Are bass amps obsolete?

[Steve Dallman]

ozzy too. he totally admitted to having a singer offstage.

I can see why. He doesn't have a singer onstage.

 

[FenixBloodstone]

Bass amps are not simply about convenience and/or practicality (or the lack thereof) for many of us.

I simply enjoy hearing myself through speakers. When I can, I will bring an amp. If I can get away with it, I'll bring an Ampeg SVT. The sound of that heavy beast makes me smile.

They absolutely will be less common in a decade or so. We'll probably all have wireless basses with transmitters you can't see that send a signal directly to the computer used to run sound (that is the size of a pack of gum). Every audience member will be wearing headphones (tiny earbuds) that allow them to control the volume of their live band. Take out your earbuds and all you will hear are people talking and the sound of sticks hitting electronic drums pads. Your average bar will sound like a library until you put in earbuds.

So, not yet... but it's coming.

This will be a crappy way of enjoying music. I mean if you are talking about no talent style of music like hip-hop rap and modern country who cares but rock and metal is meant to be felt and heard and the showmanship of the band in a live performance is all part of the SHOW! I think it would be lame and down right stupid if this is where music went. Now I still use a full rig and they are not fake. Now I miss the showmanship of stacks "even if they were empty" and mass bass rig and full drumsets a show. Its not a show if robots are just playing for headphones and ppl that want to visit while at a show to just take headphones out to tune out and have drinks. Live shows are about the band and the music. So to answer you yes bass amps are taking a back seat but not in this bass players time I want to move air not signals.

 

[Loring]

The cabinets that can give you great bottom in a little cabinet are inherently not efficient. That is when you need a 1,000 Watt amplifier. You won't be louder, just won't break your back carrying a"furniture" cabinet. I would like a rig like this but half the bars I've played have very old power wiring so didn't go for the 1 KW amp.

Try the genzler stuff. Efficient light and great lows...

 

[two fingers]

This will be a crappy way of enjoying music. I mean if you are talking about no talent style of music like hip-hop rap and modern country who cares but rock and metal is meant to be felt and heard and the showmanship of the band in a live performance is all part of the SHOW! I think it would be lame and down right stupid if this is where music went. Now I still use a full rig and they are not fake. Now I miss the showmanship of stacks "even if they were empty" and mass bass rig and full drumsets a show. Its not a show if robots are just playing for headphones and ppl that want to visit while at a show to just take headphones out to tune out and have drinks. Live shows are about the band and the music. So to answer you yes bass amps are taking a back seat but not in this bass players time I want to move air not signals.

I agree with you. The picture I painted won't work for every genre, or crowd. I'm not FOR the scenario I described. I just see it coming.

I'm sure metal fans feel the same way as metal musicians.

Here's my question for you. Musical styles come and go. As amps become less and less relevant, will metal follow suit? If mainstream music venues go high-tech, will a "proper" metal show with amps and speakers just become sort of "a hassle"?

(I am not anti metal. This is just an interesting discussion of technology and how it affects trends. None of us really know what's coming.)

 

[JimmyM]

I agree with you. The picture I painted won't work for every genre, or crowd. I'm not FOR the scenario I described. I just see it coming.

I'm sure metal fans feel the same way as metal musicians.

Here's my question for you. Musical styles come and go. As amps become less and less relevant, will metal follow suit? If mainstream music venues go high-tech, will a "proper" metal show with amps and speakers just become sort of "a hassle"?

(I am not anti metal. This is just an interesting discussion of technology and how it affects trends. None of us really know what's coming.)

Metal has its share of bands who play ampless.

 

[chadds]

Since Bass amps are in essence just a clean PA amp packaged to be for a bass player by virtue yes... But I'm certain since they are so similar that also no... As long as we use loudspeakers we have bass amps. Guitar amps and speaker cabinets however.. Inefficient giant things... It's just easier to integrate a clean bass into the mix somebody is always gonna be chasing tone and use an amp and cabinet. It just might be lesser... I use 2 amps with my bass. The little one does a cool effect when the big ones turned off... Phantom 2nd speaker. Yeah. Proximity effect it seems like I have them both on at times

It is obvious here on TB that many bassists don’t prefer a repackaged PA as a bass amp. Orange? SVT? Etc. Yeah tone from bass, Pre, amp and cab is part of some bassist’s signature tone. We are all free to use what the gig requires but don’t say one way is the highway.

How does that DI to IEM distort if you dig in and get clean when you back off? Can you do anything dynamically and the system delivers? I know my amps will. I’ve met those we will put it all through the PA people and they tend to care less about the sound than the efficiency of production. If it’s convient and pays go for it. Just don’t say it’s the same as your best expressive playing through an amp.

Ever notice how two different pianists sound completely different on the same Steinway same stage same night? Because they are masters at timing the blends of the notes as they cascade off each other. Look ma, no tone controls, limiters etc. As a bassist you can give that away to sound guy or not. The collision of the notes of your group is part of the reason people come to hear you. The waves you set up with your drummer, guitarists, singer(s) etc. make harmonic interest.

 

[two fingers]

Metal has its share of bands who play ampless.

I would bet you they won't go "PA-less" or "speakerless" like the scenario I described early in the thread. I agree with the guy. That'll never work for loud rock.

 

[JimmyM]

I would bet you they won't go "PA-less" or "speakerless" like the scenario I described early in the thread. I agree with the guy. That'll never work for loud rock.

I couldn't deal with it for anything!

 

[Paragon3]

It is obvious here on TB that many bassists don’t prefer a repackaged PA as a bass amp. Orange? SVT? Etc. Yeah tone from bass, Pre, amp and cab is part of some bassist’s signature tone. We are all free to use what the gig requires but don’t say one way is the highway.

How does that DI to IEM distort if you dig in and get clean when you back off? Can you do anything dynamically and the system delivers? I know my amps will. I’ve met those we will put it all through the PA people and they tend to care less about the sound than the efficiency of production. If it’s convient and pays go for it. Just don’t say it’s the same as your best expressive playing through an amp.

Ever notice how two different pianists sound completely different on the same Steinway same stage same night? Because they are masters at timing the blends of the notes as they cascade off each other. Look ma, no tone controls, limiters etc. As a bassist you can give that away to sound guy or not. The collision of the notes of your group is part of the reason people come to hear you. The waves you set up with your drummer, guitarists, singer(s) etc. make harmonic interest.

Well you're pretty clearly not catching what I'm saying at all. But you made all excellent points. Look it up dude... Bass amps are essentially just clean amps and cabinets not meant to colour the sound... If your tone stack is using distortion or some other effect cool. I'm down with that. Royal blood style with octaver up and a guitar amp and a bunch of volume pedals and switches. Even better.. But in essense.. And the reason many people just record DI into there DAW at home etc is because often the Bass tone is just how your bass sounds in your hands and not so much your rig.

 

[two fingers]

I couldn't deal with it for anything!

We'll be totally retired from the biz before it really catches on, my friend.

 

[Stub Mandrel]

My wee Orange practice amp sounds better than my big laney with all its eq through a stack.

I'd be happy with it miked up through the PA, but no swine is going to DI me if I can help it

Now a SVT, taht wpould be fun

 

[Seano76]

The next guitar player who tells me I should just plug a glorified distortion pedal into the PA is going get a talking to. I don't see them leaving their Marshalls at home in lieu of a POD.

 

[JimmyM]

Well you're pretty clearly not catching what I'm saying at all. But you made all excellent points. Look it up dude... Bass amps are essentially just clean amps and cabinets not meant to colour the sound...

Some are but most definitely are not. Even when I'm playing with a clean tone, I absolutely hate that plain SS tone, and I am by far not alone. Andy from Mesa and Genz Benz was just saying how he and most designers aren't concerned about thd levels at 3% because the vast majority of bassists don't really want super clean cleans, and I find that to be true even if they say they do.

And I don't know how many times a bassist has told me they like their amps set with the knobs at noon because it's flat and transparent response, when nothing could be farther from the truth.

 

[Jimmy Dilly]

Bass amps are not simply about convenience and/or practicality (or the lack thereof) for many of us.

I simply enjoy hearing myself through speakers. When I can, I will bring an amp. If I can get away with it, I'll bring an Ampeg SVT. The sound of that heavy beast makes me smile.

They absolutely will be less common in a decade or so. We'll probably all have wireless basses with transmitters you can't see that send a signal directly to the computer used to run sound (that is the size of a pack of gum). Every audience member will be wearing headphones (tiny earbuds) that allow them to control the volume of their live band. Take out your earbuds and all you will hear are people talking and the sound of sticks hitting electronic drums pads. Your average bar will sound like a library until you put in earbuds.

So, not yet... but it's coming.

If I can't use the SVT. Mark bass / 2-10s plus Ampeg pedal works in small gig. But my SVT MAKES LIFE BETTER.

 

[Paragon3]

Some are but most definitely are not. Even when I'm playing with a clean tone, I absolutely hate that plain SS tone, and I am by far not alone. Andy from Mesa and Genz Benz was just saying how he and most designers aren't concerned about thd levels at 3% because the vast majority of bassists don't really want super clean cleans, and I find that to be true even if they say they do.

So you too hey... I get it. I'm not arguing nor did I say whatever you two seem to think I said... But essentially bass amps are clean uncoloured PA style amp and cabinets. Beyond that your personal taste and flavour comes in. You add even more scope to the last guys comment. Both pointing out quite well that there is almost not way the Bass Amp and Cabinet will disappear.

I use two amps as well. One has a warm if not almost soft muted tone for upper frequencies and a rather clanky little practice amp. I rather love the strange way they work together in the overlap.. Many would simply call them both junk. Which.. Yeah probably right. But it's my junk and I like it. I still want a monitor speaker that I can plug a mic into and I'll still be accepting PA support. "My TONE" would likely never get that defined to be that way. Kind of jealous and worried at the same time of anybody who does .

 

[Bredian]

Using a Carvin BX700 w GenzBenz210 vented. Great repro on stage and small venues, DI'd into our PA.

The issue is getting the PA to replicate the tones and or even a straight DI due to factory bass input presets. We've been working around by starting with "piano" presets and changing from there. Seems like most bass presets were contrived when gear was weak and Fender had foam mutes on the strings. I've been to one too many gigs where the bass was clear from the stage, mush from the PA, so I now go out FOH to check and adjust if I have a cooperative sound guy. I can always make it sound mushy if I want.

I'm an IEM refuge, as we lost too much feel and dynamics.

 

[JimmyM]

So you too hey... I get it. I'm not arguing nor did I say whatever you two seem to think I said... But essentially bass amps are clean uncoloured PA style amp and cabinets. Beyond that your personal taste and flavour comes in. You add even more scope to the last guys comment. Both pointing out quite well that there is almost not way the Bass Amp and Cabinet will disappear.

I use two amps as well. One has a warm if not almost soft muted tone for upper frequencies and a rather clanky little practice amp. I rather love the strange way they work together in the overlap.. Many would simply call them both junk. Which.. Yeah probably right. But it's my junk and I like it. I still want a monitor speaker that I can plug a mic into and I'll still be accepting PA support. "My TONE" would likely never get that defined to be that way. Kind of jealous and worried at the same time of anybody who does .

You are right to be jealous I tried giving into that train of thought 20 years ago but was never happy with what came out of the PA unless it had at least a little hair. Thanks to micromanaging my signal, I am a million times happier with my foh sound and so are most people I work with.

 

[800RB from Aus]

Having a quality personal monitor helps me give a good performance. I see no contradiction here.

 

[Joe Sockit]

Bring your own PA. It’s never been cheaper, better, and easier to run it yourself. Get your sound every time, under your control.

I'm a musician for 40 years, own a sound company so I'm on both sides. There are lots of tricks to control stage volume except the drummer. Shields work but they hate them, tilted panels are great fro the Marshall heads & 4x12's, plexiglass at a 45 degree angle blows it right at the player and save the people out front. Bass wash can be a problem, Sometimes I have to high pass it in the PA or it's mush. The hardest gigs are the 100-200 capacity bars with the screeching rock band. It's Kick and vocals only for those dudes. Yeah you can bring /buy your own PA cheap but if you don't know how to run it, you'll suck, only louder.

 

[Paragon3]

You are right to be jealous I tried giving into that train of thought 20 years ago but was never happy with what came out of the PA unless it had at least a little hair. Thanks to micromanaging my signal, I am a million times happier with my foh sound and so are most people I work with.

HELL YEAH!!! I'd be very interested to have somebody like you fiddle with my junk.. Lol. Bass rig. I know for a fact you'd tell me to buy something else afterwards when in reality I need to catch up still with my gear.

[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

that Washburn has the low and loud compression thing but it's crap.. Under $200 for everything I use for this..