anybody else hate tweeters?

[Liten]

In the DB series cabs from Aguilar.. the tweeter makes all the difference in the world...
With it.. you can get a fairly modern sound out of the cab.. without it: Ol'school bonanza!! My 7o's MIA just wouldent stop sounding its age.. and got a preamp and split-coils in it...

Can't wait to get the big rig home.. DB750 - DB810 and a DB410/210 on top.. depending on what the bank has to say..

 

[joeydavidson]

I don't really like them, I prefer dead strings and no horn but sometimes its fun to experiment.

 

[cacio]

Never use a tw,i always turn it off.
I have nothing against them,but i simply find them unuseful

 

[Bruce Lindfield]

i really do.

hissy and feedback quick with any real kind of gain.

That sounds more like a reason not to use (too many) cheap effects or pre-amps!!

 

[synaesthesia]

A tweeter or even a good extended midrange will reproduce the higher frequencies fed to them. "Hiss" is a byproduct of your amplification and instrument chain, and is a consequence of a poor noise floor specification in signal to noise ratio. Many bass amps were designed in the era when they were intended to feed a full range woofer which would have dropped off beyond 3.5 Khz, let alone the 6 - 10 Khz region where 'hiss' resides.

Every system has a noise floor, typically as poor as - 60dB for low grade instrument amps, and close to or better than -90db in better spec amps. If you turn up your treble, or your amplification the noise floor rises and noise becomes more apparent. The noise floor runs across the frequency spectrum and is relative to your instrument signal.

When you get "hiss" it is a poor hi freq noise floor spec in your amp and instrument chain. Ironically, SWR which popularised the use of tweeters, had a remarkably poor signal to noise ratio at hi frequencies in their amps.

The tweeter by itself does not produce 'hiss', it reproduces what is fed to it.

 

[Hoover]

I've been using an Eden D210T for about a dozen years now. When I first got it I set the tweeter attenuator at the midway (12 o'clock) position. About eight years ago I started setting it at the 9 o'clock position. Two years ago I started setting it around the 7 o'clock position -- basically as low as it could go without being completely off.

Six months ago I pulled out the fuse (lightbulb) from the crossover, effectively disabling the tweeter entirely. Ah, yes... there's the sound I've been looking for all this time!

fwiw, I hate the tweeters in SWR Goliaths and Hartke 4.5's too.

 

[projectMalamute]

Hate em.

 

[blindeddie]

i really hate tweeters too. they suck. totally unnecessary. especially if you use roundwound strings or 10 inch speakers.

 

[greenboy]

My alternative:

Link Removed

Link Removed

 

[nubs]

no tweeter needed!

 

[main_sale]

I'm old school and don't see the need for tweeters in the kind of music that I play. Accordingly, if there are tweeters in my cabinets, they are turned off. I understand that there is a need for tweeters for some more modern playing styles but that is not what I like to play.

 

[Rhythm5]

Again, the hissy thing makes no sense.

Another way to look at it is... why would you not want to reproduce the entire possible frequency range of your instrument?

I do see your point Ken, and it all boils down to personal taste. Personally, I never see the need for a lot of bright high end extension in a band setting. I've got guitar, keyboards, cymbals all fighting for their sonic space up there. I'm more than happy to carve out my niche down low. When I throw up some of my favorite bass recordings I always notice how I am NOT hearing the type of high end a tweeter puts out. Most people think that you can't get your full range of tone from a paper speaker. Not true. Feed a 15KHz signal into a 12" tweeterless cab, and you will hear it just fine, although the speaker is not rated anywhere near that high. I think that the natural high end attenuation you get from a paper speaker makes the bass sit so much better in a band situation. Listen to James Jamerson's work and you will notice that you are not hearing a bright, sizzly high end. Low end all the way, yet it fits perfect in the MIX. That B-15 was considered high-fi back then. Taste sure have changed over the years!
Not to say that tweeters have no place. I think for some styles it sounds great. I saw Marcus Miller a couple years back in a small club and I can't imagine him playing without a tweeter in that cab.

 

[superbassman2000]

The only time that I don't like tweeters are when i am using distortion/overdrive--I think it's too trebly! however I don't hate them when playing clean.

 

[KJung]

I do see your point Ken, and it all boils down to personal taste. But I never see the need for a lot of bright high end extension in a band setting. I've got guitar, keyboards, cymbals all fighting for their sonic space up there. I'm more than happy to carve out my niche down low. When I throw up some of my favorite bass recordings I always notice how I am NOT hearing the type of high end a tweeter puts out. Most people think that you can't get your full range of tone from a paper speaker. Not true. Feed a 15KHz signal into a 12" tweeterless cab, and you will hear it just fine. Listen to some of James Jamerson's work and you will notice that you are not hearing a bright, sizzly high end. Low end all the way, yet it fits perfect in the MIX.
Not to say that tweeters have no place. I think for some styles it sounds great. I saw Marcus Miller a couple years back in a small club and I can't imagine him playing without tweeter in that cab.

+1 all the way to the above. Different strokes for different folks!

As an aside that will get me into no end of trouble, while I love Jamerson's playing, I always hated that tone... pure mud to my ears. Listen to Nathan East play those parts on the Michael McDonald Motown CD's. Jamerson obviously is the king of those parts, but man, does the bass SOUND better to my ears with Nathan playing with a more full range tone. I'm not talking about the over the top Marcus sizzle, just a tone that spans a nice broad range. It still sits in the mix beautifully.

And before all you 'dead flatwound foam pad under the strings' guys burn me at the stake..... this is one of the biggest IMO's I've ever posted

That all being said, personal taste is a wonderful thing. I only push back on the 'hiss' comments, etc.

 

[chucko58]

I really don't care for horn tweeters. And IMHO a tweet without a midrange driver leaves a hole in the most critical part of the audio spectrum.

All my cabs are 3-ways [edit: with dome tweets] (except for the subwoofer cab).

 

[XtraLongScale]

To paraphrase Muhammad Ali, "them tweeters ain't done nothin' to me". I don't have anything against them, I just don't use 'em. I'm plenty happy with the highs I get from my drivers, but I can see how some players dig 'em. Like mentioned earlier in this thread, different strokes.

 

[markjazzbassist]

totally unnecessary. especially if you use roundwound strings or 10 inch speakers.

great point. i've also found that 10's and rounds (steel's or nickels) have more than enough highs for me.

 

[nysbob]

Never had a cab with compression driver in it...and never will.

 

[nad]

Don't like them? Don't use them. I love them, and don't even turn them down when I'm using tons of overdrive (which is often).

I don't like 6-string basses but never tell those who do that they "don't need" that extra string.

 

[nickbear]

cant stand them, even if im going for a modernish tone. they make things sound too tinny and airy to me.

i know its not the actual tweeters that make hiss but i must say that when i turn my tweeter off the slight hiss i can have stops.. im not saying thats the tweeters fault at all but turning it off does solve that problem.