets, and people sporting that combination have noted that a lot of drivers tend to slow down when they see them coming at them, even to a point when they have been given the finger afterwards

Oh yes, I love that. I rode with a high-viz jacket for awhile, with helmet and I had a modulating headlight. Quite a few people pulled over for me.

 

[CBRStingray]

Here ya go:



In my opinion, where the visibility comes to play is when the steel-snail drivers take a quick glance in their rearviews before switching lanes, or in busy crossings where there's many things to observe. When there's a bright color there, it tends to get noticed even with a quick glance.

The thing why motorcycles are harder to recognize, I think, is with the pattern recognition type of our brains. Most drivers are subconsciously on the look out for cars and trucks: double headlights, large hoods, large windshields, large squareish lump of metal. When there's a small object like a motorbike, and especially if the bike is in half-shadow, not on contrasting background, against sun glare etc., it's easy for the brains not to register any "threat" at all.

However, what the drivers ARE looking out for, is the colors of a police motorbike. The local police has white bikes and white helmets, and people sporting that combination have noted that a lot of drivers tend to slow down when they see them coming at them, even to a point when they have been given the finger afterwards

The MAIDS report, which used a similar sample size (but was conducted only 10 years ago, as opposed the 30 years ago like the one you linked to) didn't not reach the same conclusions concerning clothing and visibility.

 

[Tsal]

The MAIDS report, which used a similar sample size (but was conducted only 10 years ago, as opposed the 30 years ago like the one you linked to) didn't not reach the same conclusions concerning clothing and visibility.

It was actually sampled 15 years ago and published in 2004, in New Zealand. They noted that helmet color was the main contributing thing, and that clothing color had less to do with visibility from the front, but it does have some effect from other directions. The MAIDS study only looked into clothing color from the front, where the findings were similar (minor or no effect), but they didn't apparently look into helmet color.