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Any US Made Class D Amps?

#41
Joe, That's what I thought too and one of the things that got me started on this thread. I played through some older Ampeg stuff and really dug it. Made in USA. Went looking for the newer, replacement versions of the old stuff. SVT7PRO... Made in China. SVT4PRO... Made in Vietnam. Both sound good, but I really try to support (to the best of my ability) our economy.
I've done that with the Boogie, but I was trying to lighten up the rig, and try something a little more current (sorry for the bad pun).
 
#42
Marty Forrer said:
To wear the Made In USA sticker, a product has to have minimum 40% local content. Local content can be paint, packaging, anything at all. That means when you buy an American product it may actually be 59% asian content. As others have said, most all electronic componentry is made in China, if it was made in the US no-one would be able to afford it.
Some years back, PRS guitars (made in US) got too big so outsourced their bodies and necks to Warmoth. Then when business got to big for Warmoth, THEY outsourced the bodies and necks to China. So..... PRS guitars (proudly handmade in US) actually had Chinese major components, but the assembly, fittings, finish, packaging etc allowed them to be Made In USA.
Another... Proel cables (with made in Italy printed on the cable) were actually made in the Korean Leem factory. We saw this with our own eyes when in the factory. This was some years ago, probably made in China now.
Bottom line... nothing is as it seems.
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+1 a big one.

I don't think most people realize how farmed out, farmed out, and farmed out again most things are. Yeah, some of it is inter-country, or more often, inter-bank deals, but that's not up for discussion here.

Less than half gets you "Made in the USA"....a joke. Sourcing from a US company, who in turn sources from overseas, still counts as "Made in the USA"....another joke.

ISO9000....another joke. All that boils down to is you have a detailed production plan and you follow it. If your production plan precribes making junk, and you follow it and in fact make junk, you're certified.

Props to those who are trying to do as much here as they can. Ignore stickers and labels, dig into it, and see where your stuff is really coming from.
 
#43
banjo5 said:
I'm getting old, and fat, and lazy (er). I'm looking to replace my M9 with a lighter, hernia friendly, AMERICAN MADE class D amp. Am I dreaming? Is there any such thing? I need 750+ watts, I think. My main cab is a Schroeder 21012L rated at 1000W. We play everying from new country to classic rock and a little funk for me to get my slapity slap on. The guitar player in the band plays 2-30 watt Dr Z's in stereo adn like to let them roar.
Am I going to be dissapointed with everything I compare to the M9?
Is there anything out there that is mad in the US?
Are there any class D's that are reliable and don't sound sterile?
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I take it that's a 4 ohm Schro? The Genz Benz 9.x or the Genz Benz SL 900 wold be great for that cab 4lbs & 7 lbs respectively.
 
#44
Had a great talk with Jason at GK before getting my mb800. Assembled, designed and supported in USA by GK. Answered all questions and it's made and supported enough here for me. I love the tone and have always had great support from them. Very happy and my markbass little mark now a backup till I gig test mb800 nest week
 
#48
I'd like to see more "Pre-amps" and separate power amps. The packaging needs to be worked out. Not rack size, but bag size, half-rack bolt together parts.

The preamp can say "Made in USA" and a power amp can say "Assembled in USA"

Yeah well I think class-d and SMPS, the power amp sections of heads, are commodities now. The module makers have far exceeded the threshold of human perception. Bass manufacturers should really take a hard look at buying this part of the "head" instead of trying to re-invent their own. LOUD/Ampeg have tried to re-invent their own and they just can't approach the module manufacturers quality and reliability. There are millions of modules sold to not just bass manufacturers. It may be "fun" for their engineers to design and build a class-d, but it takes a lot of experience that traditional engineers just don't have.

The key to the signature sound is the pre-amp and extra features put in the feedback path like Limiting, etc. These are added outside the amplifier module. The amp part of the snap together pre-amp/amp should have a feedback path for the pre section to add some control.

I would like to see somebody finally build protection that does something besides "shutdown" when a amp is driven hard. I truly believe this is solvable by wrapping an amp module, or working with the module makers to create mission-critical amps.


The manufacturers that insist they need to build their own amp sections, could at least source US parts. If they're going to use a toroidal transformer in the power supply that should at least get this wound in the USA. They can ask the case makers where they get the metal for the case. There's lots that can be done to bring the % of Made in the USA up.
 
#49
banjo5 said:
I'm getting old, and fat, and lazy (er). I'm looking to replace my M9 with a lighter, hernia friendly, AMERICAN MADE class D amp. Am I dreaming? Is there any such thing? I need 750+ watts, I think. My main cab is a Schroeder 21012L rated at 1000W. We play everying from new country to classic rock and a little funk for me to get my slapity slap on. The guitar player in the band plays 2-30 watt Dr Z's in stereo adn like to let them roar.
Am I going to be dissapointed with everything I compare to the M9?
Is there anything out there that is mad in the US?
Are there any class D's that are reliable and don't sound sterile?
Click to expand...

The new bass head from DNA is class D and all U.S.A. made. This new amp was going to called the Helix 1200 but has been renamed as the "1350."
 
#51
seamonkey said:
..Yeah well I think class-d and SMPS, the power amp sections of heads, are commodities now. The module makers have far exceeded the threshold of human perception. Bass manufacturers should really take a hard look at buying this part of the "head" instead of trying to re-invent their own. LOUD/Ampeg have tried to re-invent their own and they just can't approach the module manufacturers quality and reliability. There are millions of modules sold to not just bass manufacturers. It may be "fun" for their engineers to design and build a class-d, but it takes a lot of experience that traditional engineers just don't have.

The key to the signature sound is the pre-amp and extra features put in the feedback path like Limiting, etc. These are added outside the amplifier module. The amp part of the snap together pre-amp/amp should have a feedback path for the pre section to add some control...
Click to expand...

You have to keep in mind that may of us amp builders look at amp design in very much the same way that luthiers look at taking some pieces of wood and creating a unique instrument that is as individual as they are. Amp building is every bit as much an art, as is building an instrument. It's kind like telling a luthier that it really doesn't make sense to sit and hand carve their own necks, when they can just go to Warmouth and buy a perfectly CNC routered neck.

And building a class D amp isn't as hard as you think for some engineers. Our engineer threw together one in about a week just for kicks (he's a nerd that way) that was very impressive. Trouble is, putting it into an amp would require a ton of money to be spent on getting FCC certification. That's where the real value of these drop in modules comes into play. These companies have already paid for the UL and FCC testing and certification of their modules, so it saves an amp manufacturer a boat load of money and time to not have to go through this process themselves.

seamonkey said:
...The manufacturers that insist they need to build their own amp sections, could at least source US parts. If they're going to use a toroidal transformer in the power supply that should at least get this wound in the USA. They can ask the case makers where they get the metal for the case. There's lots that can be done to bring the % of Made in the USA up.
Click to expand...

Way easier said than done. There are very few companies that make toroidal transformers in the first place, and even fewer here in the States. A good toroid is a really, really expensive component. The few companies that are here in the States are just way too expensive for use in a bass amp.
 
#52
Philonius said:
+1 on the Acoustic Image amps. US made (assembled at least) and guaranteed for life. One man's sterile is another man's transparent. I get enough color out of the instrument and a modest pedalboard. YMMV.

I think there is one up for sale in the DB section right now.
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++1 i have gigged my acoustic image focus series 3 for a few years now. i'm quite pleased with both the amp and the service.
 
#54
@Baer

Don't twist it. A bass neck is a totally different object than a class-d power amp.

Designing a class-d or any gear means taking into account FCC and UL rules and regulation. Class-d may be "fun" but you don't need to design it. Next I'll hear about custom op-amps.

It's hard to believe you can't get a quality built US transformer.
 
#56
Quote from the EA website:

The EA "Made In USA" Manufacturing Policy
Monday, November 21, 2011

At EA, we do our best to ensure that we source as many parts and components as possible from USA suppliers. Likewise, we use American labor as much as possible. We do note that there are simply some components and sub-assemblies that are only available from overseas sources and we strive to keep these at a minimum.

The generally higher cost of EA products is a direct result of our "Made In USA" manufacturing philosophy. We fully understand that our customers have a wide range of choices when it comes to musical instrument amplification products and urge everyone to research the quality and performance of our competitors' products before making a purchasing decision.
Click to expand...
 
#57
will33 said:
ISO9000....another joke. All that boils down to is you have a detailed production plan and you follow it. If your production plan precribes making junk, and you follow it and in fact make junk, you're certified.
Click to expand...

+1 We had some test equipment at work that hadn't been tested in... ever. To pass ISO900x[1] we had to put "Calibration required" stickers on them. A decade later, the stickers were dirty, tired, and worn looking, but as long as they where there we passed!

[1] I can't remember which 900x it was. It was not 9000, it was the one that excludes the software development.
 
#59
ISO is like a college diploma, you don't need one to be the worlds richest person, but you probably can't work in the world richest person's company without one :)

Hopefully if you are ISO, then so are your suppliers. It's be nice if "document" meant externally publish to your customers.

I have this feeling if challenged, a lot of MI gear marked as "Made in the USA" should really be "Assembled in the USA", sure there are government rules, but there really is no government agency watching all of this. Tips have to come from consumers, or other companies blowing the whistle.
 
#60
seamonkey said:
...Don't twist it. A bass neck is a totally different object than a class-d power amp...It's hard to believe you can't get a quality built US transformer.
Click to expand...
I didn't say I couldn't get one. The issue is cost. Toroids take extremely sophisticated machinery and a very high skill level to manufacture. Unfortunately, there are very very US companies making them that can compete with the transformers we are getting from Plitron.

And I'm not twisting my words with the bass neck analogy. Some of us simply don't want to drop the same off the shelf amp module into our amplifiers that are being used by a dozen other companies. It comes down to wanting to create a completely unique product from the ground up.
 

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