Are scooped mids always bad?

[pitris]

Hello,
first things first,so i am sorry if this is wrong section of the forum, but i decided that this topic does not belong to any specific topic so i put it here.

So to my question: is some mid scoop bad? In almost every discussion about tone, most advices are "dont scoop the mids, boost them". So when i decided i want to try to record some riffs, i recorded my bass and guitars, both DI tracks.

Rhythm guitars had overdrive pedal used as boost into amp sim into speaker impulse response loader on them, one track left, one track right. I high passed them at 150 hz if i remember correctly, and used multiband compression to tame palm mutes. On amp sim i pretty much only boosted high mids and treble a little.

Lead guitar had same overdrive and amp sim, different cab impulse response, and was little more midrangy than rhythm and i used a little reverb.

Then i tried some tube amp sim on bass and EQed it with boosted midrange, and it just didnt worked. It sounded like guitar and bass was fighting for space or something. I tried to EQ it with boosted low mids, then high mids.

After this i tried Sansamp bddi simulation (and as far as i know bddi scoop the mids). I didnt even changed the settings that much from "flat", only boosted treble a little, and it sounded imho much better. Low end was actually decent, and attack cutted through guitars, sound was overall better as far as i can tell.

So, is it possible that mid scoop is sometimes better then boosted mids, or it is my mixing inexperience and i just overboosted some mid frequency or something?

(I play metal btw)

 

[lz4005]

Sometimes cutting mids is the right thing to do in a mix. Sometimes it's not.
Depends on what the other instruments are and what part of the sonic spectrum they're occupying.

 

[Gaolee]

Mid scoop is just a tool. Don't use a hammer when you need a screwdriver. That's all.

 

[Misfit]

I prefer the highs and lows, so it's not bad in every situation.

 

[AngelCrusher]

Always is usually a bad word in music studios. I know some very successful metal producers who scoop the mids on the bass. But its really on a per record basis. Some bands have much more mids in their bass and its amazing. You have to make a choice on what kind of sound you are going for.

Also, i would strongly suggest using some dirt to add grind to the bass tone instead of boosting too much treble.

 

[MYLOWFREQ]

No.

 

[bridgecables]

You are correct... they were fighting for space. You solved it correctly too. Now they compliment the frequencies that are missing from the other, so that when playing in unison they dominate the spectrum.

Some metal is all about the bass and rhythm guitar functioning as one massive instrument. Delicious.

 

[hrodbert696]

As others have said, never say never. It depends on what everyone else is doing and where you want the bass in the mix. Mids add clarity and definition. If you want the bass to stand out and be audible as a distinct voice on the mix, you probably want fairly strong (not necessarily cranked) mids. If everyone else is staying out of the way in a fairly sparse arrangement (e.g. guitars just playing some light, high, clean comping) then a scooped bass can sound excellent. Or if you want the bass in unison with the guitar as a deep rumble under it without jumping out as a separate voice, scooping the mids can be good.

 

[JohnMCA72]

Personally, I think that using ones eyes instead of ears to EQ sound is as close to "always bad" as anything.

 

[DirkP]

It got a bad reputation because it was so overdone by many bass-players. It is the easiest way to make someone sound good - on its own - 'cause mids cause a lot of problems if not done right. But as some posters before, I'd say there is no right and wrong, it depends on what you want.

 

[ddnidd1]

Generally avoiding scooped mids is in context of a live band situation.

You mentioned you panned the guitars left and right. Not happening in a live situation.

Pan it all to the middle and the bass will most likely lose some of its presence in the mix.

 

[Mushroo]

Mid scoop is one of the most common and popular ways of all time to EQ a bass guitar. You have my permission to scoop your mids, if it sounds good to you.

 

[tfer]

There is no right or wrong. Serve the song.

 

[Coolhandjjl]

It got a bad reputation because it was so overdone by many bass-players. It is the easiest way to make someone sound good - on its own - 'cause mids cause a lot of problems if not done right. But as some posters before, I'd say there is no right and wrong, it depends on what you want.

Mids done wrong sound ganky and honky.