Anyone do any V4B Reissue Tube Rolling?

[Matt Craig]

Hey guys, I recently purchased a V4 B re-issue and it has a ton of miles on it. I play 80s and 90s hard rock through an 810 heritage. Does anyone have any experience with rolling tubes in these Amps? I've tried digging around and I really haven't seen much of anything. The amp has the stock JJ tubes in the pre-section and in the power section I traditionally have used NOS premium tubes in all of my gear, but I didn't want to spend the time rolling and swapping if there is nothing to be improved upon. In my experience guitar amps respond very well to high end vintage tubes, not sire how the reissue V4b is.

 

[coreyfyfe]

The amp was designed around modern production tubes. Any burned in, tested and matched set will probably be fine. If you want to play around with various tubes for tonal changes I would try some different 12AX7s in the first position.

 

[JeezyMcNuggles]

Hey guys, I recently purchased a V4 B re-issue and it has a ton of miles on it. I play 80s and 90s hard rock through an 810 heritage. Does anyone have any experience with rolling tubes in these Amps? I've tried digging around and I really haven't seen much of anything. The amp has the stock JJ tubes in the pre-section and in the power section I traditionally have used NOS premium tubes in all of my gear, but I didn't want to spend the time rolling and swapping if there is nothing to be improved upon. In my experience guitar amps respond very well to high end vintage tubes, not sire how the reissue V4b is.

I use tung sols in mine. Sounds great, and let's me get the gain higher than the stock JJs without distortion.

 

[Wasnex]

I didn't want to spend the time rolling and swapping if there is nothing to be improved upon.

Whether the tone is "Improved" is totally based on your opinion. What you like is not necessarily what I want.

Some circuits respond noticeably to rolling and some do not. Any changes that do occur tend to be pretty subtle. Many people don't feel it's worth the cost and effort. IMHO it can vary from amp to amp, and even circuit to circuit.

Possible Changes:
1. Level of gain
2. Overall tonal balance
3. Amount of headroom and rate of transition from clean, to compressed, to drive
4. Character of the drive

I suggest thinking about how the amp currently sounds and responds. This is to identify the changes you hope to achieve. Then do research to find tubes with a reputation for producing the desired change. Keep in mind the desired change may actually involve modifying multiple characteristics. You may be able to massage the sound in the right direction, but you may not be able to achieve exactly what you want. Also sometimes you may find two tubes sound awesome for totally different reasons. You may not be able to find one tube that gives you both qualities...so you have to choose which quality you value most.

When it comes to the actual rolling process, focus on one position at a time. Try all candidate tubes in the same slot to see how the circuits respond. Consider taking notes. After selecting the preferred tube in one position, move on to the next position. I like to do at least two rounds through all positions. You may find that you prefer different tubes in different positions, or you may find that one tube is your favorite in all positions.

You may also find that over time you notice something subtle is missing that did not come to your attention during tube rolling. Sometimes making your final decision can involve living with on tube for several days and then living with another tube for several days. You may wind up swapping the tubes back and forth a few times and struggling to choose a clear favorite.

If you don't really enjoy this sort of stuff; probably best to just leave the amp alone to avoid the risk of damaging something with all of the tube swapping.

 

[JimmyM]

I did a little and went back to the stock JJs. I only thought V1in the preamp made any difference, and it was too bright with NOS tubes.

 

[beans-on-toast]

Power tube rolling requires checking the bias. There's a little pot inside the chassis, the procedure is posted on TB.

 

[Matt Craig]

Whether the tone is "Improved" is totally based on your opinion. What you like is not necessarily what I want.

Some circuits respond noticeably to rolling and some do not. Any changes that do occur tend to be pretty subtle. Many people don't feel it's worth the cost and effort. IMHO it can vary from amp to amp, and even circuit to circuit.

Possible Changes:
1. Level of gain
2. Overall tonal balance
3. Amount of headroom and rate of transition from clean, to compressed, to drive
4. Character of the drive

I suggest thinking about how the amp currently sounds and responds. This is to identify the changes you hope to achieve. Then do research to find tubes with a reputation for producing the desired change. Keep in mind the desired change may actually involve modifying multiple characteristics. You may be able to massage the sound in the right direction, but you may not be able to achieve exactly what you want. Also sometimes you may find two tubes sound awesome for totally different reasons. You may not be able to find one tube that gives you both qualities...so you have to choose which quality you value most.

When it comes to the actual rolling process, focus on one position at a time. Try all candidate tubes in the same slot to see how the circuits respond. Consider taking notes. After selecting the preferred tube in one position, move on to the next position. I like to do at least two rounds through all positions. You may find that you prefer different tubes in different positions, or you may find that one tube is your favorite in all positions.

You may also find that over time you notice something subtle is missing that did not come to your attention during tube rolling. Sometimes making your final decision can involve living with on tube for several days and then living with another tube for several days. You may wind up swapping the tubes back and forth a few times and struggling to choose a clear favorite.

If you don't really enjoy this sort of stuff; probably best to just leave the amp alone to avoid the risk of damaging something with all of the tube swapping.

Thanks for the detailed response. Im a guitar palyer and have had over two dozen heads in the ladt 20 years. Ive rolled almost all of them and they usually "improve" overall with high end NOS. Im playing bass as a fill in and not as much experience with the effects of tubes on bass amps. Sounds like I will just get a fresh set of matched tubes and run it. Thansk agian

 

[Matt Craig]

Hey guys thanks. That's what I was looking for. O have a matched quad of original winged C 6l6 but if wont improve the sound I wont bother.

Now, who is the best place to get a quality matched quad of JJs from?

 

[Matt Craig]

I did a little and went back to the stock JJs. I only thought V1in the preamp made any difference, and it was too bright with NOS tubes.

Hey man thanks for the reply. What power tubes did you try? Any high end stuff like mullard , USA gE black plate, or winged C?

Also, anytime I'm looking for base info. I always look for your reply on the post and I run with that so thanks.

 

[coreyfyfe]

Hey guys thanks. That's what I was looking for. O have a matched quad of original winged C 6l6 but if wont improve the sound I wont bother.

Now, who is the best place to get a quality matched quad of JJs from?

If you're going with JJ my preference is to order with the extra burn in from AES.

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[JeezyMcNuggles]

Hey guys thanks. That's what I was looking for. O have a matched quad of original winged C 6l6 but if wont improve the sound I wont bother.

Now, who is the best place to get a quality matched quad of JJs from?

Tube Depot has never done me wrong

 

[JeezyMcNuggles]

Hey man thanks for the reply. What power tubes did you try? Any high end stuff like mullard , USA gE black plate, or winged C?

Also, anytime I'm looking for base info. I always look for your reply on the post and I run with that so thanks.

Oh, I've got a whole set from mine. They're basically brand new. Message me. I'll give you a good price. Ive also slot labeled them. that's brand new price.

 

[JimmyM]

Hey man thanks for the reply. What power tubes did you try? Any high end stuff like mullard , USA gE black plate, or winged C?

Also, anytime I'm looking for base info. I always look for your reply on the post and I run with that so thanks.

Thx but I know others have different results sometimes so I don't claim to be the last word

And I only tried different pre tubes, didn't change the power tubes.

 

[rickdog]

Now, who is the best place to get a quality matched quad of JJs from?

I've been happy with Eurotubes.

 

[Matt Craig]

Oh, I've got a whole set from mine. They're basically brand new. Message me. I'll give you a good price. Ive also slot labeled them. that's brand new price.View attachment 6975724

Hey man Im gonna go with the tung sols. I appreciate the offer. What pre tubes did you go with?

 

[JimmyM]

Hey man Im gonna go with the tung sols. I appreciate the offer. What pre tubes did you go with?

I can't tell you what Jeezy went with, but I tried a Tung Sol in V1 of the pre, and it also was a lot brighter, very much like the NOS tubes I have, maybe even a little brighter than one or two of them.

 

[JeezyMcNuggles]

Hey man Im gonna go with the tung sols. I appreciate the offer. What pre tubes did you go with?

Tung sols.

 

[Matt Craig]

I can't tell you what Jeezy went with, but I tried a Tung Sol in V1 of the pre, and it also was a lot brighter, very much like the NOS tubes I have, maybe even a little brighter than one or two of them.

Thx but I know others have different results sometimes so I don't claim to be the last word

And I only tried different pre tubes, didn't change the power tubes. , .

Thx but I know others have different results sometimes so I don't claim to be the last word

And I only tried different pre tubes, didn't change the power tubes.

Yeah your gear has mirrored mine so i look at that.
So here is a question about DIs. I got a countryman and a low pass filter ( Boughton) . I have a chance to buy a two notes captor for dirt cheap. Other than the attenuation, speaking pure tone, do you think the two notes will sound better since it has the cab sim than just the countryman?

 

[coreyfyfe]

I have a captor x and use it heavily for recording and home practice. I've never used it as a DI live, in part because I usually run it as a load box with 200+ watt amps at lower volumes so I'm not sure how it would handle stage volumes in pass through mode. But as a load box/bass DI in this context it's great. Only thing I wish it had was an aux in capability so I could use backing tracks for practicing, but I figured that out with a little behringer mixer for when I need to do that.

Live I'll use a countryman and let the sound guy figure out eq for the room. If you're running a ton of drive you might want the cab sim, but i think it somewhat gets lost in the mix and/or can be corrected at the desk if need be.

 

[JimmyM]

Yeah your gear has mirrored mine so i look at that.
So here is a question about DIs. I got a countryman and a low pass filter ( Boughton) . I have a chance to buy a two notes captor for dirt cheap. Other than the attenuation, speaking pure tone, do you think the two notes will sound better since it has the cab sim than just the countryman?

Probably but I haven't tried any Two Notes stuff yet.