Anyone have a "block" with music theory?

[E2daGGurl]

Actually no.
Music has no rules. Music Theory has rules.
Music has no natural order. The science of accoustics has order.
Humans make music as they see fit to express themselves, that's why there's so many different kinds of music. When listeners ask, "how did they do that?" then the analysis of music structure starts and music theory is born.

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I read this again and I got curious, again, how you explain the many similarities among all the world's musical systems?

Select, say, 5000 different musical systems from various cultures (most anthropologists would say that's a really good sample) and you'll find you can reduce what they do to specific aspects of theory, which are universal.

Tempo, meter and pitch are but three of these concepts.

Did you find a way to argue that these aren't universal? an you give any examples of any music anywhere that don't involve at least one of these??

 

[Fergie Fulton]

I read this again and I got curious, again, how you explain the many similarities among all the world's musical systems?

Select, say, 5000 different musical systems from various cultures (most anthropologists would say that's a really good sample) and you'll find you can reduce what they do to specific aspects of theory, which are universal.

Tempo, meter and pitch are but three of these concepts.

Did you find a way to argue that these aren't universal? an you give any examples of any music anywhere that don't involve at least one of these??

When i posted the original "music has an natural order and rules" reply i was meaning it more in the sense of learning music rather than playing music.
As i have said before it is that there is so much information available these days that players just see something like Harmony and start to get involved with out the knowledge you need to truly understand Harmony. That knowledge has an natural order to learn so that you understand how it all works, and yes it has rules that go with that teaching. eg To be a true major scale the 7th note is a semitone below the key note. That is the rule and that is fact.
I cannot say that other forms of music around the world have there rules and order but i would believe so as physics is involved in the creation of the sounds we hear. Why the sound of bagpipes, Sitar, digery-doo, sound pleasing to some and terrible to others has completly mystifed musicians and scholars for years and will continue to.

 

[Jake of Bass]

My music teacher in grade 12 summarised it as: "Music is organised/arranged sound."

 

[SmilinBassPlaya]

Look...Don't learn things you'll never use....don't practice things you'll never play....if you want to learn Theory, study the C Scale. Look.............Did all the Blues Greats know all the theory when they played such great things....? My free course is coming out that is specifically designed to teach exactly what is needed....My video camera is being fixed right now...but it will help you a lot. Its all going to be on video at my website.

 

[Fergie Fulton]

Look...Don't learn things you'll never use....don't practice things you'll never play....if you want to learn Theory, study the C Scale. Look.............Did all the Blues Greats know all the theory when they played such great things....? My free course is coming out that is specifically designed to teach exactly what is needed....My video camera is being fixed right now...but it will help you a lot. Its all going to be on video at my website.

How do you learn things you'll never use and practise things you'll never play?

Thats ignorance and a bad excuse not to have an understanding of anything.
If you have never learnt it or practiced it, how can you use it?

Old time blues men never had the need because the technology was not there, modern blues men do. Do you think when you listen to a recording of Charlie Patton thats how he would sound if you were sat in the room with him?

Your only hearing the limitations of the technology, a bit like the limitation of not having an understanding of music or music theory.
If he could Patton would have had his music on CD and DVD for all to listen to and watch.

 

[E2daGGurl]

My grandmother (born in 1887) played in a folk/pop saloon and dance band from around 1907 to 1940. She traveled with her band and played guitar, keyboard and fiddle. She may not have "known theory" but she sure knew about roots, intervals, harmony, major and minor scales, chords, theories of key, transposition and resolution. First thing she taught anyone on the piano was to chord in I IV, V and VI, and it's clear she knew much about the circle of fifths, although I'm sure she had never seen it diagrammed. It's true they played mostly in C, but she expected us grandkids to be able to transpose to G, D and F if need be for the singer. She didn't have names for these things, she just illustrated it. She and her brother both knew all this, as did all the people she played with - who were people from all over the place. Of course she knew the structure and names of chords, and eventually she married a man (from Germany) who read music and thought she never learned to read it, he taught her the key signatures and stuff that she knew, but didn't know the names for (she knew the names of the notes - her own family taught her that).

She could still play keyboard (they used the piano as the baseline and for rhythm chords) after she went deaf (possibly from loud music for decades), and lived to be 96 years old.

She was really cool and kept up with "new" music all the way through the fifties. She heard anything on the radio and could play - the woman could hear intervals right away, so boogie woogie and early rock came naturally to her.

Oh, and she played harmonica too.

 

[Fergie Fulton]

My grandmother (born in 1887) played in a folk/pop saloon and dance band from around 1907 to 1940. She traveled with her band and played guitar, keyboard and fiddle. She may not have "known theory" but she sure knew about roots, intervals, harmony, major and minor scales, chords, theories of key, transposition and resolution. First thing she taught anyone on the piano was to chord in I IV, V and VI, and it's clear she knew much about the circle of fifths, although I'm sure she had never seen it diagrammed. It's true they played mostly in C, but she expected us grandkids to be able to transpose to G, D and F if need be for the singer. She didn't have names for these things, she just illustrated it. She and her brother both knew all this, as did all the people she played with - who were people from all over the place. Of course she knew the structure and names of chords, and eventually she married a man (from Germany) who read music and thought she never learned to read it, he taught her the key signatures and stuff that she knew, but didn't know the names for (she knew the names of the notes - her own family taught her that).

She could still play keyboard (they used the piano as the baseline and for rhythm chords) after she went deaf (possibly from loud music for decades), and lived to be 96 years old.

She was really cool and kept up with "new" music all the way through the fifties. She heard anything on the radio and could play - the woman could hear intervals right away, so boogie woogie and early rock came naturally to her.

Oh, and she played harmonica too.

Great story, shows the beauty of music, i think as you say she knew her theory, not as a written form, but she knew it. Sounds like she would have been a cool person to have known