Curious, I always thought DI output were usually mic level :
DI Basics - Radial Engineering
What DIs do you have ?
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API TranZformer Bass Preamp
- Thread starter father of fires
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DI Basics - Radial Engineering
What DIs do you have ?
I don't think this pedal is trying to be a Direct Box in the traditional sense, but rather, a preamp pedal with a balanced Line level output. It seems to me that in order to guarantee you're covered in the event you need to interface with a mixing console that doesn't have ample input pad/attenuation, you'd need to carry a (high quality) DI box (and use the 1/4" output) or in-line XLR attenuator (using the XLR output).
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carsonchilders
Carson Childers
Correct. But it is trying to be a Swiss army knife, not just a DI box.
I used it live more than in the studio. It got annoying to explain to the FOH guys to pad my signal every show. It was fine, but it's just weird to have that conversation sometimes even when they want to argue with you. Until you blow their ears out because the gain level is insane.
At some point, when adding pedals in front of it, it began to have a loud pop when I would switch on any pedals in front of the unit. That includes a tuner. I really wish it had an effects loop so it could be used with effects and as a hub for your board.
I used it live more than in the studio. It got annoying to explain to the FOH guys to pad my signal every show. It was fine, but it's just weird to have that conversation sometimes even when they want to argue with you. Until you blow their ears out because the gain level is insane.
At some point, when adding pedals in front of it, it began to have a loud pop when I would switch on any pedals in front of the unit. That includes a tuner. I really wish it had an effects loop so it could be used with effects and as a hub for your board.
I would use it after the effects. I use compression last. Some use it first but I find it harder to get a clean sound at least the way I use the pedals. Plus the DI will act post after effects. So the house gets it. I know there are other ways of doing it but I just find it easier. But all in all, it works good live? Not that I would not use it in the studio.
carsonchilders
Carson Childers
what I’m saying is that it did not work out well for me being last in my chain, after effects. A large popping sound developed from amplifying the clicking of true bypass pedals.
Sorry I had it the other way around. That's weird. That's not good. I use a pedal looper. So each pedal has its own switch so I am not running one to the other. But it still might be the same with the popping. Shame I really got an itch to buy it.
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Such an interesting pedal. If Summit, or Manley, or Avalon made something like this, at a similar price point, I would have to get one of those as well.
Having said that, the gigantic size and power requirements keep me from putting my API on a pedalboard. So I never ran into the issue with other pedals causing popping sounds. And, even though I really like the sound of the API I have so much other great gear that I have only brought it to the studio a few times. Might be time to use it on some upcoming recordings...
Having said that, the gigantic size and power requirements keep me from putting my API on a pedalboard. So I never ran into the issue with other pedals causing popping sounds. And, even though I really like the sound of the API I have so much other great gear that I have only brought it to the studio a few times. Might be time to use it on some upcoming recordings...
I think the price point is the issue - a API channel strip (mic pre/DI, eq, compressor) is $2900, a manley tube channel strip is $4500, and a neve channel strip is $3500. a bass preamp pedal doesn't need mic pre's or tubes, but it has to be a really strong pedal to get alot of sales if its >$500. and - if its that cheap how many sales of their high end gear would they lose?
I'd love to get a API lunchbox as a preamp:
6 slot lunchbox: $ 665
api 550a eq: $1135
api 505 DI: $565
api 525 comp: $1230
tot: $3595
be interesting to hear the difference between the tranzformer and that rig.
Wall I have not heard your Lunch Box configuration but I don't think the Tranzformer will compete. I am getting one soon. Tranzformer LX is what I meant.
API Tranzformer has a balanced line level output, which you could go line level input into a USB audio interface, or line level into a 1176, then the USB interface. Seems like an API lunchbox in a pedal form, which I like a lot. It's good that it's got a phase switch, just incase you mic an amp and there's some phasing problems.
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Why wouldn't it? It's got the same transformer. The same discreet (famous) opamp, the same inductors for the EQ, and made by the same company so they know what they're doing. those are three critical spots where the tone comes from I would think for an API channel strip
I have the API tranzformer LX and really love it. Its well worth every penny to me. But what I meant about the lunch box is its a 10 , 8 or six slots for the API 500 series modules. Now Im not taking away the LX but its a one knob type 527 comp. A strip down 550A eq. A great pedal and I love it, but its hard to compare the two regarding the lunch box and what you can do with it.
Well the compressor needs to be compared to an API 525 not a 527.....
The 525 itself is not the most flexible unit in the world. It also is peak detecting, not RMS like a 527.... It has a fixed attack time, and 4 release times set in a binary fashion via two pushbuttons. It has 2:1 or 20:1 ratios only and it is a bit quirky in how you set the gain/threshold. I would assume the Tranzformer uses the "gain" as the input knob, and that the rotary selector sort of acts like the "less-more" selector on the 525 but also possibly changes the ratio at some point to limit mode. One of the other innovations in the 525 was the auto make-up gain ..so I would assume that is put to use here. Again, the 525's features are probably represented well here....as we know it's bass coming in, we can select an appropriate release time and leave that alone, set the input (threshold) level, and add less or more.... Not really too different.
Also....the EQ on the Tranzformer is inductive like an API 553 not a 550A. The 550A is all RC filters, no inductors and that's
how they do the cute proportional Q on the 550A/B. The resonances (gain) of the filters is altered at each gain step to be wide at low boost/cut and narrower at high boost/cut...It's also important to note that the 553 was a budget type EQ with 3 fixed frequencies. It would be like 80hz, and 12k low and high bands with a reported 3K mid frequency. That's not as useful on bass as what is included in the Tranzformer's frequency selections. So in that instance there is no equivalent, and this is something unique..
As for having all the modules in a lunchbox...I don't know that it's totally comparable. Aside from the EQ topology, the addition of more 2520 opamps and transformers would color the sound more, but that isn't always a good thing. The line level output to me is a bonus ...Why would you take a signal that is 1.228V (line) and reduce it down to 30mV (mic) so is has to be amplified again .. by the crappy IC opamp in the FOH console????
Just take it for what it is....A great preamp built well, with a nice pedigree that costs less than a fifth of what it would take in modules to achieve...and there's some rare earth in there too....A bipolar (non fet) transistor opamp that gives a 500K input Z suitable for passive guitar and bass pickups. That is not a something easy to find actually....most BJTs opamps won't exceed 100Kohms.
The 525 itself is not the most flexible unit in the world. It also is peak detecting, not RMS like a 527.... It has a fixed attack time, and 4 release times set in a binary fashion via two pushbuttons. It has 2:1 or 20:1 ratios only and it is a bit quirky in how you set the gain/threshold. I would assume the Tranzformer uses the "gain" as the input knob, and that the rotary selector sort of acts like the "less-more" selector on the 525 but also possibly changes the ratio at some point to limit mode. One of the other innovations in the 525 was the auto make-up gain ..so I would assume that is put to use here. Again, the 525's features are probably represented well here....as we know it's bass coming in, we can select an appropriate release time and leave that alone, set the input (threshold) level, and add less or more.... Not really too different.
Also....the EQ on the Tranzformer is inductive like an API 553 not a 550A. The 550A is all RC filters, no inductors and that's
how they do the cute proportional Q on the 550A/B. The resonances (gain) of the filters is altered at each gain step to be wide at low boost/cut and narrower at high boost/cut...It's also important to note that the 553 was a budget type EQ with 3 fixed frequencies. It would be like 80hz, and 12k low and high bands with a reported 3K mid frequency. That's not as useful on bass as what is included in the Tranzformer's frequency selections. So in that instance there is no equivalent, and this is something unique..
As for having all the modules in a lunchbox...I don't know that it's totally comparable. Aside from the EQ topology, the addition of more 2520 opamps and transformers would color the sound more, but that isn't always a good thing. The line level output to me is a bonus ...Why would you take a signal that is 1.228V (line) and reduce it down to 30mV (mic) so is has to be amplified again .. by the crappy IC opamp in the FOH console????
Just take it for what it is....A great preamp built well, with a nice pedigree that costs less than a fifth of what it would take in modules to achieve...and there's some rare earth in there too....A bipolar (non fet) transistor opamp that gives a 500K input Z suitable for passive guitar and bass pickups. That is not a something easy to find actually....most BJTs opamps won't exceed 100Kohms.
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But if I was going to do it modularly...I would have a 505DI into a 527 comp, then into a 550A EQ (make this switchable in/out)...then a line splitter....one line to FOH, the other into a 560 graphic (as cabinet EQ) then into a power amp. Looks like I need one of those old 4 slot lunchboxes.
Or just a Tranzformer to line splitter to FOH and 560 to power amp....and the EQ is already switchable
Or just a Tranzformer to line splitter to FOH and 560 to power amp....and the EQ is already switchable
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Hi All,
Since we are all confined at home, I am spending much of my free time recording. Currently I am using an Avalon U5 (remarkable piece of equipment). I have a few different basses stringed with flat wound strings and I like experimenting with different preamps. I am wondering how the API Tranzformer would behave with those basses. My understanding is that the API signature sound is more direct, "in the face" so to say. I ask this because so far, I have not yet found a good coupling between the flatwound stringed basses and the Avalon (perhaps is just me). Many thanks in advance!
Since we are all confined at home, I am spending much of my free time recording. Currently I am using an Avalon U5 (remarkable piece of equipment). I have a few different basses stringed with flat wound strings and I like experimenting with different preamps. I am wondering how the API Tranzformer would behave with those basses. My understanding is that the API signature sound is more direct, "in the face" so to say. I ask this because so far, I have not yet found a good coupling between the flatwound stringed basses and the Avalon (perhaps is just me). Many thanks in advance!
the U5 is a great sounding DI, but def has more of a extended-low end "hifi" kind of sound that works great in some genre's but not necessarily for a vintage flatwound kind of sound. If you can find a Rupert Neve RDI and can deal with only powering it with phantom power that is a very quiet great sounding neutral DI. The API is more in your face and has a great EQ, but the DI is line level not mic level, and is not the easiest thing to deal with. for that kind of $$ you may want to look at some of the tube bass preamps that have a DI out, or the excellent Effectrod LA-1A compressor (that has a transformer base DI output as well, and sounds amazing - i just got one and am blown away). good luck!
Never heard the API but own the Neve RNDI. I wouldn't call it neutral. It has that transformer sound. At home and for recording purposes, I use mostly an UA 610 MKII (tube preamp and optic comp) and a combination of a WA tonebeast preamp, WA76 comp, a Klark LA2A comp and a WA EQP. I'm still curious about the API, 'cause I wouldn't use above mentioned gear live. Live I use a Cali76 comp and just my amp. But I am satisfied so far.
I think you don't do the API justice. In all fairness, it is a kind of channel strip, not just a DI. It is transformer based and offers a preamp, an EQ and a compressor in pedal format. Line level shouldn't be a problem or did you ever find yourself in a situation, where the PA guy told you that they don't have any line level inputs left on their mixer?
But how often do amateurs don't get that a DI box has a mic level output? This might have led to the decision to make it line level. Nothing wrong with that.
@iPinkFender
I have flats on nearly all of my P and J basses. I only play roundwounds on sundays or when I'm drunk
.For me part of the game are your fingers or plectrum and to dial the tone back on passive Fenders and - on a Jazz - to never use both pickups at full volume AND dial the tone back. I've found that preamps are important but overrated. My experience: when I bought the WA76 comp, for the first time in my bass playing live I felt like I sound like I want to sound, like "on a record". The second most important gear was the cheap copy of a LA2A comp from Klark Teknik.
The "classic" bass recording chain is a fast 1176 like comp followed by a slow LA2A like optic comp. In my(!) experience, the impact of these comps is far more important than preamps or DIs.
It is hard for me - to be honest - to hear the differences between different preamps and DIs, but: after owning a lot of cheap comps, esp. pedals - it is not hard for me at all to hear the difference between a quality 1176 comp or a LA2a - and most pedals offered. The Cali76 - as a pedal - was a mindchanger for me, too. Sold all my other pedal-compressors after buying it and use it on every gig since years.
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Thank you both for your replies and comments. This is indeed very interesting for me.
@thumbslapper: regarding the Effectrode pedals, I have a few including the PC-2A. This is "just" a compressor but it is wonderful (Phil Taylor is really a genius) when I use it on tracks where I do not expect having fast transients. Otherwise, normally I'd prefer the Cali76 Bass. Regarding the issue with having just line level output: is this for you a shortcoming because you wish to send the output from the D.I. to a mic preamp? Otherwise I don't get it why this is a problem (I am surely missing something here). The Avalon U5 has both line and mic level output, but so far I have always gone from the Line level output straight into the Audio interface (Apogee Duet 2).
I appreciate your suggestion to consider also Tube Driven preamp/D.I. I actually have an Alembic F-2B which is great live, but difficult to nail in studio (again, it can be just me). It has no balance output and I normally use it in the effect loop of a Glockenklang Soul II. The result is very full, with a distinct timbre. The reason behind the API is to explore a different tonal palette, which I could use in conjunction with the amp.
@DirkP: Indeed, I play always we the tone knob a bit closed on both P and Jazz. I love soloing the bridge pickup on the jazz (having split coils, noise is not an issue).
The UA channel strips (610 and 6176) seems indeed a valuable option for my use. One question: why the 610 and not the 6176? The latter seems to me a bit more flexible (and also more expensive). I am normally recording old style stuff, so it might turn out that an all tube channel strip like the UA610 would be perfectly suited for my needs. I shall investigate more.
@thumbslapper: regarding the Effectrode pedals, I have a few including the PC-2A. This is "just" a compressor but it is wonderful (Phil Taylor is really a genius) when I use it on tracks where I do not expect having fast transients. Otherwise, normally I'd prefer the Cali76 Bass. Regarding the issue with having just line level output: is this for you a shortcoming because you wish to send the output from the D.I. to a mic preamp? Otherwise I don't get it why this is a problem (I am surely missing something here). The Avalon U5 has both line and mic level output, but so far I have always gone from the Line level output straight into the Audio interface (Apogee Duet 2).
I appreciate your suggestion to consider also Tube Driven preamp/D.I. I actually have an Alembic F-2B which is great live, but difficult to nail in studio (again, it can be just me). It has no balance output and I normally use it in the effect loop of a Glockenklang Soul II. The result is very full, with a distinct timbre. The reason behind the API is to explore a different tonal palette, which I could use in conjunction with the amp.
@DirkP: Indeed, I play always we the tone knob a bit closed on both P and Jazz. I love soloing the bridge pickup on the jazz (having split coils, noise is not an issue).
The UA channel strips (610 and 6176) seems indeed a valuable option for my use. One question: why the 610 and not the 6176? The latter seems to me a bit more flexible (and also more expensive). I am normally recording old style stuff, so it might turn out that an all tube channel strip like the UA610 would be perfectly suited for my needs. I shall investigate more.
